BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 01:34 pm
@Linkat,
Quote:
I don't agree that the government should determine that a house/apartment building has to be smoke-free - it should be determined by the owner. Then whoever rents must abide by rules.


Sorry this is a matter of public health and the government indeed have a function in this matter.

For that matter the law does not allow you neighbor to full up your apartment up with the sound of his music so why should it allow him to full up your apartment with his smoke?
Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 01:35 pm
@BillRM,
If it is public housing then I agree - if it is private then no - you have the choice as a renter to go elsewhere - to rent from an owner that does not allow smoking.
Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 01:41 pm
@Linkat,
Linkat wrote:


What is everyone's thoughts on hotels that are smoke free?


In Hawaii, just about every hotel I've ever stayed in has a 'no-smoking rooms only' policy. However, just about every room at just about every hotel has a balcony or 'lanai' as they're called here. I've never had a front desk person tell me I can't step out on the lanai and light up. Perhaps if someone in the adjoiing room comlained, they'd call me or come up and ask me not to smoke. But that has never happened yet.

In California, the last time I stayed at a major hotel in San Francisco (three or four years ago), I had a room where smoking was permitted. I did not smoke in the room, however, for the simple reason that my wife has some respiratory problems and can get violently ill from breathing scond-hand smoke. (Plus, a former smoker herself, she now detests the stink.) But in the hotels in California, on all floors where smoking is permitted, there are signs posted which say (I'm paraphrasing): "The State of California has determined that smoking tobacco is a health hazard. In spite of this, this hotel permits guests to smoke in this area. Please be aware of this fact." I believe those are official signs, issued by the state's Departmet of Health, and, by law, must be displayed in all smoking areas of a place of public accommodation.
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 01:47 pm
@Linkat,
Linkat wrote:
What is everyone's thoughts on hotels that are smoke free?

The problem is that smokers will still smoke.

Then the hotel has to spray a bunch of chemicals to cover up the smell of the smoke. (A cure worse than the disease, because then you have smoke particles AND chemicals.)

I think they're better off having smoking floors.

My final thought, though, is that non-smoking hotels probably get better insurance rates. They give a wink-and-a-nod to the smokers.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 01:49 pm
@Linkat,
Sorry but the noise laws does not state that if it a private apartment building you are out of luck non should the law allow your neighbor to full your apartment up with his smoke because it is privately own.

You do not loss the rights to have peaceful possession of your apartment because the owner is a private person and not the government.

In fact under common laws going back hundreds of years the owner had a duty to insurance the peaceful use of the property you are renting from him and take actions again anyone who interfere with that use.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 02:00 pm
@mysteryman,
The principle is one of defense of non-smokers
who become the victims of ambient smokers.

I agree that government has no jd inside people's homes,
not for tobacco smoke and not for heroin,
but what government will do after USURPATION
of power only remains to be seen. It has a bad history.





David
Adam4Adam
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 02:41 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
I'm not a smoker and I finally bought my own home last year but before that I rented an apt and I signed a lease stating there would be no smoking, if they own the building I believe they should have the right not to rent to smokers.
Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 02:45 pm
@Adam4Adam,
Adam4Adam wrote:

I'm not a smoker and I finally bought my own home last year but before that I rented an apt and I signed a lease stating there would be no smoking, if they own the building I believe they should have the right not to rent to smokers.


I agree with you that the owner of the property should have the right to insist on a non-smoking policy in the units he/she rents out. The debate here,however, is whether the government has the right or the authority to require a building owner to institute such policies.

Btw, welcome to A2k!
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 02:52 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Come on David if smoke was not leaving the four walls and the two ceilings of a smoker apartment no one would give a ****.

Nor would there be any way to enforce an anti smoking law if smoking could not be detected outside the smoker apartment.

The title of this thread should be it will be illegal for smokers to cause their harmful smoke to enter other people apartments.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 02:57 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Quote:
The debate here,however, is whether the government has the right or the authority to require a building owner to institute such policies.
Btw,

The issue is whether smokers can subject others to their smoke with or without the apartment owner permisssion.



0 Replies
 
Adam4Adam
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 03:03 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Thanks!

Oh I see, well I really believe it should be up the the apt owner and not the government. What would they do next? tell home-owners they can't smoke in their own home?
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 03:17 pm
@Adam4Adam,
Quote:
Oh I see, well I really believe it should be up the the apt owner and not the government. What would they do next? tell home-owners they can't smoke in their own home?


Most homes do not share thin walls with their neighbors!!!!!!!!!!!
0 Replies
 
Phoenix32890
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 04:10 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
It sure the hell is in the cases where that smoke leave one person private space and enter into someone else private space!!!!!!!!


At what point is it unreasonable for the government to interfere in individuals' private lives?

I have three examples. My mom once lived in a garden apartment. There was an Indian family who used to cook with their windows open. The concentrated smell of garlic and Indian spices were enough to make one ill. Should the government have the right to tell those folks what they could or could not cook?

I once lived in an apartment. The people who lived over me had a little boy who would ride his toy truck every evening. They obviously had no carpet. Should the government pass a law to stop this child from riding his truck? The noise WAS affecting me.

Another example. There was a person who lived over me who would play Scheherazade every damn evening. It was played early in the evening, so I could not complain. To this day, I cannot stand that piece of music.

It seems to me that in all the cases that I have described, those issues, that were affecting others, could best be handled either by the rental agency, or the individuals involved.


BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 04:36 pm
@Phoenix32890,
I think off hand that placing a known cancer causing and other health impairing gas into your neighbors homes is way way way over the line no matter where you decide to draw the line concerning less serous harm such as cooking smells.
0 Replies
 
jcboy
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 04:50 pm
When I owned my condo in CA the HOA passed a rule the smokers could not smoke on their own patios because the smoke would go into peoples windows so the smokers all hung out by the trash bins and smoked. They couldn’t do anything if they smoked inside their own condo's though.

I’m allergic to cigarette smoke. My dad smoked but never inside, my mom would have had a fit if she ever smelled smoke in the house.
Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 05:09 pm
@jcboy,
I had the exact same experience here on the island of Hawaii, jcboy. Had a condo in Hilo where nobody was allowed to light up out on their private little lanais. Inside, of course, nobody could stop you. But, of course, my wife could stope me, so I smoked only out by the trash compactor in the parking lot. You certainly couldn't smoke anywhere near the swimming pool.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 05:17 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
Its the same as for having a no-pets policy that is enforced. Owners of properties have the investment burden to keep their properties desirable and smoking and pets are two of the biggest odor sources known (other than strewing corpses about)
Lustig Andrei
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 05:26 pm
@farmerman,
Well, of course I owned the condo itself (on paper, anyway). But the management people didn't see that it gave me any special rights outside the confines of the closed-in part of the unit.
Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 05:40 pm
@Phoenix32890,
and/or crazy neighbors
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Apr, 2012 07:45 pm
We allow people to smoke in the apartments where I work. By the time some of those people leave, the interior looks like a yellow cave. It takes some major work to restore them for the next persons. One apartment had three heavy smokers in succession. The current residents have had to pay for it. But, now their lease is up, they are getting out. I can't tell you how many times we have gone in there for related issues, even after special painting, replacing carpets and so forth. Don't understand why it is asking too much for a smoker to sit on the patio to light up.
0 Replies
 
 

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