10
   

What is God's real name?

 
 
Setanta
 
  3  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 12:30 am
@Moment-in-Time,
If you tell me your god says women and children are your chattels, for example (as is the case in all three of the Abrahamic religions), i'm not going to respect that, and i see no plausible reason to suggest that i should. In fact, i consider maundering over meaningless questions such as RL is famous for posing to be exercises in essentially pointless blather back and forth between those who choose to take this sort of thing seriously. I see no reason to respect that, either. Respecting what i have to say is not going to lead me to respect what i consider either silly or pernicious.

Tico is a goddamned liar. His name is not Steve, ti's Holloway.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 07:55 am
@Moment-in-Time,
Moment-in-Time wrote:
Yet, I realize there are those among us who still need the god they created out of a need of necessity. God came into being because there was a need for him. Many have outgrown this crutch, but many also still need to believe in a god. Some of us proceed at a faster pace than others; therefore, we should not belittle those who still cling to their religious beliefs where in time a belief in god is their only hope!

It's interesting how you fit Believers into the cubbyhole you've defined for them (us). You clearly think all Believers are in "need" of a "crutch," and "need to believe" out of "necessity" (necessity of what, you don't articulate, but I reckon you picture them huddled together, afraid that the sun will fall from the sky and smite them), and they "cling" to their faith because that's "their only hope".

But, no, you're not belittling anyone, are you? Laughing
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 08:04 am
Believers are afraid of ZOMBIES ! ! !

They think their god will protect them. HA ! ! !
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 10:58 am
@Ticomaya,
Quote:
But, no, you're not belittling anyone, are you?


Given that a rational ten years old should not buy into the religious nonsense so having contempt for adults who do so is not uncalled for.
0 Replies
 
Moment-in-Time
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 12:54 pm
@Ticomaya,
Quote:
@Moment-in-Time,
Moment-in-Time wrote:
Yet, I realize there are those among us who still need the god they created out of a need of necessity. God came into being because there was a need for him. Many have outgrown this crutch, but many also still need to believe in a god. Some of us proceed at a faster pace than others; therefore, we should not belittle those who still cling to their religious beliefs where in time a belief in god is their only hope!


Ticomaya wrote:
Quote:
It's interesting how you fit Believers into the cubbyhole you've defined for them (us). You clearly think all Believers are in "need" of a "crutch," and "need to believe" out of "necessity" (necessity of what, you don't articulate, but I reckon you picture them huddled together, afraid that the sun will fall from the sky and smite them), and they "cling" to their faith because that's "their only hope".


On the contrary, I was/am attempting to explain our species' raison d'être to invent his god and why the necessity to create such was so badly in need. Man, initially, needed a father protector, although it was not defined this way, it was just abstract in thought. Our species was so all alone, so unprotected…so afraid. Out of emotional and mental necessity, we created "gods." There were many gods worshipped by our species prior to monotheism's appearance, which, btw, was conceived by the Egyptian Pharaoh Akhenaten, who prior to his conception of the one-god theory, had worshipped the Sun and stars. Many of our species believed we were preordained to be on earth by some higher power.

There have been many forms of idol worship, some worshipping Mars, the ancient Roman god of war and agriculture, identified with the Greek god Ares. Some worshipped Jupiter, etc. The most enduring spiritual concept to survive down through the ages has been Monotheism which gave birth to the Abrahamic religions: Judaism, the religion of the Jews; the Christian religion...including the Catholic, Protestant, and Eastern Orthodox churches; and Islam, the religious faith of Muslims whose absolute submission is to a unique and personal god, Allah, aka God.

Ticomaya wrote:
Quote:
But, no, you're not belittling anyone, are you?


I sincerely hope not, Ticomaya, as that certainly is not my aim. I'm particularly unhappy that you perceived my explanation that way….If I have offended you, please do accept my apologies.

There are many among us whose personal Faith is deep, unshakable and I can empathize. When I experienced my first family death, my grandfather, whom I thoroughly adored, cased me much emotional distress; I thought I would never get over it. The first thing I did was pray, asking God why he would take my grandpa?!? We, humans, are weak, seemingly alone in this vast universe, and often frightened in our darkest hour; that is why we created gods in the first place….there was a human need for this belief. When we are at our lowest point in life, unprotected, we need to believe there is a power greater than ourselves, an omnipotent power who will understand, watch over us, and in the finality make everything alright.

