Tue 16 Nov, 2004 04:44 pm
We own a doberman with floppy ears. We had wanted the ears cropped, but fell in love with an older dog.
When people see him walking, they tend to comment that "Oh, I'm so glad you left his ears alone!"
Well, I'm sorry, but he came that way, and we wanted cropped ears. We consider it a preference, and it doesn't hurt the dog if done correctly. I understand that people have thier own opinions, but it seems that most people are just on a "save-the-whale" kick, trying to be politically correct. Personnally, I get sick of people saying this to me. What would they say if his ears WERE cropped? "Oh, your horrible people because you mutilated his ears?" No, they would still think he's cute!
Just wondered if anyone else had an opinion on this, or any stories.
I do! I do!
I had a Doberman when I was a kid (his name was Apollo) and my parents never cropped his years. I think they look the cutest that way. They are also known for being agressively possessive, and when ticked off by a stranger, oh oh! The cropped years only seem to accent that.
My Apollo was the sweetest and the best memory I have from him is when he used to put his paws up this high gate and stand there for the longest time so I could pet him on his nose rested on his paws. I can't forget his eyes and the look he'd give me.
I'm so sure that cropped years would completely take this away from me.
Anyway... It's not so much for the "politically correctness" of cropping or not, as much as it is for the devilish look that the ears being cropped will give to them.
A number of breeds, Perro de Presa, Dogo Argentino, Tosa Inus, Fila brasileiro, Pitbulls, all were cropped for a reason , same tthing with dobermans, except dobermans were used to protect lawmen aas the dog tore after the tax evaders through brush and briar. The doberman was oriiginally bred as a much more aggressive dog than it is today. To crop its ears, you make a statement that you are mas macho, withh your ready tuff ass dog. I dont think that cropping is a kindness if your dog is gonna be running out in the wind and rain. The ear flap is a kind of rainhat . I have catahoulas and theyve always bobbed the ears of these because they were used to fight wild pigs and theears wont catch on the tusks. Well, we dont have too many wild pigs around here. (My neighbor has one big Porko domesticus that wanders around and in the summer just lies down in the road but everybody knows to watch out for him and the most he does is riffle throughh your hands to see if youve got a reeses peanut butter cup) Otherwise were pretty much wild boar free, so I elected not to crop the doggies ears. Ears give them a personality too. A dog with bobbed ears looks kinda retarded and mean like a biker. Now thhats just me .
To Crop or Not to Crop
I've had Dobes for 35 years, about 25 dogs in all. Most were cropped. During the surgery, the whole back of the ear is cut off. Then the open (stitched) edge must have the scabs pulled off at least daily (ouch!) and the ears must be oiled and stretched frequently in order to keep the edge from contracting into wrinkles as it heals. This HURTS, no matter how carefully and competently the surgery and aftercare are done. Many Dobes are left with a life-long phobia about having their ears handled. I do think cropping is personal choice, but people who make the choice to crop should be aware of the pain it causes and the extensive aftercare it often takes to get the ears to stand. In addition I think most people would agree that uncropped ears are much more attractive than improperly standing cropped ears (cropped ears that flop or scissor over the top of the head.)
I have three rescue Dobes now, all uncropped. This was not my choice, since they were acquired as adults. I think they look great, even the one whose ears make her look like the Flying Nun. In the unlikely event that I ever got a pet quality puppy, I wouldn't crop. However, if I ever get another Dobe to show, I most likely will have the ears done, even knowing what I do about the pain and problems. Uncropped Dobes rarely win.
Hey, dogteacher! Stick around, and why not fill out a profile, while you're at it.
I agree, saying that it doesn't hurt is extremely naive, maltreatment like that can, as explained by others, cause lifelong problems and takes away the dogs character and ability to communicate with other dogs appropriately - body language is essential to animals and the angle of ears is a signal of mood and intention.
Strange... I may have had a bad experience with my wisdom teeth, but that doesn't mean I never went back to the dentist.
Yes, its a surgury. I never said the surgury isn't painful. Its the treatment recieved afterwards that defines the experience. If your animal trusts you, then it won't have long-lasting effects on your relationship with the dog. The animals I have seen cropped have enjoyed the extra attention immensely.
And no, you don't have to pull off scabs and do all that. There is mainanence, yes. But its a matter of if the ears are natural lengths. The taller the cropped ear, yes its going to be really hard to make it stand. But if you get a good military crop, theres hardly any 'manhandling' of the ears at all.
Don't call people niave till you know thier experiences.
the experience of the pain isn't yours - it is the dog's, which you obviously feel is unimportant compared with the style you wish his ears to be
Like I said, if you have a respectable vet and the right tools, its a lot LESS painful than it seems you people think it is.
I once split my ear, half the length of it. Had to have it sewn back together, and honestly it didn't hurt that badly. And I had ZERO pain killer, and didn't go into shock or anything. If I can split my ear and hardly feel it, I'm not obliged to think that my dog feels worse when its done with pain medication.
Like I said before. Don't assume you know someone if you don't know thier experiences.
my daughter had an operation to pin back her sticky out ears at the age of 11 and was in a lot of pain - I don't speak without experience.
So you made your 11 year old daughter go through something that you wouldn't make your dog go through?
And you call me naive for prefering cropped dog ears?
No, I waited until she was of an age to make her own decision - boys were teasing her and she talked to me about it - we went to see the doctor and discussed the operation and she wanted to go ahead.
when she was in pain after the op (with pain relief) she wished she hadn't had it done - though once she was better she was glad. This was her own decision though. She is highly intelligent and was perfectly capable of deciding for herself, having been given all the relevant information to consider - not my vanity deciding for her.
There is a vast difference. I mentioned this only to answer your challenge about 'experience'
After thrity years of veterinary practice, there are damned few things I haven't done, and even fewer that I refused to do. To the best of my recollection, the only surgical procedures that I simply turned down were descenting skunks and cropping dogs' ears. From my viewpoint, both procedures are performed simply to placate the owner, with no consideration given to the animal. A lot of things I did caused a great deal of pain, but there was a medical reason behind it. In response to Vivien's comment, I can tell you that I had the top of my right ear nearly removed by a cow that caught my head between her hip and the side of a squeeze chute, and it hurt like hell! The vet that was working for me sewed it back on (without anesthesia, by the way) and that hurt considerably less than the shot from the cow. In short, I can't see doing procedures that have no medical purpose. I'm sure several A2Kers have had cosmetic surgery of some sort, but that's outside my area of comprhension as well. To put in bluntly, I firmly believe that surgery done on dogs to make their owners feel better is simply bullshit, and thirty years of mainly bovine practice has made me an expert on THAT!