7
   

Questions ... To you the people

 
 
Reply Tue 29 Sep, 2015 06:52 pm
Hey ,

Okay so .. I have some questions

1. How were we designed intelligently with functions that are far to complex to be duplicated?

2. What gives us are feelings of right and wrong without ever learning it ?

3. Why are we in a crisis state in the world where evil is seeming to be at it's max ?

Answers please
 
Pearlylustre
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Sep, 2015 07:00 pm
@Johnjohnjohn,
Quote:
What gives us are feelings of right and wrong without ever learning it ?

I'm interested in what studies have been done on the morality of newborns - can you reference some research please.
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Sep, 2015 07:14 pm
@Pearlylustre,
Pearlylustre wrote:
. . . I'm interested in what studies have been done on the morality of newborns - can you reference some research please.
I think jjj is referring to conscience. Is it something innate? Or is it learned?
Pearlylustre
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 Sep, 2015 07:43 pm
@neologist,
Yes, I got that thank you.
0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  6  
Reply Tue 29 Sep, 2015 07:53 pm
@Johnjohnjohn,
Johnjohnjohn wrote:

1. How were we designed intelligently with functions that are far to complex to be duplicated?

We weren't designed, we evolved, just like everything else on the planet.
Johnjohnjohn wrote:

2. What gives us are feelings of right and wrong without ever learning it ?

We are mammals. Mammals need their mothers for nourishment and warmth. Empathy and compassion are highly selectable traits within mammals for exactly those reasons, and they are even more strongly amplified in mammals which depend on social interactions to maximize survival. So it's not in the least bit surprising that we feel empathy, compassion and morality at a visceral level.
Johnjohnjohn wrote:

3. Why are we in a crisis state in the world where evil is seeming to be at it's max?

That's just a misperception on your part. The world is far better off right now from a human population health and happiness perspective than it ever has been before. The only reason it's not apparent to you is that you didn't live through the Toba eruption which almost wiped out all of humanity, or the crusades or the plagues or the dark ages or the civil war or the 1918 pandemic or a thousand other things throughout history which you aren't aware of.
FBM
 
  2  
Reply Tue 29 Sep, 2015 08:52 pm
@Johnjohnjohn,
Johnjohnjohn wrote:

Hey ,

Okay so .. I have some questions

1. How were we designed intelligently with functions that are far to complex to be duplicated?


2. What gives us are feelings of right and wrong without ever learning it ?

3. Why are we in a crisis state in the world where evil is seeming to be at it's max ?

Answers please
[/quote]

http://www.logicallyfallacious.com/index.php/logical-fallacies/61-begging-the-question

Quote:
BEGGING THE QUESTION
petitio principii


(also known as: assuming the initial point, assuming the answer, chicken and the egg argument, circulus in probando, circular reasoning [form of], vicious circle)

Description: Any form of argument where the conclusion is assumed in one of the premises. Many people use the phrase “begging the question” incorrectly when they use it to mean, “prompts one to ask the question”. That is NOT the correct usage. Begging the question is a form of circular reasoning.

Logical Forms:

Claim X assumes X is true.
Therefore, claim X is true.
Example #1:

Paranormal activity is real because I have experienced what can only be described as paranormal activity.
Explanation: The claim, “paranormal activity is real” is supported by the premise, “I have experienced what can only be described as paranormal activity.” The premise presupposes, or assumes, that the claim, “paranormal activity is real” is already true.

Example #2:

The reason everyone wants the new "Slap Me Silly Elmo" doll is because this is the hottest toy of the season!

Explanation: Everyone wanting the toy is the same thing as it being "hot," so the reason given is no reason at all—it is simply rewording the claim and trying to pass it off as support for the claim.

Exception: Some assumptions that are universally accepted could pass as not being fallacious.

People like to eat because we are biologically influenced to eat.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2015 04:01 am
@rosborne979,
Best answer . . .
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2015 04:04 am
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2015 05:04 am
@Johnjohnjohn,
Johnjohnjohn wrote:

Hey ,

Okay so .. I have some questions

1. How were we designed intelligently with functions that are far to complex to be duplicated?

2. What gives us are feelings of right and wrong without ever learning it ?

3. Why are we in a crisis state in the world where evil is seeming to be at it's max ?

Answers please


Why can't anyone just answer the questions directly.

1) We aren't designed intelligently. There are many many things in humans that could be designed much better (start with knees that don't go bad far too early, and teeth that either regenerate or don't decay in the first place). The complexity comes from a process of evolution.

2) We evolved basic feelings of right and wrong as part of being a social primate (any species that survives by forming communities needs an emotional sense to keep the community working together smoothly). Every human is taught the details about what their specific society thinks is right or wrong.

