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Mon 24 Oct, 2016 12:54 pm
You call yourself a liberal?
click ... and listen (11 minutes - entertaining and enlightening)
a clip from the partial transcript
Quote:On last week's episode of The 180, we spoke with Jeffrey Tucker, a self-described 'classical liberal.' He argued Donald Trump is giving capitalism a bad name, by presenting himself as a titan of industry, when he's really more of an entertainer.
After that interview, we received notes from people questioning Tucker's bona-fides as a 'liberal,' since he spoke highly of individual liberties, free markets, and limited government. Some said Tucker was clearly a 'neo-liberal,' some said he was a 'large R conservative,' presumably meaning Republican, while others thought the term 'classical liberal' had plenty of negative connotations all on its own.
So what is a classical liberal?
First off, you should totally click the play button on this page to hear the audio explainer. It's got all kinds of fun music and clips of people using the word 'liberal' in weird and hilarious ways. Like when Rush Limbaugh said the Soviet Union and Cuba and China were run by 'liberals.' Weird.
Part of the problem with the word 'liberal' is its used differently across time, and across countries.
In Canada, the word mostly means a supporter of the Liberal Party, or someone in the political middle.
In the United States, it means a strong social progressive, and in some circles can mean a socialist or a communist.
In Europe it's associated with internationalism and free migration.
In Australia, in the words of Australian Liberal Party leader Malcolm Turnbull, it means the primacy of "freedom, the individual, and the market."
That last one, the Australian definition, is probably closest to what political scientists consider a classical liberal view.
more good stuff at the link
Shortly after Margaret Thatcher's Conservative government came into power in Britain in 1979, I was taken aback to hear her described as "an old-fashioned liberal of the Manchester School". A friend explained that this was exactly right. Led by Richard Cobden and John Bright, the Manchester movement, from around 1840 won a wide hearing for its argument that free trade would lead to a more equitable society, making essential products available to all. Its most famous activity was the Anti-Corn Law League that called for repeal of the Corn Laws that kept food prices high. It expounded the social and economic implications of free trade and laissez-faire. The Manchester School took the theories of economic liberalism advocated by classical economists such as Adam Smith and made them the basis for government policy. The School also promoted pacifism, anti-slavery, freedom of the press, and separation of church and state.
In these terms, I am not a liberal (I am a socialist). The word 'liberal' nowadays has different meanings inside and outside the US, I think.
Quote:In Europe it's associated with internationalism and free migration.
What?
I mean, I guess that's a small part of it, in some but hardly all (or even most, depending on what "free migration" is supposed to mean exactly) countries.. But it's not even close to the core element of what liberal parties in Europe stand for.
With the notable exception of Britain's LibDems, the Australian definition cited here works just fine.
Quote:In Australia, in the words of Australian Liberal Party leader Malcolm Turnbull, it means the primacy of "freedom, the individual, and the market.
In the US, this definition fits the word "libertarian."
US liberals tend towards more governmental control of the economy to protect the public. Individual freedoms are espoused by liberals, but not at the expense of other individuals.
@contrex,
contrex wrote: The word 'liberal' nowadays has different meanings inside and outside the US, I think.
that was the 180 radio piece was about
it's interesting programming offering different opinions on a range of topics
Quote:The 180 is a show that's meant to get Canadians talking about what's going on in our country. Our playground? The issues that matter most to you wherever you live, coast to coast. Big city or small suburb, we'll bring you opinions, analysis, and points of view that get you going, and give you ways to get in on the debate.
http://www.cbc.ca/radio/the180/democracyhacks tends to be amusing/interesting/aggravating
Relating to this topic, it was funny when Paul Ryan described himself as a "classical liberal" and all the Trumpkins lost their ****.. trying to find a link about that.. well, here's an example, anyway (and there's much more where that came from on Twitter):
@nimh,
If they were just stupid, then I would find that funny.
But it's not mere stupidity. The people who wrote that about Paul Ryan appear to see the truth as a sort of game. The idea seems to be, if you can get people to believe it, then it's true.
In the fable The Grasshopper and the Ant, the Grasshopper must have been a liberal, and the ant a conservative, in my opinion. Meaning, it seems that many a liberal thinks one need not earn what one gets, and a conservative feels that one should earn what one gets. And, that might include the largesse of one's family to believe that charity begins at home. The belief that one might deserve, or not deserve what one gets does not seem to be a Socratic question for a liberal? Everyone deserves to many a liberal, since human rights have expanded to include many previous venues that once were only earned. It once was just a chicken in every pot; who knows what that election slogan would be today?
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