The Mother Tongue

thanks set
good one man

I'm sorry, Boss, but this is driving me crazy, i've wanted to do this since i first saw your posts here . . .

There was a young man from Leeds
Who swallowed a packet of seeds
Great tufts of grass
Grew out of his ass
And his balls were covered in weeds.

Please indulge an irreverant old man . . . .


You many now resume normal programming . . .

hahaha

you are indulged

taking life seriously is something im working on not doing anymore

Was it rather one dimensional, then, despite the interesting idea of actually learning the proper speech patterns... rather than the ghastly Hollywood stereotype-accents?

(One thing to say to Hollywood: British people do not speak like Australians. Get over it.)

You're not old, Setanta.

In the 1930's, DetR, Hollywood was very much into authenticity--you shouldn't judge it by today's standards. In those days, all actors were on contract with a studio, and among other requirements, were obliged to take lessons in diction. You did not have travesties like Kevin "Someday I hope to learn to act" Costner playing Robin Hood.

The movie is simply mediocre. Recall that there was no television in those days, so there were Saturday afternoon movies, sci fi, gothic romance, westerns . . . it's one of those types, but fascinating nonetheless for the trouble they went to with it.

those were the days my friend..
we thought they'd never end..

Ah, I see what you mean, Set; a sort of... time-filler... like most of TV...

Was it just economics and thinking, 'hell, they won't notice the difference anyway?' that stopped Hollywood from being so authentic?

Heh heh heh... that just reminded me of an old, out-of-tune teacher that I had...

I haven't the expertise to give a cogent answer to that question, DetR. I do suspect, however, that the competition from television lowered the common denominator of production values. In the 30's, the studios were very wealthy, and very powerful. There really was no such thing as independent film in America, and there was no medium to compete with motion pictures. There was a lot of trash out there, but much of it was well done because the studios had the time and resources, and weren't as threatened financially by flops. With actors on contract, more money went to the studio, and less into the pockets of the actors. This is not to say they were not well-paid, but they didn't get the same big cut as today. My surmise is that the combination of television, and the rise of small production companies and independent film makes refocused major studios on the bottom line. In the 30's, the quality of the motion picture was the area of competition. Studios also had lots of work for everyone--there were Saturday afternoon movies rituals, with lavishly produced, high-quality animated shorts, ten- and fifteen-minute serials (the "cliff-hangers," which were designed to draw back the audience next Saturday), there were news reels, there were western shorts, which ran for 20 or 30 minutes, and there were pot-boilers--cheesey detective fiction or gothic romance. Some of it is quite hilarious in retrospect. Vincent Price, who became famous in "horror movies" (but not the "splatter" movies of today), started out as the leading man in the short gothic romance movies--and he was quite a handsome young man, and perfect for the roles.

Lightwizard probably would have a more cogent answer for why things have changed. The above is my speculation, that's all.

Whether you thought that that was cogent or not, your ideas really interested me, Set. Was it common for people to see more than two shows a day? Did America have the 'A-movie/B-movie' ritual, as in Ireland? Did that phase out due to lack of demand, do you think? Do you think that it was mainly competition that led to studios paying extortionate fees to actors and actresses?

(Sorry about the number of questions, Set; I like to accumulate answers, I guess...)

Well, as i've already noted, i'm not expert in this subject. I'll make a stab, though--yes, of a Saturday afternoon, there would be one or more (usually three) animated shorts, cartoons if you will; there would be one or more serialized stories, although usually only one as the theater used these to attract faithful viewers, and these were usually action/adventure or sci fi dramas; there would be a western "short" film (30 or 40 minutes), and often, something which would clear the theater of children, a serialized "soap opera" like short, and a gothic romance. Basically, as various television networks seek to capture trade by showing genre programs, the Saturday afternoon theater experience, which could last from two to four hours, and was crowded and noisy, sought to appeal to as many tastes as possible. The rating system of the Catholic church would indeed be published in the newspapers, A, B or C rated. Basically, however, "B movie" became a term for pot boilers in any genre with lower production values and exagerated (sometimes outrageously implausible) scripts in just about any genre. I have no doubt in my mind that television killed it--all the old cartoons and the serialized dramas, as well as the short western or gothic films were soon available on television. The cartoons which we watched as children were usually the older theatrically released animation shorts, and of a much higher quality than the "assembly line" pap that studios such as Hannah-Barbera later produced specifically for television. When one of the networks (i think it was NBC) started Saturday Night at the Movies, an evening phenomenon then, with what would be considered major second run movies, i think it firmly killed off the Saturday movie ritual.

I haven't the faintest clue what killed the studio system. I do know that Jamie Lee Curtiss (daugher of Janet Leigh and Tony Curtis) was one of the last actors still working who started her career with a studio contract. Lightwizard could explain why the studio system collapsed. I believe that the more intense competition for "blockbusters," to "hit the home run" with a particular film probably accounts for the very big compensation packages (residual rights and other perquisites in addition to salary) for actors--but i can't state to a certainty that this was the cause.

On the topic of those westerns, Marion Morrison of Iowa, who took the stage name John Wayne, started his career in the those 30 and 40 minute westerns, i saw a great many of them on television as a child. I believe it was either RKO or Republic Studios he worked for in that era. He got his break doing heroic leading men in World War II era films, usually about the war.