I began to grow up when I commence to question the Bible, (I taught Sunday School) reading the cruelty, atrocities, and violence meted out by God. During the Holocaust, where 6 million Jews, Gypsies,Homosexuals, Jehovah_Witnesses, etc. were annihilated, where was God? The Jews were one of the most faithful of followers, and you tell me this *merciful* God could not intervene? Could not hear the anguish, the nightmarish hell these people were suffering?! What the hell did the people do to deserve such punishment?!?!? Or why should I "burn in hell forever and ever" when I've just lived one life time? In Sodom God kills everyone (men, women, children, infants, newborns). He's causing the plagues. He's torturing the Egyptians with pestilence. What kind of insecure and cruel God murders first-born children -- - What kind of God says: "Have no other God before me for I am a jealous god"? If god is omniscient and omnipotent, having unlimited and unrestricted power, why would he be jealous?!? What brought about his insecurities?

By my questioning so much inside the "Holy Bible" the New Testament and the Old Testament, I reached the conclusion that there is no preordained purpose to human existence. We have contributed human characteristics to this fathom god. "Homo Sapiens is born...we live...we die"...End of story. There has to be empirical data to prove something exist outside of death and so far I have not seen it.

If worshipping God makes one's life more meaningful, then I respect one's right to do so, by all means. For many, life without their god would be empty, because they give their hearts, mind and soul to this belief. There is certainly nothing wrong with one's faith that gives meaning to their existence....it is only when religion seek to impose this institution's values into the world of politics, into social behavior or governmental decisions, that I find a problem. Religion has been the root cause of so many unnecessary deaths.
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 01:09 pm
@Moment-in-Time,
Moment-in-Time wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
Quote:
But, no, you're not belittling anyone, are you?


I sincerely hope not, Ticomaya, as that certainly is not my aim. I'm particularly unhappy that you perceived my explanation that way….If I have offended you, please do accept my apologies.

Please rest assured you are unable to offend me.

You have permitted logic and your requirement of "empirical data" to overtake your faith. It happens. Doesn't make you right, but I acknowledge that you certainly think you are.

I respect your right to be wrong.
0 Replies
 
tsarstepan
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 01:18 pm
@Ticomaya,
Ticomaya wrote:

Steve

His name is Steve.

WRONG! His name is Joe Nation!
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 01:30 pm
@tsarstepan,
Sorry. I know this may come as a shock, but He doesn't live in New Yawk.

He lives somewhere in Colorado.
tsarstepan
 
  2  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 01:38 pm
@Ticomaya,
Colorado? Not New York City? That could be why I'm an atheist. Razz
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 02:41 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:
Believers are afraid of ZOMBIES ! ! !

They think their god will protect them. HA ! ! !
You fool! If you fail to inform your fellow a2kers that zombies may be re killed only with a liberal application of salt, you do us all a disservice
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  0  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 03:48 pm
@reasoning logic,
Do I detect a smattering of intellectual dishonesty here?
The bible you are quoting from refers to God's name as Jehovah, A name derived from the Hebrew letters represented in many languages by YHWH or JHWH . The four letters often referred to as the tetragrammaton. Here is how the tetragrammaton is handled in some of the translations available today:
The New English Bible: The name Jehovah appears at Exodus 3:15; 6:3.
Revised Standard Version: A footnote on Exodus 3:15 says: “The word LORD when spelled with capital letters, stands for the divine name, YHWH.”
Today’s English Version: A footnote on Exodus 6:3 states: “THE LORD: . . . Where the Hebrew text has Yahweh, traditionally transliterated as Jehovah, this translation employs LORD with capital letters, following a usage which is widespread in English versions.”
King James Version: The name Jehovah is found at Exodus 6:3; Psalm 83:18; Isaiah 12:2; 26:4.
American Standard Version: The name Jehovah is used consistently in the Hebrew Scriptures in this translation, beginning with Genesis 2:4.

Regarding the practice of rendering the tetragrammaton as LORD, it is well to question the translators' motives for doing so. As to why Jehovah is a jealous God, that sounds like a different question.
reasoning logic
 
  0  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 04:01 pm
@neologist,
Quote:
Do I detect a smattering of intellectual dishonesty here?


No not at all but sometimes I will joke around and may seem hatful but being hateful is not my intent but rather getting others to question what they believe. If you ever wonder if I am kidding just ask and I will share it as honestly as I see it.

I was hoping that you would share intellectual honesty the best that you knew when I asked you in my last request but I did not get a response from you. My question is copied and pasted below.

Quote:

I have no idea what that passage actually means. I will research it and be back later this evening. Meanwhile, I will check my records to see if any snakes have been harmed by this event.



While your at it could you research what exodus 34:28 claims to be the ten commandments but yet they are different than what most Christians claim them to be?

In your last reply you quoted this below.

