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Peaceful protests versus violent mobs: A primer

 
 
Real Music
 
  3  
Wed 13 Jan, 2021 10:16 pm

Trump is angry at Ivanka and Jared Kushner after she spoke about going to Biden's inauguration, source tells Insider.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-is-angry-at-ivanka-and-jared-kushner-after-she-spoke-about-going-to-bidens-inauguration-source-tells-insider/ar-BB1cIkKl?ocid=uxbndlbing
0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  3  
Wed 13 Jan, 2021 11:03 pm
@oralloy,
Wrong.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Wed 13 Jan, 2021 11:06 pm
@InfraBlue,
Nope. They are all logical fallacies.
InfraBlue
 
  3  
Thu 14 Jan, 2021 12:55 am
@oralloy,
No they're not.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Thu 14 Jan, 2021 01:07 am
@InfraBlue,
Your ignorance of logic is breathtaking.
Brandon9000
 
  0  
Thu 14 Jan, 2021 10:09 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
If any part of Trump's speech is determined by a court to be

1) intended to cause violence.
2) reasonable expected to cause violence.

Then Trump is guilty of incitement. This is a fact. Do you accept it? It goes both ways. I accept the fact that if neither of these things is true, than Trump is innocent of incitement.

If you don't agree with the facts, then it is silly to go on.

If you accept this, then I will show you what Trump said that might count as incitement.

I would like you to say either "Yes, I agree with these facts" or "No, I don't agree with these facts".


No, I don't agree at all. For speech, specifically protected in the Constitution as a right, to be criminal, there has to be a direct solicitation to imminent violence. If the standard were that you couldn't tell people that their cause is just, they are true patriots, "don't let them get away with it," etc., then half of Washington would be in jail.

I still challenge you to tell me which statements Trump made may be criminal according to your standard. The left specializes in character assassintion by vague suggestions that they cannot and will not state specifically.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Thu 14 Jan, 2021 12:14 pm
@Brandon9000,
Thank you for answering my question directly.

1. We disagree on the basic definition of incitement.

2. You will note that I am arguing against both the extremes. I have said repeatedly that the case for incitement is (in my opinion) not very strong. That isn't to say there is no argument. But it is not a clear case either.

3. I think the argument that it was incitement will be based on certain phrases. The question was whether they were intended or should have been expected to provoke violence. The fact is that they did provide imminent violence (which isn't proof but is relevant).

Quote:
“We’re going to walk down to the Capitol, and we’re going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we’re probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them, because you’ll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength, and you have to be strong.”


Quote:
“We’re going to walk down to the Capitol, and we’re going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we’re probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them, because you’ll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength, and you have to be strong.”


Quote:
We are going to the Capitol, and we are going to try and give — the Democrats are hopeless, they are never voting for anything, not even one vote, but we are going to try — give our Republicans, the weak ones, because the strong ones don’t need any of our help, we’re try — going to try and give them the kind of pride and boldness that they need to take back our country.”

0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  3  
Thu 14 Jan, 2021 12:20 pm
@oralloy,
Your assumptions about my knowledge of ignorance are asinine.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Thu 14 Jan, 2021 12:26 pm
@InfraBlue,
No assumption. You don't even understand what a straw man argument is.
InfraBlue
 
  3  
Thu 14 Jan, 2021 12:29 pm
@oralloy,
Yes, assumption. Yes I do.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Thu 14 Jan, 2021 12:57 pm
@InfraBlue,
Wrong. You are completely ignorant of what a straw man argument is.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  -1  
Thu 14 Jan, 2021 01:37 pm
Two ******* pages of you two arguing about which of you is ignorant. Come on! Let's just all agree that you are both right.

Call me ignorant, I don't give a ship. Geez! Just stop spamming with pages and pages of this crap.
0 Replies
 
 

 
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