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Evolution & Mutation in front of our eyes

 
 
Sabz5150
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Jan, 2008 07:00 am
@Campbell34,
Campbell34;50229 wrote:
NEANDERTHAL: NO RELATION
University Park, Pa. (10 July 1997) New evidence from mitochondrial DNA analyses indicates that the Neanderthal hominid was not related to human ancestors.
The results indicate that Neandertals did not comtribute mitochondrial DNA to modern Humans, says Dr. Mark Stoneking, associate professor of anthropology at Penn State. "Neandertals are not our ancestors."

And when you hear stories that DNA evidence shows a link between Neanderthals and humans you can believe that some Evolutionest are behind those false stories.

NEANDERTHAL: NO RELATION


Let me point out the flaw in this real fast.

"the Neanderthal hominid was not related to human ancestors"

is different from

"Neandertals are not our ancestors."

Their results more precisely indicate a common ancestor about 706,000 years ago, and a complete separation of the ancestors of the species about 376,000 years ago. Their results show that the genomes of modern humans and Neanderthals are at least 99.5% identical

Identical enough to be able to crossbreed, but an extremely low likelihood of something like that happening, even though the two species lived together.

This research shows, most importantly, that the two species were related.

Typical misconception #1: Neanderthals are our ancestors.

They are not. Neanderthals are another offshoot from the same ancestor as us. That's right! It's not just a straight line! That's why we call it a tree.

A new investigation suggests that at least 5% of the genetic material of modern Europeans and West Africans has an archaic origin, due to interbreeding with Neanderthal and a hitherto unknown archaic African population. Plagnol and Wall arrived at this result by first calculating a "null model" of genetic characteristics that would fulfill the requirement of descendence from Homo sapiens sapiens in a straight line. Next they compared this model to the current distribution and characteristics of existing genetic polymorphisms, and concluded that this "null model" deviated considerably from what would be expected. Genetic simulations indicated this 5% of DNA not accounted for by the null model corresponds to a substantial contribution to the European gene pool of up to 25%. Future investigation - including a full scale Neanderthal genome project - is expected to cast more light on the subject of genetic polymorphisms to supply more details. Contrary to the investigation of mtDNA, the study of polymorph mutations has the potential to answer the question whether - and to what extent - Homo neanderthalensis and Homo sapiens interbred.

Perhaps they got groovy a bit more than we expected. If they did, we'll know soon.
0 Replies
 
Sabz5150
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Jan, 2008 07:22 am
@Campbell34,
Campbell34;50232 wrote:
There were 35,000 figuriens, thats a little more than a few.


That's the trick! When has there EVER been a find like that? WHY would 35,000 figurines of dinos be stored like that? Explain how they are all pristine with no wear, no fragmented parts (broken in two =! fragment), nothing that even shows that they are the age which you claim.

Quote:
The figurines would of been documented more fully, but Evolutionest wanted nothing to do with them, that should be even obvious to you.


An archaeologist (someone who knows a thing or two about artifacts), completely refuted them. This guy isn't even a biological scientist. His field isn't evolutionary science. He looked at the artifacts, tested them, and said they are fake.

Why would an evolutionary scientist work on things from an archaeological science? We don't put biologists to work on artifacts. That's what archaeologists are for. That's their field.

Quote:
Why would you expect a science review to consider any evdence that would refute Evolution? Just like the Mexican figurines, they don't even believe the carbon dating. Evolution cover up evidence, they don't honestly look to uncover facts that would refute their religion.


If the evidence were real, we'd consider it. There's nothing you have brought forth that doesn't have a huge shadow of doubt behind it. Your figurines and petraglyphs don't stand up. Too many turn out to be hoaxes, the others are easily refuted.

Carbon dating is extremely inaccurate. Too many variables to factor in. We've covered this one.
Campbell34
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 Jan, 2008 10:28 pm
@Sabz5150,
Sabz5150;50235 wrote:
That's the trick! When has there EVER been a find like that? WHY would 35,000 figurines of dinos be stored like that? Explain how they are all pristine with no wear, no fragmented parts (broken in two =! fragment), nothing that even shows that they are the age which you claim.



An archaeologist (someone who knows a thing or two about artifacts), completely refuted them. This guy isn't even a biological scientist. His field isn't evolutionary science. He looked at the artifacts, tested them, and said they are fake.

Why would an evolutionary scientist work on things from an archaeological science? We don't put biologists to work on artifacts. That's what archaeologists are for. That's their field.



If the evidence were real, we'd consider it. There's nothing you have brought forth that doesn't have a huge shadow of doubt behind it. Your figurines and petraglyphs don't stand up. Too many turn out to be hoaxes, the others are easily refuted.

