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Dumb question: Why people are fighting?

 
 
Reply Thu 10 Apr, 2014 08:54 pm
Do every religions value human lives and good deeds? If yes, then why people are still fighting and war and all of that stuff? If no, what kind of messed up religions are those?
 
Setanta
 
  4  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 03:05 am
It's not necessarily a dumb question--just naïve. At the core of every religion is the assumption that the tenets and dogma of that religion are correct, and by extension, the tenets and dogma of anyone who does not agree are wrong. Carried to a logical extreme, those tenets are dangerously wrong--dangerous to the individual "soul," and dangerous therefore to society. Humans being what they are, this can, sooner or later, and usually sooner rather than later, lead to violence and war.

However, it is also naïve to blame all war on religion. Although it has often been the casus belli, the excuse for war, it only prevails in the short term. To sustain war, you need money and political control. Wars are only carried on over the long term when the reward is money and power. It's the social equivalent of a fistfight which starts for frivolous reasons and then turns into a brawl, or even a riot.
rollingappleseed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 06:54 am
@Setanta,
Then what do you think is the best religion? :-? Christianity has those Holy Wars, Islam has those extremists... But I have never seen any Buddhists fighting people of different faiths. Buddhism is only about the cycle of birth and rebirth, how to escape from it by letting go of desires. There is no God in Buddhism, and it is peaceful with no extreme rules... What do you think?
Setanta
 
  3  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 07:47 am
@rollingappleseed,
I think Buddhist are a bunch of selfish hypocrites who are as hag-ridden by superstition as any other religion, but who are not sufficiently honest to admit it.
rollingappleseed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 09:15 am
@Setanta,
Oh... Ha ha ha Smile) that's really honest. I myself don't care much about religions though. Just curious :-/ thanks for answering!
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  2  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 10:18 am
@rollingappleseed,
So long as the clergy beds with the politicians, you will find them always ready to provide cannon fodder.
Quote:
Man will never be free until the last king has been strangled with the entrails of the last priest.
Denis Diderot.
dalehileman
 
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Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 10:39 am
@rollingappleseed,
Roll, (1) the failure of education to instill tolerant worldly view
(2) Subliminal craving for violence. It's fun to shoot, maim, kill
dalehileman
 
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Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 11:04 am
@dalehileman,
In this connection coincidentally in today's Victorville, Ca Daily Press, "Feds: 'Excessive force' used by police," from Albuquerque, NM. Reports of this sort confirm simply that for many if not most of us, it's fun to beat someone over the head
0 Replies
 
rollingappleseed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 01:25 pm
@neologist,
Hmmm... Interesting. So... Are religions affected by politics that much? :-? If that is the case, can any of them be trusted?
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 01:38 pm
@rollingappleseed,
rollingappleseed wrote:
Hmmm... Interesting. So... Are religions affected by politics that much? :-? If that is the case, can any of them be trusted?
I know of only one unaffected by politics.
rollingappleseed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 02:24 pm
@neologist,
Really? What is it?
0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 03:19 pm
@neologist,
Will these stranglers and disembowelers inherit the earth, neo?
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 06:08 pm
@InfraBlue,
InfraBlue wrote:
Will these stranglers and disembowelers inherit the earth, neo?
Diderot's observation seems spot on, but perhaps not his sentiment. Had he read the 17th and 18th chapters of Revelation, he might have gained more insight into the specifics.
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 09:03 pm
@neologist,
So, you couldn't find something to quote that's more along the sentiments specified in chapters 17 and 18 in Revelation and instead quote a sentiment about strangling and disemboweling people you don't agree with. That's rather nominally Christian.
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Fri 11 Apr, 2014 11:11 pm
@InfraBlue,
Why do you assume the quotation represents anything more than an independent assessment of the human condition?
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Apr, 2014 10:42 am
@neologist,
neologist wrote:

Why do you assume the quotation represents anything more than an independent assessment of the human condition?

The quote talks directly about bloodlust and using murderous violence to achieve an end. Why are you avoiding those facts?
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Apr, 2014 03:09 pm
@InfraBlue,
InfraBlue wrote:
The quote talks directly about bloodlust and using murderous violence to achieve an end. Why are you avoiding those facts?
Are you asserting that I espouse murder because I cited Diderot? I would imagine even he would not take to such ends but meant his statement only as an indictment of religious and political evil.

You may also note the dispatch of Babylon the Great by the political powers equally bloody. I do not plan to participate in that. Though, perhaps if I live long enough, I may stand by and watch with fear and trembling.

It will happen.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Apr, 2014 04:21 pm
@rollingappleseed,
rollingappleseed wrote:

Do every religions value human lives and good deeds? If yes, then why people are still fighting and war and all of that stuff? If no, what kind of messed up religions are those?


The major religions surely do, but that fact has nothing to do with why there is violence and harmful behaviors in the world.

Religion doesn't control people, and people who profess to "believe" in a given religion are not perfect representations, through their actions, of the teachings of their chosen religion.

At their core, religions provide an explanation of the universe, and a set of rules for human behavior. That someone calls himself a Christian or a Buddhist, in no way, assures that they abide by their religion's rules or even except its explanation.

Criticizing religion for the ill behavior of humanity is like criticizing cars for auto accidents.

0 Replies
 
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Sun 13 Apr, 2014 01:45 pm
@neologist,
neologist wrote:

InfraBlue wrote:
The quote talks directly about bloodlust and using murderous violence to achieve an end. Why are you avoiding those facts?
Are you asserting that I espouse murder because I cited Diderot? I would imagine even he would not take to such ends but meant his statement only as an indictment of religious and political evil.



You couldn't find a way to indict religious and political evil in a more Christianly manner? Or does Christianity itself espouse murderous violence? I don't doubt that Diderot espoused violence as a means to an end given the times he lived in and the bloodiness of the French Revolution that proceeded his death a few years afterward.
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sun 13 Apr, 2014 01:47 pm
@InfraBlue,
When the time comes for Jehovah to settle accounts, he will not subdue his enemies in a pillow fight.

 

 
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