All worthy Gods must be able to produce perfect souls.

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All worthy Gods must be able to produce perfect souls.

In a world where god cannot create perfect souls and natures, like many believe is here, why do so many follow the God of their choice?

To some, all these Gods are losers who cannot maintain their level of perfection. Back sliding goods all.

I am sometimes criticized for believing in a God that has not lost His initial perfection that must persist throughout all times.

I must recognize the perfection of all around me if I am to be able to maintain my belief in the reality of this God. I do. Most do not.

My God embraces all that He has created, including all Bibles. They all have merit as works of mans expression of what the philosophy is of their God or Gods is. All political philosophies try to do the same thing.

God?s name than then be seen as Liberal party, Democratic party, Communist party, ad infinitum.
As well as Jesus and Jehovah and all others in their fine company.

If any God is the true God then, by definition, those who wait for mister fix it , cannot be waiting for the true God.

Strange.

People have forgotten that the first God was a man.

For God to be in our image and not some other, means that He wears His true image. He would not start a relationship with man based on deception.

We are animals. We were less civilized animals at some point in time.
In the animal world, the God of each animal is one of their own.
The God of ants is an ant.
The God of lions is a lion.
The God of men, must be a man.

Or His -everlasting- ?- consciousness.

Whether you follow a God or a Political philosophy, do not take it so seriously.

Bibles are not meant to be taken seriously. This is known from the fact that talking snakes and other novel ideas are introduced in it?s beginning. Hence the introduction of God as the Word also early in scripture.
As to other miracles. If God wanted us to believe that reality can somehow have miracles, then He would have left one here, other than all that we see, for us to ponder and wonder where He went wrong in the first place if we are not perfect.

If there is miracles then we are the best of the miracle stocks.
This is where we kick in the, God helps those who help themselves, reference.

The first God was a man first.

Regards
DL

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@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;60109 wrote:

The God of ants is an ant.
The God of lions is a lion.
The God of men, must be a man.

Really!? Do you have any evidence that ants and lions believe in gods of their kind? How do you know ants and lions do not believe in a man god?

This of course is all ignoring the fact that some men do not worship gods in the form of men, some men worship gods in the forms of animals, and yet other men worship gods with no form at all.

1 Reply

@Fatal Freedoms,

Fatal_Freedoms;60111 wrote:

Really!? Do you have any evidence that ants and lions believe in gods of their kind? How do you know ants and lions do not believe in a man god?

This of course is all ignoring the fact that some men do not worship gods in the form of men, some men worship gods in the forms of animals, and yet other men worship gods with no form at all.

Exactly my point.

Which of all the Gods we can think of would have the most pay back value?

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@Greatest I am cv,

Quote:

Which of all the Gods we can think of would have the most pay back value?

What do you mean by this?

Quote:

The first God was a man first.

How so? who was he?

1 Reply

@markx15,

markx15;60122 wrote:

What do you mean by this?

I mean that we should be looking for a God, be it spiritual or be it political, that satisfies the bulk of the desires that you have.

IE. A Gay person would be better served by a God or a political leader who recognizes that their soul is as perfect as all others and should not be discriminated and denigrated against without any clear cut reason..

How so? who was he?

God is nameless. He was the first true human. The Bible uses Adam as the first archetypal man. If you need to name Him then this is a good choice but hardly accurate.

Regards
DL

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@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;60116 wrote:

Exactly my point.

Which of all the Gods we can think of would have the most pay back value?

Regards
DL

What is your point? making statements about things you don't know such as what kind of gods animals may believe in...?

1 Reply

@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;60109 wrote:

All worthy Gods must be able to produce perfect souls.

In a world where god cannot create perfect souls and natures, like many believe is here, why do so many follo......
The first God was a man first.

Regards
DL

Why He should create perfect souls? God created this entire universe for His entertainment. If every body is perfect how then He will get entertainment by watching the cinema of creation! God created all the souls with equal independence so that those who want to become a perfect soul can become perfect soul by his or her own effort. It is the sole responsibility of the individual soul to decide, you cannot blame GOD for that.

1 Reply

@Fatal Freedoms,

Fatal_Freedoms;60146 wrote:

What is your point? making statements about things you don't know such as what kind of gods animals may believe in...?

Logic is good.

A God in any other immage than man would not do.

It is man that became God. Not a God trying to mimic man.

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@dattaswami cv,

dattaswami;60159 wrote:

Why He should create perfect souls? God created this entire universe for His entertainment. If every body is perfect how then He will get entertainment by watching the cinema of creation! God created all the souls with equal independence so that those who want to become a perfect soul can become perfect soul by his or her own effort. It is the sole responsibility of the individual soul to decide, you cannot blame GOD for that.