Quote:
The bible you are quoting from refers to God's name as Jehovah, A name derived from the Hebrew letters represented in many languages by YHWH or JHWH . The four letters often referred to as the tetragrammaton. Here is how the tetragrammaton is handled in some of the translations available today:
The New English Bible: The name Jehovah appears at Exodus 3:15; 6:3.
Revised Standard Version: A footnote on Exodus 3:15 says: “The word LORD when spelled with capital letters, stands for the divine name, YHWH.”
Today’s English Version: A footnote on Exodus 6:3 states: “THE LORD: . . . Where the Hebrew text has Yahweh, traditionally transliterated as Jehovah, this translation employs LORD with capital letters, following a usage which is widespread in English versions.”
King James Version: The name Jehovah is found at Exodus 6:3; Psalm 83:18; Isaiah 12:2; 26:4.
American Standard Version: The name Jehovah is used consistently in the Hebrew Scriptures in this translation, beginning with Genesis 2:4.

Regarding the practice of rendering the tetragrammaton as LORD, it is well to question the translators' motives for doing so. As to why Jehovah is a jealous God, that sounds like a different question.


What I was mainly interested in is what society calls the ten commandments vs what the bible calls the ten commandments and why God says his name is Jealous but as yet I have not heard a reply from a Christian that seems to have a care on the matter.

Just out of curiosity does God say that his name is something different than Jealous in the bible? I have not researched so I do not know.
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 04:14 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:
. . .What I was mainly interested in is what society calls the ten commandments vs what the bible calls the ten commandments but as yet I have not heard a reply from a Christian that seems to have a care on the matter.
Why not pose that as a separate question? BTW, I have yet to see the specifics of your question, though you have asked it a few times, I believe. Please don't post it as a video. They take forever to load and I am much more interested in your words than in the production efforts of others.

As far as the question of whether any snakes have been harmed in the production resulting from Genesis 3:15, my herpetologist assures me that snakes seem to be doing just fine. (You knew it was a ridiculous question, did you not?)
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 04:19 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:
. . . Just out of curiosity does God say that his name is something different than Jealous in the bible? I have not researched so I do not know.
Yes. By all means do the research; then your questions will have merit. Pay attention to Setanta's posts. You know he and I disagree. Nevertheless, I respect the thought he (generally) applies to his responses.
reasoning logic
 
  0  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 04:23 pm
@neologist,
Quote:
Why not pose that as a separate question? BTW, I have yet to see the specifics of your question, though you have asked it a few times, I believe. Please don't post it as a video. They take forever to load and I am much more interested in your words than in the production efforts of others.


Even though I have asked many times and have not got a response I will try again.

I have stated that in the last verse of exodus 34:28 it states that these are the ten commandments. "no where else in the bible does it state any other commandments as being the ten commandments and it is in these ten commandments that God reveals his name and list the ten commandments.

Would you please try and stick to exodus 34:1 - 34:28 and if you think that those verses in the bible are irrelevant please share why.
reasoning logic
 
  0  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 04:26 pm
@neologist,
Quote:
Yes. By all means do the research; then your questions will have merit. Pay attention to Setanta's posts. You know he and I disagree. Nevertheless, I respect the thought he (generally) applies to his responses.


I can trust what you say and if I question you then I will do a search

If God says he has many names then I can deal with that.
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 04:41 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:
. . . Even though I have asked many times and have not got a response I will try again.

I have stated that in the last verse of exodus 34:28 it states that these are the ten commandments. "no where else in the bible does it state any other commandments as being the ten commandments and it is in these ten commandments that God reveals his name and list the ten commandments.

Would you please try and stick to exodus 34:1 - 34:28 and if you think that those verses in the bible are irrelevant please share why.
Are you wondering why God added additional laws to the 10 commandments? I didn't count all that were in Exodus 34, but there are more in the writings of Moses, so many that the Law was impossible for any human to keep. This was intended so the Jews could recognize the Christ. As Paul said "the Law has become our tutor leading to Christ".
reasoning logic
 
  0  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 04:52 pm
@neologist,
Quote:
Are you wondering why God added additional laws to the 10 commandments?


No not at all, what I would like to know is why Christians call the ten commandments something different than what the bible does.
0 Replies
 
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 04:54 pm
@neologist,
Quote:
many that the Law was impossible for any human to keep.


Are you suggesting that God would ask more of someone than what they are able to do?
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 May, 2013 05:01 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:
neo wrote:
. . . many that the Law was impossible for any human to keep.
Are you suggesting that God would ask more of someone than what they are able to do?
There was no part of the law that, in itself, was impossible.
 

 
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