3) We are not in a crisis state... in fact with the exception of the side effects to our technological advancement, we are doing better than ever. There are fewer slaves than ever. There is less genocide than ever. There are fewer people starving (as a proportion of the population) than ever. People are living longer and have more leisure time than ever.
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2015 05:07 am
@maxdancona,
I just read Rosborne's post... it seems he has the same (very intelligent) ideas.
0 Replies
 
djjd62
 
  2  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2015 05:15 am
@Johnjohnjohn,
Johnjohnjohn wrote:

1. How were we designed intelligently with functions that are far to complex to be duplicated?
computers like big blue and watson are getting there, plus major advances in robotics every year
2. What gives us are feelings of right and wrong without ever learning it ?
who says we have these feelings, babies can be incredibly loving to wards other babies, but they also hit and injure and steal toys they want until they learn the behaviour is wrong
3. Why are we in a crisis state in the world where evil is seeming to be at it's max ?
i don't believe there's any more evil or suffering per capita than there was in the past, we just have more info on the specifics than ever before
FBM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2015 07:00 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Why can't anyone just answer the questions directly.


OK, I'll be more direct:

Johnjohnjohn wrote:

Hey ,

Okay so .. I have some questions

1. How were we designed intelligently with functions that are far to complex to be duplicated?


This is begging the question that we were "designed intelligently" and that we have "functions that are far to [sic] complex to be duplicated."

Quote:
2. What gives us are feelings of right and wrong without ever learning it ?


This is begging the question about whether morals are learned or instinctive, an issue of no small contention.

Quote:
3. Why are we in a crisis state in the world where evil is seeming to be at it's max ?


This is begging the questions a) that there is such a thing as evil, and b) that it is "at it's [sic] max."

Once he corrects the fallacies inherent in each of the questions, they will deserve a different answer. Until then, educating him about the fallacies seems a proper response, as he seems to be blithely unaware of them.
0 Replies
 
fresco
 
  4  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2015 07:57 am
@Johnjohnjohn,
If you don't like Rosborne's excellent answer you can always do what you usually do.....put it down to the Devil talking ! Twisted Evil
Johnjohnjohn
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 3 Oct, 2015 12:30 pm
@djjd62,
Robots don't have flesh that functions with more flesh to help keep the big body of flesh working, with a brain inside that helps, and a spirit .

2. With the Holy Spirit you'll be making 10x smarter decisions than you have before.

3. No, that's not true, if you'd study it more you would know . Either way, if it was, who opened our eyes this much to the evil?

The answer is God by the way.
0 Replies
 
Johnjohnjohn
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 3 Oct, 2015 12:36 pm
@rosborne979,
People you honestly believed we came from animals? The Lord made us. Who would have made the animals anyway?

Also look around you. Officers shoot black people out of wheelchairs. Everybody does the things that they used to shun. We made for homosexuality. Why is the government promoting it? The pope is talking bad about Jesus. The list goes on.

You're deceived.
Johnjohnjohn
 
  0  
Reply Sat 3 Oct, 2015 12:38 pm
@fresco,
When do I ?

Though I don't like it.
0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  3  
Reply Sat 3 Oct, 2015 01:08 pm
@Johnjohnjohn,
Johnjohnjohn wrote:

You're deceived.

And you're projecting (your own weaknesses on others).

Your reply doesn't even show an understanding of what I wrote, much less any rational reason for disagreement.
fresco
 
  2  
Reply Mon 5 Oct, 2015 01:07 am
@rosborne979,
Yes, the lack of understanding of infinite regresses (a made b....b made c...etc) comes from ignorance of the anthropomorphic limitations of the meaning of verbs like 'to make'. The attempted 'escape clause' usually employed is that anthropomorphism is justified since 'Man was made in God's image',(rather than vice versa Smile ) but the circularity of such reasoning is opaque to 'believers' who have nowhere else to go. They want 'certainty' and 'closure' and the problem is that some fanatics are prepared to kill for it!
0 Replies
 
najmelliw
 
  5  
Reply Tue 6 Oct, 2015 01:25 pm
@Johnjohnjohn,
Johnjohnjohn wrote:

Also look around you. Officers shoot black people out of wheelchairs. Everybody does the things that they used to shun. We made for homosexuality. Why is the government promoting it? The pope is talking bad about Jesus. The list goes on.


So you compare shooting black people out of wheelchairs to homosexuality in terms of its 'evilness'? Seriously?
One seems to be racism and murder, and the other is what... people loving other people in a way you can't condone?
Way to go. Keep on spreading these 'truths', it gives me a much clearer sense of where to look for all that purported 'evil' in this world.
Johnjohnjohn
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 30 Oct, 2015 03:12 pm
@najmelliw,
Even if your evolution theory is true ( its not )

Why on earth would two men be the proper way to live when men and woman were specifically made with organs that fit in unison , where men dont, meaning there was a purpose for that, and it's to reproduce, not for pleasure only.
 

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