Should Dems (bypass) Manchin and Sinema and look to Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski instead?

Your math is broken.


You're still going to need Manchin and Sinema to vote to change or eliminate the filibuster.

1. Both Manchin and Sinema have made it clear that they choose not to make any changes to the filibuster rule for voting rights bill. That would put the dems vote for filibuster carve-out to 48, which is two votes short of the 50 votes needed.

2. Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski just might choose to have a filibuster (carve-out) for voting rights bill. The addition of Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski votes would move that number from 48 to 50 votes for the filibuster carve-out.

3. In this hypothetical scenario, there would be 50 votes (for) a filibuster carve-out for the voting rights bill, and 50 votes (against) the filibuster carve-out.

4. Constitutionally, the only time the Vice President of the United States can cast a vote in the Senate is when he or she is casting a tie-breaking vote.

5. The Vice President of the United States is Kamala Harris.

6. In this hypothetical scenario, the tie breaking vote gives the dems a simple majority vote for a filibuster carve-out for voting rights bill.

7. The dems would need the help of two republicans to offset Manchin and Sinema.

8. Should Dems (bypass) Manchin and Sinema and look to Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski instead?

Rachel Maddow reports on the Senate adding raising the debt ceiling to the existing list of exceptions
to the filibuster rule, and wonders why, if it's as simple as that, they have not added an exception
for voting rights.


Published December 11, 2021

1. I suggest that the dems start looking to Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski to modify
the filibuster rule specifically for the voting rights bill.


2. It can't hurt to try.


3. It clearly has been a complete waste of time trying to get Sinema and Manchin to
modify the filibuster rule specifically for the voting rights bill

We have a different system over here, no direct executive elections.

The legislature decide the executive so most governments are a majority or (rarely), a coalition.

That means we don't have a situation where the prime minister represents a different party from the majority of seats in Parliament.

There are two sorts of bills, government bills and private members bills. There is not enough time for everyone to have their own bill so those who do are chosen through a similar system to a lottery.

They have to have a bill they want to debate, and they haven't recently had a bill debated.

These bills can be talked out. Chris Chope infamously talked down a private members' bill banning upskirting, or taking photos up women's skirts without their permission.

Chope never fully explained why he believes such offensive behaviour should be legal, but from now on upskirting is known as Choping.

Government bils are another matter they are debated, but according to a strict timescale, and if debate is still going on, the bill is guillotined, all debate stops and a vote in taken.

Susan Collins? Seriously ... I have concerns.

Really? Overall, I like her.

You haven't been following her. She's voted with Democrats rarely. She has 'concerns' and votes with the GOP. She had 'concerns regarding the impeachment of Trump and voted with the GOP. She's not even a progressive Republican, she's more of a drinking tea with the ladies sort of Congresswoman. She's only voted with us once or twice and only recently.

I'm a progressive Republican and I think less of her than I do Manchin.

1. I don't particular trust or like Susan Collins.

2. I don't particular trust or like Lisa Murkowski.

3. I want to make it clear that I am no fan of either Susan Collins or Lisa Murkowski.

4. All attempts to get Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema to go along with filibuster (carve-out)
for voting rights bill have failed.

5. I suggest the dems to try a different tactic of getting a filibuster (carve-out)
for voting rights bill.

6. Just maybe. Just maybe. It doesn't hurt to try.

7. I suggest that the dems look to Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski to possibly
achieve a filibuster (carve-out) for voting rights.