Carbon dating is extremely inaccurate. Too many variables to factor in. We've covered this one.


The archaeologist did not refute them when he was in Mexico, and confirmed that they were the real thing. Only when he got back with his peers did he suddenly change his mind. It's obvious he knows what side his bread is buttered on. And the only shadow of doubt is cast by your people not mine. And if archaeologist were honest they would of been right on top of those figurines, yet the expert that was sent, your guy, went through the entire collection in about a day, and confirmed they were real. Only when he got back home did he change his mind. So much for honest science. Thats pretty good, he must be very fast to be able to look at 35,000 figurines in one day.
Sabz5150
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Jan, 2008 06:08 am
@Campbell34,
Campbell34;50329 wrote:
The archaeologist did not refute them when he was in Mexico, and confirmed that they were the real thing. Only when he got back with his peers did he suddenly change his mind. It's obvious he knows what side his bread is buttered on. And the only shadow of doubt is cast by your people not mine. And if archaeologist were honest they would of been right on top of those figurines, yet the expert that was sent, your guy, went through the entire collection in about a day, and confirmed they were real. Only when he got back home did he change his mind. So much for honest science. Thats pretty good, he must be very fast to be able to look at 35,000 figurines in one day.


Now you're just twisting history.

"Archaeologist Charles C. Di Peso was working for the Amerind Foundation, an anthropological organization dedicated to preserving Native American culture. Di Peso examined the figures and determined that they were not authentic, and had instead been produced by local modern day farmers, publishing his results in the journal American Antiquity."

Acambaro figures - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

----

1 The figurines show every evidence of being recent folk art, fraudulently buried in an archeological excavation. De Peso (1953) made the following observations:

* The surfaces of the figurines were new. They were not marred by a patina or coating of soluble salts characteristic of genuinely old artifacts from the same area. The owner said none of the figures had been washed in acid. Edges of depressions were sharp and new. No dirt was packed into crevices.

* Genuine archeological relics of fragile items are almost always found in fragments. Finding more than 30,000 such items in pristine condition is unheard of. The excavators of the artifacts were "neither careful nor experienced" in their field technique, yet no marks of their shovels, mattocks, or picks were noted in any of the 32,000 specimens. Some figurines were broken, but the breaks were unworn and apparently deliberate to suggest age. No parts were missing.

* "The author spent two days watching the excavators burrow and dig; during the course of their search they managed to break a number of authentic prehistoric objects. On the second day the two struck a cache and the author examined the material in situ. The cache had been very recently buried by digging a down sloping tunnel into the black fill dirt of the prehistoric room. This fill ran to a depth of approximately 1.30 m. Within the stratum there were authentic Tarascan sherds, obsidian blades, tripod metates, manos, etc., but these objects held no concern for the excavators. In burying the cache of figurines, the natives had unwittingly cut some 15 cms. below the black fill into the sterile red earth floor of the prehistoric room. In back-filling the tunnel they mixed this red sterile earth with black earth; the tracing of their original excavation was, as a result, a simple task" (Di Peso 1953, 388).

* Fresh manure was found in the tunnel fill.

* Fingerprints were found in freshly packed earth that filled an excavated bowl.


2 The story of their discovery gives a motive for fraud. Waldemar Julsrud, who hired workers to excavate a Chupicuaro site in 1945, paid workers a peso apiece for intact figurines. It very well may have been more economical for the workers to make figurines than to discover and excavate them. Given the quantity that he received, the contribution to the peasants' economy would have been substantial.

3 The figurines are not from the Chupicuaro. They came from within a single-component Tarascan ruin. The Tarascan are post-classical and historical, emerging between 900 and 1522 C.E.

4 If authentic, the figurines imply even more archeological anomalies:

* If the figurines really were based on actual dinosaurs, why have no dinosaur fossils been found in the Acambaro region?
* Why did no other Mexican cultures record any dinosaurs?
* What caused the dinosaurs to disappear in the last 1,100 years?


-----

You've got quite a few questions to answer.
0 Replies
 
thomascrosthwaite
 
  1  
Reply Sat 12 Jan, 2008 03:18 pm
@Adam Bing,
The figurines show evidence of being recent folk art, fradulently burried in an archeological excavation. I read about a somewhat similar thing in a novel. I am sure that this is not the 1st time that something like this has happened. What these people get away with. These people are out to hi-jack the educational system and rewrite science and history. Learning,Speech,&Attention Defects | Man with learning disabilities, communication disorders, ADHD, becomes author
0 Replies
 
 

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