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Merkel to Obama- "Why the F★★k are you bugging my phone?"

 
 
Reply Wed 23 Oct, 2013 03:23 pm
www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-24647268



"German Chancellor Angela Merkel has called US President Barack Obama after receiving information that the US may have spied on her mobile phone.

A spokesman for Mrs Merkel said the German leader "views such practices... as completely unacceptable".

Mrs Merkel called on US officials to clarify the extent of their surveillance in Germany.

The White House said President Obama had told Chancellor Merkel the US was not snooping on her communications.

"The United States is not monitoring and will not monitor the communications of the chancellor," White House spokesman Jay Carney said on Wednesday.

The US has been on the receiving end of anger from allies over spying allegations based on material said to originate from fugitive American leaker Edward Snowden.

'Breach of trust'

Analysis

By Nick Bryant
BBC News, Washington
The language in the White House statement responding to allegations that the NSA monitored Angela Merkel's private mobile phone is deliberately precise. "The president assured the chancellor that the United States is not monitoring and will not monitor the communications of Chancellor Merkel." It did not deny possible past surveillance on her phone.

Clearly, Angela Merkel believes these allegations are plausible enough to confront directly Barack Obama, in what must have been an awkward conversation.

Tonight at the White House there was supposed to be a state dinner for Brazilian President Dilma Rousseff. But she cancelled the visit last month following allegations that the NSA snooped on her personal communications.

Only on Monday, President Obama had to reassure his French counterpart, Francois Hollande, over allegations published in Le Monde of electronic eavesdropping on French political figures and business leaders on a vast scale.

The diplomatic backlash is getting fiercer by the day.

Mr Carney told reporters that Washington was examining concerns from Germany as well as France and other American allies over US intelligence practices.

But the spokesman did not address whether Mrs Merkel's phone had been monitored in the past.

Berlin demanded "an immediate and comprehensive explanation" from Washington about what it said "would be a serious breach of trust".

In a statement it said: "Among close friends and partners, as the Federal Republic of Germany and the US have been for decades, there should be no such monitoring of the communications of a head of government."

The statement also said that Mrs Merkel had told Mr Obama: "Such practices must be prevented immediately."

The BBC's Steve Evans in Berlin says because the statement was issued after the phone call, there were indications that Mrs Merkel had not been reassured.

He says the issue of state monitoring of phone calls is a real one in Germany - Angela Merkel grew up in East Germany, where phone tapping was pervasive.

President Obama had assured Chancellor Merkel when he visited in June that German citizens were not being spied upon and our correspondent says she was criticised then by political opponents for not being more sceptical.

The German government would not elaborate on how it received the tip about the alleged US spying.

But news magazine Der Spiegel, which has published stories based on material from Edward Snowden, said the information had come from its investigations.

US allies on spying claims

US agencies accused of spying on leaders of Brazil and Mexico; Brazil's Dilma Rousseff cancels state visit, Mexico's Enrique Pena Nieto says US has promised an inquiry
US allegedly runs bugging operations on EU mission in Washington and other European embassies; France objects, Germany cancels surveillance agreement with US and UK
Le Monde claims NSA snooped on millions of phone calls in France; Paris complains to Washington
Leaks timeline

Mrs Merkel's call comes a day after US intelligence chief James Clapper denied reports that American spies had recorded data from 70 million phone calls in France in a single 30-day period.

He said a report in Le Monde newspaper had contained "misleading information".

A number of US allies have expressed anger over the Snowden-based spying allegations.

Brazilian President Dilma Rousseff cancelled a visit to the US this month in protest at alleged electronic espionage by the NSA against her country, including of communications at her office.

In a speech at the United Nations, she rejected arguments put forward by the US that the interception of information was aimed at protecting nations against terrorism, drugs trafficking and other organised crime.

The Mexican government has called the alleged spying on the emails of two presidents, Enrique Pena Nieto - the incumbent - and Felipe Calderon, as "unacceptable".

US officials have begun a review of American intelligence gathering amid the international outcry."
 
