Michael Newdow preparing for changes??

I feel that the Pledge of Allegiance is not a scared text -- but it's only a writer's poetic idea. Whether or not it has the phrase "under God" within it doesn't faze me. However, the fact is that we live in a democracy and there are some decent Americans who happen to be Atheists. If by having the phrase 'under God' in the Pledge, this ignores the rights and the (non-)beliefs of these people, then the pledge doesn't serve them. If you keep the pledge without the phrase, then the Deists can add the phrase 'Under God' as they recite it, if they so choose. Pledges of Allegiance as well as flags are just symbols and as such don't force people to believe in their hearts one way or the other.

Hi Ragman~

Do you feel that it should be removed from schools as a part of the issue? If I am not mistaken, he (Mr. Newdow) is trying to do this too.

I have deist beliefs, and feel that it was wrong to change currency from E Pluribus Unum to In God We Trust. And I didn't realize that the Pledge had been altered either.
I did a little research on the Pledge and found that President Harrison introduced the Pledge into public schools during Columbus Day observations... and eventually it became used in the schools on a daily basis.

I don't love the idea of pledging allegiance - but I think it serves a purpose for those who can't handle the responsibility of egoism. That said, if you're going to have it, and use it to keep the simple-minds on the right team then "under God" is a bad idea all around. Give 'em something magical and there's no chance of normal behavior...

how about "one nation under the influence"... :wink:

Perhaps if we were to treat religion as we do drinking of intoxicating liquor.. not being able to imbibe till you are old enough to use it sensibly.
Meaning it's unavailable until your old enough to make up your own mind if you want it or not.. of course the religious of us that are already indoctrinated, wouldn't agree unless it was theirs that had to only right to do so... and we can see what happens then, I'm sure you know the countries that are ruled by their religion and how well their religious leaders keep this idea pure.

I don't think the phrase belongs in a government text, regardless of the generality of the word "God," particularly because it was put in there for all the wrong reasons (Eisenhower trying to distinguish us from the "godlessness" of Communist Russia). It is symptomatic of the stranglehold that patriarchal, Judeo-Christian culture has on our civilization, to be negative about it...

I totally agree. That strangehold is like ivy.. it's seeping in and around and going unnoticed. Sorta like turning our backs on it because it doesn't matter how hard we try to get it under control, it'll just grow back.

While this may seem like a good idea to the un-indoctrinated, I can't see us ever getting to the point where the law tells people what they can/can't teach their children. Some things simply have to be approached through cultural pressure.

I was in high school in 1954 when the pledge was changed. Although my religious views had not really "jelled" at that point in time, I can remember
feeling very uncomfortable about the phrase. I ended up standing quietly and saying nothing when the phrase was recited.

For those who are interested in the history of the Plege, especially the addition of "under God", here's an interesting article:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pledge_of_Allegiance

It is interesting to note that it was the Knights of Columbus who spearheaded the drive to add the words to the pledge.