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Is religion the same as theism?

 
 
Cyracuz
 
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 09:06 am
On wikipedia "theism" is defined as the belief in the existence of a deity, or several deities.
"Religion is the belief in and worship of a god or gods, or a set of beliefs concerning the origin and purpose of the universe..." - Wiki on "religion".

But deities are projections of self. Regardless of what actually is, anything we are capable of percieveing is projections of self. Particularly anything we percieve ourselves not percieving.
To clarify, if we accept that we cannot really see a stone, just the measurments made of it that we refer to as the sensory experience of a stone, then the existence of everything becomes as controversial as the existence of god. And then it doesn't matter anymore.
If everything is projections of self, then study of self and how to define it to the greatest benefit to everything becomes the only possible and true religion... Religion is the process of defining yourself?

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kuvasz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 12:10 pm
@Cyracuz,
The latter is a sub-set of the former. After all, the term theism is most generally understood in the West to define a personal god and there are religions that have impersonal godheads.

So one could answer the question "do you believe in god" with "to which type of god do you refer? That with a small "g," or large "G?"
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 02:08 pm
No.
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  2  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 02:27 pm
physics-=the interest in what is.
metaphysics=the interest in what isn't.
religion=metaphysics
theism=metaphysics.
OmSigDavid=string theory
Cyracuz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 03:05 pm
@kuvasz,
What would you call an individuals determination to seek his identity, greater understanding and peace of mind?
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 03:55 pm
@Cyracuz,
a silly goose.
0 Replies
 
A Lyn Fei
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 06:14 pm
@Cyracuz,
You answered your own technical question with no, they are not the same thing. If they were, there would not be a need for two words when one would suffice. Would one call Christianity a religion? Would one call Buddhism a religion? Would you also call both of those theisms? I'm not sure it would be correct to do so.

The latter question I would answer yes to, as religion is a belief and a belief only comes from the believer. The world around us will never give us more than we can take. That would literally be impossible. Therefore, those who look for "signs" will receive them. Those who look for "facts" will likewise find them. And every tiny detail will always make just enough sense to believe. I wouldn't qualify the act of self definition a religion. What Wikipedia left out is that a religion must be recognized. Before something becomes a religion it is a cult. Before that, it is merely an idea.

Smile
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 06:22 pm
@Cyracuz,
That is true. Before the christian god came on the scene, the Greeks used the human form as gods. Greek mythology shows humans creating the earth, and all living things on it. That became the precursor of the christian god (man made in his image). Before then, all gods were animals, the sun, moon, mountains, rivers, and even other living things like trees.

Evolution in religion is as interesting as the kings, emperors, and conquerors of old.

dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 06:51 pm
@cicerone imposter,
well Sikhism for monotheism and then again the enigma of the trinity complicating the christian monotheism.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 06:54 pm
@dyslexia,
Yeah, I could never figure out what "father, son, and holy ghost" meant.
dyslexia
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 07:06 pm
@cicerone imposter,
it's easy, it's tri-monotheism.
0 Replies
 
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 07:12 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Some one told me that Rush Limbaugh was the father, Shawn Hannity was the baby jesus [son] and Glenn Beck was holier than any holy ghost.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 07:54 pm
@reasoning logic,
rl, We can always depend on you for the answer.
0 Replies
 
kuvasz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Sep, 2010 09:39 pm
@Cyracuz,
Sentience.
Cyracuz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Sep, 2010 07:56 am
@kuvasz,
You could call it that, kuvasz. But I know alot of sentient beings who do something entirely different. They have one thing in common, and that is that they are a miserable lot, always feeling bad about something.

Dys, your reply wasn't nearly as clever or witty as I have come to expect from you. I am disappointed Wink

The trinity, father, son and the holy ghost... That's a poetic rendering of the immortality of man. And it is indeed holy after a fashion. The idea is this: For you to exist now, the line of father and son has to be unbroken all the way down to the origin of life. If your line was at any point interrupted you wouldn't exist. This is the immortality of the human spirit, aka the holy ghost.
Christianity has, of course, perverted this idea in order to abuse it.

What I am proposing in this thread is that our definition of "religion" comes from a misunderstood version of the concept. One tainted by abuse and worse things. Christianity isn't religion; the thing inside a human being that makes it seek out christianity is.
Cyracuz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Sep, 2010 08:01 am
@A Lyn Fei,
I think that when a religion becomes recognized, as you put it, when it becomes organized, it has betrayed it's very function.

I agree with you that we find what we seek. Anything else is indeed impossible.
But how, then, can anything be anything but exploration of self? If you always find what you seek, and still you experience things you don't want and run into things you would rather avoid, doesn't that suggest that you might not know entirely what it is you are after?
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Sep, 2010 08:08 am
@Cyracuz,
spirituality is individual whereas, to me, religion is group
0 Replies
 
john2054
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Sep, 2010 08:10 am
@dyslexia,
metaphysics actually means beyond physics. It is a subject which includes all knowledge of the sciences of the world, and also attempts to look beyond the mundane to find the interconnectedness of all things. Which is NOT what you said!
0 Replies
 
john2054
 
  1  
Reply Fri 3 Sep, 2010 08:17 am
@Cyracuz,
Also I don't think that organised religion is bad per se. The problem seems to lie in man (and womans) ignorance of things, which they in turn bring to their faith. On this understanding then, it is not the fault of the faith where the dissalusions come in, because faith itself is surely a positive and righteous force. Like prayer, charity and love. And these are three of the founding tenants certainly of Christianity (check out corintians 1:13), but also of the other major world religions in practice, or so has been my experience of them anyway. Thanks for listening.
dyslexia
 
  0  
Reply Fri 3 Sep, 2010 08:18 am
@Cyracuz,
well Cyracruz, wit isn't my strong suit but actually I'm inclined to think of the trinity as just another failed attempt at a unified field theory. The logic doesn't hold up in physics or in theology. One can, at best, refer to both as a cosmological enigma. finite and unbounded.
 

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