Lordyaswas
 
  2  
Reply Wed 23 Oct, 2013 03:31 pm
It was noted that Obama did not clarify whether the USA had been bugging her phone prior to the bugging being exposed. His Spokesman, Jay Carney, would only state that "The United States is not monitoring and will not monitor the communications of the chancellor,"
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  2  
Reply Wed 23 Oct, 2013 06:13 pm
Why should she be an exception? Smile
0 Replies
 
roger
 
  3  
Reply Wed 23 Oct, 2013 06:22 pm
Anyhow, if she's got nothing to hide, what's she got to complain about. We're all on the same side, aren't we.

Twisted Evil
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  2  
Reply Wed 23 Oct, 2013 06:26 pm
@Lordyaswas,
If the Germans could bug Obama's phone they would.

Clearly, I'm not a fan of Obama, but there's nothing here.

Merkel is playing to her people.

Allies have been "spying" on one another for a very long time.

How else might you know (before it's too late) that your ally was becoming an adversary? [Oh wait! That would never happen with a European state.]

Perfidy, afterall, is not a unique attribute of the US government.
0 Replies
 
Lordyaswas
 
  2  
Reply Thu 24 Oct, 2013 06:14 am
So this is a non story?

I don't believe it for one minute. We're talking about her personal mobile phone.

If they're prepared to go this far with lowly foreigners, I just wonder what they're getting up to with their own citizens?


And.....apart from the spying, I wonder how many commercial advantages have been gained by the USA because of all this.

Arrogant, mealy mouthed shits, the lot of them.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Oct, 2013 07:12 am
Of course, it's an important story. But today's technology and the mindset of those in authority makes it inevitable. And nobody is apparently going to make a good stand against it.
BillRM
 
  2  
Reply Thu 24 Oct, 2013 07:48 am
@edgarblythe,
Quote:
Of course, it's an important story. But today's technology and the mindset of those in authority makes it inevitable. And nobody is apparently going to make a good stand against it.


Proper install technology can stop it dead in it track.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Oct, 2013 07:26 pm
@Lordyaswas,
Of course the British would never do something like this.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 24 Oct, 2013 09:06 pm
@BillRM,
Who is going to install it? You?
BillRM
 
  3  
Reply Thu 24 Oct, 2013 09:52 pm
@edgarblythe,
Quote:
Who is going to install it? You?


LOL I do in fact take care of my own and my family computer/internet security thank you very must and if the bulk of internet users would take similar care the cost of trying to do massive spying even on the current net would be beyond the reach of even a hundred thousands NSA.

I agree 100 percents with Snowdon that such tools as pgp, truecrypt, and tor use correctly by individuals can go a damn long way to reclaiming computer/internet privacy.

Next technology such as perfect forward security and HTTPS everywhere plug-ins and kicking out the US as far as having control of the internet and having a say in the internet standard boards are just a beginning of getting what the US government fear the most in place IE an internet that had "gone dark" as far as spying is concern no matter how many billions dollars budget and how many hundreds of thousands employees are on NSA payroll.

Lot of very very very bright people are working day and night all over the world to stop the NSA in it tracks and it can and it will be done and in a fairly short time frame.

Those very bright people are being funded well from sources as far apart as small private donation drives to for example have a full security audit of the truecrypt source code to major international firms and governments that does not care for US massive spying on them and desire their VPNs to be bullet/NSA proof.

Do you think for a minute that Airbus for example is not taking steps to stop the NSA from handing over their trade secrets to Boeing?

The amusing and sad part is if NSA and the US/UK governments as a whole had kept their spying within sane limits and not go for the goal of having a data base of everyone on the planet that use the internet, just because they could, the counter reaction that is going to end up with shutting them down would not be occurring now.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  2  
Reply Thu 24 Oct, 2013 10:25 pm
@edgarblythe,
Footnote right now a gentleman by the name of Steve Gibson have just come up with a means of secure web sites log ons that does not used/need any passwords and will greatly increase the security of the web from hackers including government hackers by the name of SQRL.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  2  
Reply Thu 24 Oct, 2013 10:33 pm
Quote:


http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57609239/man-live-tweets-details-of-ex-nsa-chiefs-phone-calls/

While traveling on an Amtrak Acela train Thursday, former National Security Agency Director Michael Hayden apparently decided to give some background interviews to reporters, stipulating that he didn't want to be quoted by name.

