If no cheating occurred in the election, why not investigate everything?

Let's look at the facts here.... if any Trump supporter wants to "be logical" they should start with the facts. Again let me explain... if you are going to claim something to be fact, you need to tell me what specific evidence would change your mind.

1. Every State has bipartisan election commissions. And every vote count has representatives from both parties present.

2. Trump's side is investigating these claims. When there is evidence, they take it to court... for example the claim that illegal voters who don't live in Nevada are voting in Nevada went to court.

3. Claims that someone saw a jump on 538 when they hit their refresh ... or on a guy who heard that 3,000 ballots were in the river aren't generally taken seriously unless there is evidence. Anyone Trump supporter can "investigate" by collecting evidence but they can't expect people to take these silly stories seriously until they have real evidence.

4. There is a growing number of Republicans who say there is no evidence of widespread fraud.

5. The people calling fraud are extreme partisans (who were making extremely strong statements about Trump, liberals, communism etc.)

I am a bit disappointed in you Oralloy. This is another opportunity for you to show that you can accept facts that don't fit into your partisan ideological narrative. You aren't doing that.

These are the things that will change my mind.

1. A prestigious, non-partisan group says that after an investigation (without a pre-ordained result) there was widespread fraud in the election.

2. There is a court case alleging wide spread fraud that wins after both sides have the chance to present evidence.

3. There is an actual cache of illegal votes uncovered that has real evidence. This story is picked up by the mainstream media and is accepted as true by people who aren't Trump partisans.

In each of these... it has to be evidence of widespread coordinated fraud to make a difference (stories of a ballot found here, or a person voting in the wrong state there don't matter).

But any of these would cause me to change my mind on this topic.

Outlawing the Democratic Party will put an end to their abuses of the law.

What facts have I rejected?

Start with the five facts I list on the top of this page.

Do you reject these facts?

I'm not paying enough attention to know if #4 is true or false. But no, I don't reject anything that you said.

If I had disagreed with something that you had said, you'd have already seen a post with me quoting whatever statements of yours I disagreed with, followed by my explanation as to why I think the statements are untrue.

I should add, however, that I don't think facts are particularly important in the current climate.

The Democrats had no facts when they relentlessly hounded Mr. Trump with their endless criminal and impeachment investigations.

Why should facts matter when it comes to hounding the Biden Administration with prosecutions for whatever?

If the Democrats had gone to the courts, and then had a widely-respected (and Republican) special counsel appointed. And if, (hypothetically speaking) there was evidence that a foreign country did interfere in our elections. And if this was backed up by our federal intelligence agencies as well.

Completely as a hypothetical enterprise. Would you accept the facts in that case?

I should add... in 2016

1) Hillary Clinton conceded the election and faded into the background.

2) The Democrats collected what they considered to be valid evidence (which included non-biased information from the intelligence community) and presented it to the courts and to an investigator.

If the Republicans want to do the same, I would say "go for it". It starts with Trump admitting he lost the election and going away.

Your claim in #2 is factually incorrect.

The Democrats maliciously fabricated a phony case in order to get an independent prosecutor appointed.

I always accept facts.

You are stating this as a fact. It is not a fact unless it can be tested. If you are going to claim this is a "fact", tell me what evidence would disprove it.

I don't accept this as a fact, it is is partisan propaganda.

I think you are in a circular logic trap. Since "facts" are things you accept, anything you accept is a "fact".

But let's test this.....

Pretty much everyone (except the extreme partisans) from moderate Republicans to the Intelligence agencies to non-partisan analysts all agree on this.

Russia interfered in our election in 2016 in favor of Trump.

Do you accept this fact?

Is acknowledgement of reality circular logic?

At any rate: Interfered in our election, yes.

I do not have enough data to know whether Russia was decisively for Mr. Trump as opposed to just sowing chaos wherever they saw an opportunity.

Yes.



That is incorrect.

However, it is generally possible to test facts.



I doubt that you will be able to disprove reality. But I guess what you'd need to do is come up with evidence that it isn't true.



Your denial of reality does not make it any less real.



That is incorrect. Reality is not partisan propaganda.

You have invented your own reality, and your own facts. Neither of these can be tested.

That is why no one can disprove anything you believe.

That is incorrect. I have not invented anything.

The reason why you cannot disprove what I believe is because I adhere to reality, and you are not able to disprove reality.

The fact is that the GOP is purposely holding up the counting, in order to allow Plump to time to come up with more BOGUS court challenges.

I've stopped paying attention to the counting since it hasn't been going anywhere.

I figure that if they ever arrive at a result I'll hear about it either here on a2k or on the evening news.