Scripture urges us to perfection. It must then be attainable by all souls.
and yes, if any fail to reach perfection, they can blame God.
If God is too incompetent to create a soul that will do what it is supposed to then God is to blame.

If the watch is defective it is not the watch that we blame, it is the watch maker.

If God is in the kitchen then He must take the heat.

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;60213 wrote:

A God in any other image than man would not do.

DL

why? Because you say so?

1 Reply

@Fatal Freedoms,

Fatal_Freedoms;60217 wrote:

why? Because you say so?

Logic and the Bible tells us exactly that.

What other species has a God that is not one of them?

None.

Why expect your God or our God to be different?

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;60214 wrote:

Scripture urges us to perfection. It must then be attainable by all souls.
and yes, if any fail to reach perfection, they can blame God.
If God is too incompetent to create a soul that will do what it is supposed to then God is to blame.

If the watch is defective it is not the watch that we blame, it is the watch maker.

If God is in the kitchen then He must take the heat.

Regards
DL

Greatest I am;

People often blame God stating that they are troubled since God created this world for His entertainment. They say that God is a sadist because He is entertained by their suffering. This is shear non-sense. God created this entire world consisting of the souls. Souls constitute Para Prakruti, which is a part of the creation. He gave complete freedom to the souls and gave the intelligence (Buddhi), which is the powerful faculty of discriminating good and bad. God propagated His constitution, which contains clearly the subjects of good and bad. The prophets propagated this constitution on this earth. Now if God is deriving entertainment on observing the creation, how can you call Him as sadist? He is not responsible for your desires and selection of good and bad for which you have the full freedom.

He is not responsible even for a trace of your desire and even for a trace of your subsequent action. The constitution gives only information and does not encourage you in anyway. A hotel is exhibiting a board listing the various items available for the food. The board is only for your information. According to your taste, capacity of digestion and problems of health, you have to select the suitable item of food. You cannot blame the hotel saying that the hotel is responsible for your indigestion, since it exhibited a particular item by which you are attracted! A person is standing in the balcony of his residence and is observing the traffic to get entertainment. Suppose an accident took place on the road, you cannot blame the observer to be responsible for the accident. You are well aware of the traffic rules and your over look of the rules is responsible for the accident.

The observation and entertainment of any spectator is not at all connected with the accident. The divine constitution consists of two parts. The first part is the Pravrutti, which is the social behavior to live in this world with peace and harmony. This Pravrutti is based on heaven, earth and hell, which are plus, zero and minus signs respectively. If you do social service helping the poor people, you will get heaven, which is a temporary pleasure proportional to the extent of your sacrifice in the social service. For this, you will receive the result on the earth also either partially or totally. If the result is not seen on the earth, you will receive the total result in the heaven after death. However, the result is not permanent (Kshenepunye?Gita) because your social service is not blended with divine mission.

If you do the service to your self and your family only, you will be living on this earth with happiness and peace provided you are not harming others with corruption and torture. For this also, the result is temporary because the result is confined to this temporary human life only. Anyway, in both the cases the result is temporary only. If you are confined to your self and your family only, there is no result after death and you will not enter the heaven for serving your family and your self. You will enter the heaven partially or totally for serving the weaker sections in the society but the stay in heaven is temporary. In doing social service, you may confine to your village, District, State, Country, Religion and Earth but you should not harm any living being in this service.

You must avoid corruption and torture of any living being on this earth in doing the service. If you are indulged in corruption and torture of any living being, the court here will punish you. If you escape the punishment here, God will punish you here partially and in the hell after the death partially or totally. The punishment of God is based on the transformation of the soul and not the revenge as observed in the terrorism. Terrorism wants revenge without aiming at the transformation of the soul. It does not understand the whole divine system and denies even God due to emotion. Emotion kills the analysis and patience will give happiness and permanent solution. Do not take law and order in to your hands. If the court or Government fails in implementing the justice, God will punish even the court and Government because human beings only constitute the court and Government, which can err. All this comes under Pravrutti. If you avoid the hell after death and punishments here by limiting your self to the service of your family and the society, God is pleased with you.

1 Reply

@dattaswami cv,

Dattaswamy

God is pleased when we use our God given souls and natures. They are perfect and good or evil we must be true to our natures.

We may not have a choice on this because our nature is just that and we must follow it. As God intended.

Even Satan does the work of God.

Regards
DL

0 Replies

@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;60228 wrote:

Logic and the Bible tells us exactly that.

Sorry, saying "logic" doesn't cut it! If you cannot explain to me what this assessment is based on then it is surely not logic but rather guesswork or personal conviction.

Quote:

What other species has a God that is not one of them?

