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American military program VS Switzerland's military program?

 
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Thu 21 Jun, 2012 09:02 pm
@Irishk,
Irishk wrote:

And tanks...
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_I4Snyzw2IMM/R8ZFKu6KLHI/AAAAAAAAAZI/F9-sAM85lVg/s400/SwissArmyTank.jpg
Swiss Army Tank


This is just awesome. Thanks for posting that.
0 Replies
 
Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Thu 21 Jun, 2012 09:15 pm
@George,
Don't forget the cuckoo clock, George, don't forget the cuckoo clock.
aspvenom
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 10:55 am
@Finn dAbuzz,
I know that every nation isn't perfect, and even the Switzerland has some faults. But the founding fathers who wrote the constitution had similar ideas to what the current model of Switzerland is.
Gee, I wonder why that is.

In quoting Hobbes’ phrase “keep them all in awe” is in line with realpolitik, and the maxims seen in middle east: “Divide and rule” and “My enemy’s enemy is my friend.” The military and technological growth regarding missiles and nuclear reactors are growing at a rate at which America will have a hard time regulating, and will likely lead to a proposition where America will have to ask its allies to engage in realpolitik to suppress the growth of the so called enemies.
What seems to be the right reason at the present, to partake in realpolitik, appears to create a larger problem in the future. It seems that America is in a predicament no matter whichever actions that is partaken. Withdrawal from the east could lead to an exponential momentum to the radical Muslim groups, and the outlook by the entire nation on America as a beaten nation. However, staying in the east could mean the same conclusion as if America left, however the events unfolding at a slower pace. Dictators have in many instances used realpolitik to keep people under power; however, they all fell to the power of nations under democracy where morality and idealism is at most important. At the current moment, it is safe to say that America still has a chance to remove the incorporations of realpolitik in its international affairs.

A government concerned with realpolitik extensively, in the sense of only taking into account power, and suggests an unpleasant prospect to look forward to. The outcome of the use of realpolitik is not simple but complex, relying on varying variables such as morality, wealth, alliances, and ethics, and, sometimes this contradicts with the values and morals that a nation holds.

Realpolitik is a necessarily evil that should be used in moderation. The problem with realpolitik is that international methods on a nation under realpolitik maybe to become subdued in the short term, nevertheless, given the opportune moment, and there is a high chance of revenge in the sake of pride, honor, or whatever the case. By trying to win favors, realpolitik will tend to do the opposite and deprive goodness, and charity of each nation to each other.

I understand that there will always be a dilemma between idealism and realpolitik.
It seems Switzerland's idea is moderation on the matter. Something America should consider with where it's going: heading downhill, end uncertain.
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 11:14 am
@Lustig Andrei,
Lustig Andrei wrote:

Don't forget the cuckoo clock, George, don't forget the cuckoo clock.


http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-qVwxsiPkzlE/Tx4WpYxLtAI/AAAAAAAAC1U/Y3J67twF0sk/s1600/linewelles.jpg

"So long, Holly!"
Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 11:21 am
@joefromchicago,
Precisely the scene I was thinking of when I posted that, Joe.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  2  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 02:59 pm
@aspvenom,
Drawing comparisons between Switzerland and the US; in terms of foreign and military policy is like comparing a horse drawn wagon to a tractor trailer.

Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 03:09 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:

Drawing comparisons between Switzerland and the US; in terms of foreign and military policy is like comparing a horse drawn wagon to a tractor trailer.
Indeed, Switzerland has no major dispute in its bilateral relations.

Btw: Hürlimann tractors are known as the Rolls-Royce of tractor brands.
But the Freiberger (Franches-Montagnes) really is a good wagon drawner
Finn dAbuzz
 
  2  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 03:14 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Nor any reason to have the expanse of bi-lateral relations the US has.
0 Replies
 
roger
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 03:19 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
SIG (Swiss Industrial Giant) is the Rolls-Royce of firearms brands. I do not believe, however, that they manufactor for export, leaving that to Germany, France, and Belgium, under their license.
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 03:25 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
which is which in your analogy?
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 03:38 pm
@roger,
The firearm branch of SIG ('G' stands for Gesellschaft = company) is owned by "SAN Swiss Arms AG" since 2000 when it was acquired by German investors.
roger
 
  2  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 04:04 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
I just knew you would be ingejumpin to help with my ubersetzengeshaft.
0 Replies
 
aspvenom
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Jun, 2012 08:25 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
You can't compare the two? Debatable, I say.
But there are some policies that could lend itself useful to America.

For example, Switzerland's military setup is less taxing on the whole country.

I'm gonna go on a tangent here, because of my disappointment in the government, and by the hopelessness in our military endeavor to bring "democracy" initiated by vile politicians who are reckless.
Spreading democracy to eastern people, brainwashed and abused by dictators. What a farce.
It only takes a few months for terrorists to wipe out the concept and structure of democracy set up after years and years of war in the east.

I understand that the world is interconnected more than ever than in the past, by the improvements in technology. That is all very good, but America should only pay attention to foreign issues that effect us domestically. There is no reason to use tax payers money to build new schools, hospitals, etc in Iraq and Afghanistan. It'll be likely rigged with IED's sooner or later. No stability in these eastern nations, no matter how many years we try to push the concept of democracy down their throat. That is the dilemma with terrorism.
It should be purely business, focusing only on the destruction of terrorism.
Rest of it should be getting the military out, then conducting secret intelligence gathering, and executing drastic measures in effect to nip rising oppositions in the bud.

Coming out off our hill top and saying we're willing to share with you, and love you sounds good and all, but if it doesn't benefit us, then there is no point, profit wise (This sounds cold and calculated but that is reality and what is needed in hostile situations).
space007
 
  0  
Reply Mon 25 Jun, 2012 04:04 am
@aspvenom,
Switzerland is small but strong. And America is much more stronger than any other countries on the planet.
aspvenom
 
  0  
Reply Tue 26 Jun, 2012 12:24 pm
@space007,
Quote:
And America is much more stronger than any other countries on the planet.


Well to stay there at the top, I would imagine it would have to pick itself from the big mudy pool that it is in right now.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Jun, 2012 04:58 pm
@ossobuco,
Guess
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  2  
Reply Tue 26 Jun, 2012 05:04 pm
@aspvenom,
Switzerland's military is less taxing because it is essentially for show.

Why do the Swiss need a military?

They have no enemies; they face no threats.

Their interests are protected by nations that actually can rationalize a military.

You can compare the Swiss and US military if yuou like, but the comparison is without meaning.
Walter Hinteler
 
  4  
Reply Tue 26 Jun, 2012 11:13 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:

Their interests are protected by nations that actually can rationalize a military.
Could you please name at least one of those treaties?
izzythepush
 
  2  
Reply Wed 27 Jun, 2012 07:51 am
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:
They have no enemies; they face no threats.


One of the problems with neutrality is that you have no allies. You could say they're surrounded by enemies.

Lets not forget the secrecy surrounding their banking system allows terrorists to pass funds around the world, dictators to steal their countries riches and the fabulously wealthy to evade tax.

If any country should be invaded Switzerland is a prime candidate, along with Liechtenstein, Monaco, the Cayman and Channel Islands. I know the last two are nominally British, but what the hell, I'm on a roll.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Jun, 2012 05:03 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
The Swiss don't need no stinking treaties.

Do you really think the US and Europe will stand by and watch Switzerland invaded without lifting a finger because there's no treaty in place?

Common Western heritage, but also possession of the wealth and secrets of powerful people.
 

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