What Hayden, who is also a former CIA director, forgot is that when you're in public, you're never really alone. A fellow passenger named Tom Matzzie overhead Hayden's side of the conversations and began live-tweeting details.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Oct, 2013 09:48 am
Latest news is that the NSA didn't limit their spying on allied leaders to just Merkel. The EU is considering legal action against the US.
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Fri 25 Oct, 2013 10:23 am
a) They lost the war. b) We were instrumental in getting half their country back. c) They make good air conditioners, cars, and cameras; however, some countries should show gratitude, and know their place in the greater scheme of things (aka, the world order after WWII, since being the world's policeman, and holding back the Soviets from European expansion, requires intelligence. And the inference, in my opinion, of her umbrage, is that she, pretty madel that she is, is above reproach. Some countries should get off of their high horse, again in my opinion.)
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Fri 25 Oct, 2013 10:29 am
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:

Latest news is that the NSA didn't limit their spying on allied leaders to just Merkel. The EU is considering legal action against the US.


Those schmucks would be speaking German if it wasn't for the Russians and the U.S. Talk of ingratitude. We should just say, in my opinion, that any gathering of information was just an ongoing part of the post-WWII de-nazification that should not end, in context of the current climate in the EU under "austerity."
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  2  
Reply Tue 29 Oct, 2013 05:16 pm
But, but...Obama didn't know about it.
eurocelticyankee
 
  3  
Reply Tue 29 Oct, 2013 06:11 pm
For a while now it's been nothing but US intelligence (snicker) bashing. Mostly thanks to whistleblowers, funny that none of our Euro intel agencies (snicker) were able to uncover any of this by themselves.

Now I'm no fan of US intel agencies for many reasons but I'm believe that we ought to get our own house in order before we start getting all high and mighty about what US intel are doing. The same goes for Mossad.
Again I reiterate I am a fan of neither, in fact I despise a lot of what they do.

What about the revelations (dogs in the street knew) coming out this week of the collusion between British security forces including MI5 & Loyalist thugs leading to the murder of between 50 & 120 innocent Catholics in Northern Ireland.

If the US or Mossad did this, I shudder to think of the amount of threads we would have about it.

I know most of the collusion went on between the RUC & UDR but and it's a big but, you would think the cover up went much higher plus there is no doubt that British intel would have been fully aware it was happening.

50 to 120 innocent men women & children slaughtered for no reason other than being Catholic.
While the IRA were causing murder and mayhem at the same time you can be sure they weren't getting any help from the Irish government who feared & hated the IRA even more than the British did.

It would be nice to think this was all in the past, although how can it be when the truth has not been told.
Then only a few days ago you have British squadies making nazi salutes in front of a flag inscribed “Invicta Loyal”, the name of a Kent-based Glasgow Rangers supporters club, and below it hangs the flag of Northern Ireland.

Now I know most British people are appalled at all this, but I think you need to question and kick up a fuss about your intelligence sevices as well as the US's.

I'd rather have my phone tapped than be murdered, thank you.

http://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2013/oct/25/northernireland-pat-finucane

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/439593/Anger-over-British-soldiers-Nazi-salute

Incidentally my wonderful British compatriots I am not declaring war on you or anything, just saying we should examine our own actions as well as keeping an eye on others.
Peace out!
roger
 
  2  
Reply Tue 29 Oct, 2013 06:38 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
The world is just full of things Obama didn't know about, which includes everything that made his administration look bad.
roger
 
  2  
Reply Tue 29 Oct, 2013 06:39 pm
@eurocelticyankee,
And exactly how does one detect a cell phone intercept?
 

 
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