Question for you

And by the way, I don't want that paranoid, jealous, insane, abusive god of Abraham, Issac and Jacob within 10 feet of me. As far as I am concerned that nutjob has a restraining order on his ass.

God restrains Himself from smiting sinners. He does this in order to give them time to repent of their sin.

I was being sarcastic, I no more believe in hell than i do heaven, for me neither exsists

Numpty, your sarcasm is lost as is any sensible argument against them. We were short of one nut job. Now the line up is complete. Campbell (Protestant Evangalist), Pinochet (Catholic), Sword of God (Islam) and Volunteer (Jewish).

They need to all of them get together. They have more in common amongst themselves than they can ever have with thinking people.

The Bible includes the Jewish Torah. That is the book you didn't know the name of.

Read a little more. You are painting all "religions" with the same brush.

Were you born and raised on an island? If not, then someone taught you your values. If you are in the USA and grew up here, for the most part you received teaching from your parents and society based on the Judeo-Christian ethic. The values you are proud of have their origin in the Bible.

Shalom


Hey Pino, what do you think of that?

Ditto. Sacrifices are worth making for worthwhile causes:

- To save a child: Good reason to die.

- To save a life: reasonably good reason to die.

- To save mankind: Hmm.....

- To save a species: Good reason to die.

- To be faithful to a god: freaking stupid reason to die.

The writers of the Bible died for their belief in God. They did not die for their lies, they died for what they knew was true. Jesus said, if you confess me before men, I will confess you before my Father which is in Heaven. If you have no hope and no God, then it would be stupid to die for a God you donot believe in. Better to enjoy the little life you have left, then to die for nothing. Yet if you know that God and all those who love you are in heaven, and are waiting for you. Then it's not stupid at all. God in the end will decide if you live or die anyway. A long time ago a friend of mine who lives in Africa fought with a man who tried to steal his car. The man had a sawed off shot gun and pulled the trigger twice, but the gun did not go off. The man stealing the car was caught, and the police commander was upset with my friend because of what could of happened to him. Shortly after that, the police commander took the thiefs gun and pointed it across a field pulling both triggers. Each time he pulled the trigger, the gun went off. The police commander then looked back and said, "my friend, you must be a man of God". As it turned out, my friend Terry, is a missionary. And God decided he was not going to die that day.

what kind of christanity are you talking about? The form i was raised with definitely didn't include the Torah!

and the values you so carelessly praise the bible for are included in other non-christain cultures!

and the values you so carelessly praise the bible for are included in other non-christain cultures!

Q:What is the Torah?

A:The first five books of the Bible.

What is your point?

Would you deny your beliefs to save your life, (whatever they may be)?

like if you are a believer and the only way you could live was to deny the existance of god, would you do it?

-or-

If you are an atheist would you claim belief in a god to save your life, would you do it?

Matthew 16:25 (KJV)
25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.

I am aware of what the bible says, but the question was what would you do?

Definitely not from monotheist nonsense.

I was taught that to be moral and kind to all sentient beings, to not harm anyone, to not tell lies, to help those less fortunate than oneself, to protect children with ones life if need be, to study hard and educate oneself for one's own growth and so as to contribute towards the betterment of this planet, all of these were a requirement of my being an intelligent human being and not because some man-made god would punish me otherwise.

In short, be good for the sake of being good, not because some god is watching over you. Hows that for values?

So, if I were raised to believe that it was OK to rape an infant until it was dead, would it be right for me to actually do that? If I believe with all my heart that I am doing that baby a favor by murdering it, that would make it right, right?

But you said that right and wrong are just a product of our upbringing.