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Separate but equal: single gender classrooms

 
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 07:01 pm
@ossobuco,
Oh it was, it was, osso!
A very male environment (not just the boys, male staff - the majority - too) , in which I spent something like 9 years of my early teaching career.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 07:09 pm
@Thomas,
I'm not sure if it was the '61 or '62 mcat book on med schools, but almost no women at all were admitted in the earlier year to u.s. med schools - so that's where I'm from. So, from my take, things were cattywampus in the u.s. fifties.

I don't know how much of that still goes on. I'm thinking women are doing ok.

I'm more interested, I think, in how boys like smart and curious Mo will get listened to - as well as shy girls, and bullied kids, and on and on. Maybe the separate thing could help or maybe it's one more stupid tangent instead of addressing real issues.


0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 07:11 pm
@boomerang,
It sounds quite promising, boomerang, especially not limiting the students' learning experiences to their age levels. I'm certain quite a few smart kids (in particular subjects they have particular expertise in) just daydream their way through, because they're not challenged nearly enough.

Could you tell us a bit about the school's curriculum? And how it compares with the usual mainstream offering.

If there are considerably more boys than girls at this school, I'd definitely support segregated classes in some subjects. Whether in a mainstream or alternative school.
sozobe
 
  2  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 07:11 pm
@boomerang,
boomerang wrote:
All of the middle schoolers are together and all of the high schoolers are together, just separated by gender.


Oh! That might be some of it then, I wonder?

Here it's a bit of a thing to keep the middle school students separate from the high school students. There are a lot of changes that happen in the 6th-to-9th grade range.

I think part of that is so the 17th-year-old boys aren't hitting on the 11-year-old girls, that sort of thing.

But that would still seem to hold true across all of the school day, not just classrooms, if so. So maybe not.

Edit: just saw msolga's post, that's an interesting point. I think that these days girls have much less of a problem speaking up than in the past, but if they're really outnumbered by boys, that may be different.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  2  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 07:13 pm
@boomerang,
I would not put sixth grade boys and eighth grade boys in the same classroom. My experience from both my childhood and watching my children is that eighth graders are much bigger, stronger and aggressive than sixth and seventh graders. Sixth graders still have a lot of little boy in them while eighth graders are proto-men both socially and physically.
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 07:21 pm
@engineer,
Yeah, that's definitely a problem, engineer ...
Weighing up those real social concerns against the learning goals/school philosophy.
It can be a pretty tough juggling act, particularly in a small school which has fewer organizational options than a big school.
0 Replies
 
boomerang
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 07:45 pm
@engineer,
That's a very good point and one I'm going to have to research and ponder.

I think I'd be more put off by it if that wasn't the case in so many very expensive private schools I've looked at. Add to that that there are only 60 kids in the entire middle school......
0 Replies
 
boomerang
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 07:46 pm
@msolga,
It is a promising school, msolga. I don't want to say what school it is on here but I'll send you a PM with a link to their program....
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 08:06 pm
@boomerang,
boomerang wrote:
Interesting, msolga and Thomas. Maybe they do this for the benefit of the girls.

I would guess that there are similar dynamics for boys who like knitting classes, or whatever the supposedly-girly courses are these days. Emancipating boys is not politically sexy so nobody's writing about it, but I would expect similar benefits for them.
boomerang
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 08:08 pm
@Thomas,
Huh.

I'll bet your right!
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Dec, 2011 08:19 pm
@Thomas,
Thomas, you would be amazed at the number of boys who opt for cooking electives these days ... & love it!
I'd say it's a 50/50 mix of boys & girls these days.
Must be the influence of all those male celebrity chefs! Smile
(I haven't seen too many knitting classes on offer recently.)
0 Replies
 
Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Dec, 2011 11:03 am
@msolga,
Just last year - the girls high school basketball team did pretty bad in one game - seemed the boys high school basketball team came to watch in support of the girl's team. The girls were too busy trying to look pretty and cute for the boys, they did not play to their potential. At least that is the story I got..
0 Replies
 
George
 
  2  
Reply Wed 7 Dec, 2011 03:15 pm
I went to an all-boys high school in the early sixties. I loved it. I felt
much more comfortable and less self-conscious than I had been in
eighth grade.