WE DON'T KNOW! That is precisely my point, but it seems to have gone right over your head. We don't even know if animals believe in gods at all nonetheless what image those gods may take.

Why do you speak of things you have no knowledge of?

Quote:

Why expect your God or our God to be different?

why do you expect them to be the same? We are in no position to make such assumptions.

1 Reply

@Fatal Freedoms,

Fatal_Freedoms;60240 wrote:

Sorry, saying "logic" doesn't cut it! If you cannot explain to me what this assessment is based on then it is surely not logic but rather guesswork or personal conviction.

Without logic, none of us belongs here. If the world does not work in a logical way then we are all lost.

WE DON'T KNOW! That is precisely my point, but it seems to have gone right over your head. We don't even know if animals believe in gods at all nonetheless what image those gods may take.

Do you see fish telling dogs what to do or how to live. No. Dogs lead dogs.
Men must lead men. God was a man before He became a God.
In our immage.

Why do you speak of things you have no knowledge of?

why do you expect them to be the same? We are in no position to make such assumptions.

If not us then who?

Only a human can think like a human. Any human would conscider genocide evil. God does not do evil.

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@Greatest I am cv,

Greatest I am;60244 wrote:

If not us then who?

Without logic, none of us belongs here. If the world does not work in a logical way then we are all lost.

and again if you cannot explain your logic then it is not logic.

Quote:

Do you see fish telling dogs what to do or how to live. No. Dogs lead dogs.
Men must lead men. God was a man before He became a God.
In our immage.

There are so many problems with this reasoning i don't know where to begin.

First of all, fish can't tell dogs what to do because fish can't talk or otherwise communicate with dogs. Secondly, what restraints are on mortal creatures don't apply to deities. Thirdly, this doesn't follow anyway since someone people do worship animals despite the fact you don't see other animals telling people what to do.

Quote:

Only a human can think like a human.

such a restraint does not apply to deities, not to mention that this hypothetical god doesn't have to be real, simply that animals may believe in it.

Quote:

Any human would conscider genocide evil. God does not do evil.

except humans are the only animals that commit genocide.

1 Reply

@Fatal Freedoms,

Fatal_Freedoms;60246 wrote:

and again if you cannot explain your logic then it is not logic.

There are so many problems with this reasoning i don't know where to begin.

First of all, fish can't tell dogs what to do because fish can't talk or otherwise communicate with dogs. Secondly, what restraints are on mortal creatures don't apply to deities. Thirdly, this doesn't follow anyway since someone people do worship animals despite the fact you don't see other animals telling people what to do.

such a restraint does not apply to deities, not to mention that this hypothetical god doesn't have to be real, simply that animals may believe in it.

except humans are the only animals that commit genocide.

Yes, lesser animals may be brighter than us in this.

The limitation of God's is whatever men impose on them. God can only live in the minds of men. God can only have the attributes that we chose for Him.

We create Him.

In terms of the Bibles and limitations, would you follow a God that breaks His own laws. Kills men, lies. fornicates etc? In other words, shows all the failings of men.

Regards
DL

2 Replies

@Greatest I am cv,

Quote:

Scripture urges us to perfection. It must then be attainable by all souls.
and yes, if any fail to reach perfection, they can blame God.
If God is too incompetent to create a soul that will do what it is supposed to then God is to blame.

Maybe I misunderstood but it's not a correct statement. The Scriptures specifically says that we can't attain the perfection by any efforts!

For example Apostle Paul's theology was to believe and John's theology was to live, to reside in Christ.
The Old Testament Theology was built on the expectation of Messiah to come and to solve the problem of sin, but not of reaching the perfection. From my understanding this is Hinduism, Buddhism and to some extend Islam but not of Christianity.

1 Reply

@marcus cv,

marcus;60249 wrote:

Maybe I misunderstood but it's not a correct statement. The Scriptures specifically says that we can't attain the perfection by any efforts!

For example Apostle Paul's theology was to believe and John's theology was to live, to reside in Christ.
The Old Testament Theology was built on the expectation of Messiah to come and to solve the problem of sin, but not of reaching the perfection. From my understanding this is Hinduism, Buddhism and to some extend Islam but not of Christianity.

God is said to be the creator of all things and that all there is has been created by God.

God created the concept of sin. Why would He create something that He has to return to fix. How many other things does God screw up.

Are we the only blemish on God's continence or are others waiting for a tune up.

We cannot have it both ways. His works are either perfect or not. Choose.

Regards
DL

1 Reply

@Greatest I am cv,

2 Samuel 22:33
It is God who arms me with strength and makes my way perfect.

1 Reply

All worthy Gods must be able to produce perfect souls.

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