And now my life has changed in oh so many ways....

Plus meeting and being around other intelligent people, often people from other places, e. g. getting outside of a provincial world and into a wider one.

Oh, Chai, the patient explaining thing? It happens to college grads, too. I work with a PhD linguist, a woman with easily 25+ years under her belt, an incredibly smart specialist, and she was told by a group of linguists we were writing a product for (and they knew she was a linguist), "There are these things called phonemes. They stand for sounds." etc. etc. etc.

So, hey, give 'em back the phonemes explanation. Then they will either listen or think you're nuts.

Oh explanation necessary....

I didn't mean about the being able to take classes. I've done that on and off through the years.

I was thinking you were envious of your sister in the aspect of being idealistic.

Having ideals is one thing, being idealistic is annoying.

Jespah, yeah, I know what you mean too.
I love when someone who's up to their eyeballs w/ student loans wants to tell me how to plan for my retirement.

Well, ya know, I've been doing that for, oh, let's see, longer than you've been around.

Well, you see, it has to do with phonemes.

Sure Jespah

you can phone me anytime.

So glad to read you guys talking like that.

I was gonna say that, and I got discouraged and went away.

The value of all those things seems so demeaned by the whole dominant economical "rationalist" ethos right now, and I am sick of saying those things.

Were they cunning linguists?

Tee hee etsanta.

============

I didn't do the college thing when I left (equivalent) high school. I went right out to work. It wasn't as usual in Ireland when I was younger for kids to go onto college unless they wanted to become a doctor, teacher, etc. I had no idea what I wanted to do - I was really immature at 17 (and for quite a few years after that).

I fell into office-type work and discovered I had an ability for detail, organization and analyzing things. Flitted around for a while before maturing and realizing I had to act more stable. I fell into risk management and insurance by happenstance and discovered an industry that fell over itself to educate me so I took advantage. I have taken so many classes (not necessarily college-degreed-classes) on their buck that I haven't been enticed to move on. It's hard to get the money I'm being paid in another industry especially since I don't have that degree on a piece of paper.

I always thought I was creative but have come to realize I am not. What was enjoyable but childish writing at school was simply a spurt of enthusiasm and not real talent. I would have loved to think I would become a writer - not of serious literary works but of thinksters, stories of interest, something to enchant the reader. Sadly I am afflicted with the disease of short-attention-span and cannot tie myself down to such an intense long-term project as researching, writing, proofing and polishing a written piece.

I can't say I am working at what I learned at school since my education was varied and general in subject. I never had a hugely ambitious streak since my mantra has always been "I work to live, not live to work", although it can't hurt to get some enjoyment at the place where I spend most of my life.

why'd you get discouraged bunny?

I hope it wasn't because of me.

I think it'd be fabulous to have the time, money, etc to study all your life. Just for the pure joy of learning.

I earned two degrees, and went back to college when I was, let's see, about 30 to work on a third. I distinctly remember feeling for the first time that I was being a scholar, as compared to the first go 'round.

My meaning is that the actual prep work done doesn't seem to match up with the person you become.

Life is also a great teacher. Not many of the divine enlightenments I've had occured in a classroom.

No, not you.


Just the overall attitude that there is nothing intrinsically valuable about studies designed to enhance critical thinking and general knowledgs about self and society...and the whole experience of intellectual ferment etc...

You know, the university as fodder for industry, and to hell with other roles.

Engance?

Fixed.


Since when can dogs be pedants?

You smell, not spell.

Cleo does have quite an advanced sniffer.

She can smell turkey broth at 200 paces. Swiss Chalet at half a mile.

She can smell a motel?

Oh, there's definitely an intrinsic value in learning, I think. There's something about being in a classroom and just working on problems of any sort. When I took classes recently (and it was exceptionally hard, although I suspect that had more to do with my age at the time than the subject matter), it did feel good to crack books and try to dope things out.

Intellectual give and take is (usually) not just so much mental masturbation. It's how things are invented, how stories are written, how problems are solved. It's important in and of itself.

The big thing in the program I was in (back in those granola-y 1970's) was Opportunity Identification and Analysis.

(We weren't allowed to use the term problem-solving. Too Death of a Salesman.)

That's the big yes. I developed my critical thinking, was forced to debate formally, learned to identify opportunities - and met people who challenged me, in and out of the classroom. Being challenged, and learning to frame my presentation of my opinions - it was a good thing.

The no? I don't identify plants/birds/bugs for a living.

~~~~~

I started university as an engineering student. Then I went out on a coupla work terms and discovered that engineers invariably (in the 1970's) became managers, and that wasn't for me. Re-tooled my program to Environmental Science - and then because I had a bunch of spare credits, did a double degree with Psychology. Couldn't work on the E.S. side long-term because of health problems. Slid over to the psych side - worked in a vocational rehabilitation facility for close to a decade, doing vocational counselling. Then I slid over a bit further as a result of a couple of government committees I'd been on, and worked as a rehabilitation co-ordinator for a long-term disability carrier for a buncha years. Now it's been about 10 years working in the p and c industry, primarily sorting out services/funding for people with catastrophic injuries - still doing a bit of vocational consulting/resume stuff on the side.

Voc rehab is ALL about identifying opportunities.

~~~~~~~~~

Yes, and no.

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Swiss Chalet ... click .... is a chicken resto franchise up here

Self-education is possible--and laudable--but the unsupervised scholar is prone to cut corners. Sharp minds hone each other.