When my daughter was getting to be high school age I offered to send
her to a private all-girls school. She looked at me as if I'd suggested
"Get thee to a nunnery!" Non-starter.

My youngest son when to St. John's Prep, an all-boy's high school. This
was not about putting him into an all-male environment, but getting
him out of the male slacker culure at Stoneham H.S. St. John's was
great for him. Money well spent.
Mame
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Dec, 2011 03:20 pm
@George,
My ex went to a private school for a couple of years in high school for the same reason and feels he would have been more comfortable dating if he hadn't done so.
George
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Dec, 2011 03:23 pm
@Mame,
I was beyond hope anyway.
Mame
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Dec, 2011 03:55 pm
@George,
Well, I've always thought so... just didn't know the reason for it.
boomerang
 
  1  
Reply Wed 7 Dec, 2011 06:58 pm
@George,
Good to know. Thanks, George.

I've been thinking about this a lot today and I'm getting more comfortable with the idea as it pertains to Mo. I can see how it might not be the right decision for all kids though and I'm still curious about the policy.

Mo is outwardly very social but inwardly he frets about social things a lot. I think it's a "fake it till you make it" thing. Academically, anything that makes him less self conscious would be great.

Mo's kind of a chameleon. If he fell in with the slacker crowd he'd be a goner.
George
 
  1  
Reply Thu 8 Dec, 2011 08:07 am
@Mame,
Mame wrote:
Well, I've always thought so... just didn't know the reason for it.
Our name is Legion, for we are many.
0 Replies
 
George
 
  1  
Reply Thu 8 Dec, 2011 08:16 am
@boomerang,
boomerang wrote:
I've been thinking about this a lot today and I'm getting more comfortable
with the idea as it pertains to Mo. I can see how it might not be the right
decision for all kids though and I'm still curious about the policy. . .
Yeah, I don't think there's a one size fits all.
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  3  
Reply Thu 8 Dec, 2011 08:27 am
I just picked up a copy of Parenting in a waiting room, and flipped it open to an article about single-sex classrooms.

About a paragraph into it, we were called in, so I didn't read more.

Just looked for it and it (an article in Parenting on this subject anyway, didn't seem to be exactly the same one) was talking mostly about this article:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10200/1073727-53.stm

Excerpts:

Quote:
The single-gender model is premised on the idea that assigning students of only one sex to a classroom fosters a better learning environment by eliminating social pressures that can affect academic performance.

Under that theory, teachers don't have to deal with distractions created by students trying to navigate the intricate social balance of a coed environment. Students are free to express themselves without worrying about the pressures of impressing the opposite sex.

Detractors argue that the education process includes acquiring social skills needed in the coed world outside the schoolhouse. They say single-gender schools may well foster stereotypes and sexist sentiments about how boys and girls learn and may stunt their social maturity.

Wendy Kaminer, a Boston-based author, social critic and former national board member of the American Civil Liberties Union, contends that the single-gender movement bases its theory "mostly on assumption, hopes and stereotyping about different learning styles."

"They tend to exaggerate achievement results. But the truth is we still don't know that single-gender necessarily creates better schools," she said.

[...]

Advocates and opponents agree there is no overwhelming evidence that segregating students by gender is a superior model for raising academic achievement.

Leonard Sax, founder of the Exton, Pa.-based National Association for Single Sex Public Education, contends that single-gender schools are not the solution for every troubled school. When they are created merely for the sake of replacing a dysfunctional school with something different, the results are often disastrous, he said.

"Simply saying that it works in private schools is not useful," said Dr. Sax, who has written three books on the subject.

Numerous factors help explain why students flourish at single-gender schools -- especially at private and some public charter schools -- but none is more important than socioeconomic status, he said.

"The kids you'll find at The Ellis School are not representative of the kids coming from low-income neighborhoods," he said. "In private school and in charter schools, you have a selected group of students. They thrive in a culture of achievement that is created by stringent rules and standards. There is little room for error."

[....]

Research in brain development as well as test results show that the single-gender model is most likely to improve academic achievement for elementary students, he said. By the time they hit middle or high school, he said, it may be too late to change bad habits and academic acumen regardless of the type of school.


Emphasis mine.

This roughly jibes with what I remember, but mostly just passing it on. I do think it could work well for Mo, depends on a lot of things.
 

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