RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Oct, 2012 05:07 am
AWESOME SOLAR-POWERED FLOATING RESORT !!!!!
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/389052_435532706469971_1933887312_n.jpg
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Tue 23 Oct, 2012 06:28 pm
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/14405_10151448044785968_256585668_n.jpg
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 28 Oct, 2012 07:10 am
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/66576_489453787743471_971334389_n.jpg
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Tue 13 Nov, 2012 10:12 am
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/521594_469525406433326_742600861_n.jpg
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Nov, 2012 11:31 pm
There's no evidence that any particular storm or group of them is a result of global warming.

50 gigawatts of wind generating capacity (i.e. turbogererator output power at 100% capacity) yields at a maximum and under very favorable local wind conditions, about 15-16 gigawatts of actual output (a capacity factor in the vicinity of 30% which is typical of only the most efficient wind turbine installations - most are a good deal lower) . The equivalent capacity factor of coal plants is above 90%. Therefore 50 GW of coal plant capacity will deliver about 45GW of delivered power, while 50 GW of wind generating capacity will deliver only ~ 15 GW.

As a result the cited wind generating capacity is really equal to the output of about 12 standard coal-fired plants.

Moreover the capital cost of the wind installation you cited would exceed that of 45 coal fired plants , and delivered cost of the power so generated would be more than twice the cost of the same amount of power generated by coal plants..

However, you are merely talking to yourself in your private altersnate universe, so why should I bother?



This is typical of the very deceptive claims of renewable energy shills.
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Nov, 2012 11:46 pm
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:

There's no evidence that any particular storm or group of them is a result of global warming.

50 gigawatts of wind generating capacity (i.e. turbogererator output power at 100% capacity) yields at a maximum and under very favorable local wind conditions, about 15-16 gigawatts of actual output (a capacity factor in the vicinity of 30% which is typical of only the most efficient wind turbine installations - most are a good deal lower) . The equivalent capacity factor of coal plants is above 90%. Therefore 50 GW of coal plant capacity will deliver about 45GW of delivered power, while 50 GW of wind generating capacity will deliver only ~ 15 GW.

As a result the cited wind generating capacity is really equal to the output of about 12 standard coal-fired plants.

Moreover the capital cost of the wind installation you cited would exceed that of 45 coal fired plants , and delivered cost of the power so generated would be more than twice the cost of the same amount of power generated by coal plants..

However, you are merely talking to yourself in your private altersnate universe, so why should I bother?



This is typical of the very deceptive claims of renewable energy shills.


What part of "clean renewable energy" don't you understand?
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Wed 14 Nov, 2012 11:50 pm
@RexRed,
None at all. In fact it appears from your frequent erroneous claims that you understand it far less well than I do.
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Fri 16 Nov, 2012 08:34 pm
The Jobs Project: Unemployed Coal Miners Install Solar Panels In West Virginia
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/03/the-jobs-project_n_818006.html
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Nov, 2012 02:16 am
https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/382038_507457205939265_1323979323_n.jpg
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Nov, 2012 03:00 am
Huge Photovoltaic Solar Plant Delivering over 200 MW of Power
http://cleantechnica.com/2012/07/20/huge-photovoltaic-solar-plant-delivering-over-200-mw-of-power/
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Nov, 2012 12:27 pm
@RexRed,
Wow ! Considering the capacity factor of solar cells at Denmark's latitude, at the rate they are progressing, it will ontly take them another 120 years to have the equivalent of one standard coal or nuclear plant in terms of actual power output.
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Nov, 2012 02:10 am
@georgeob1,
So that (solar energy innovation) is the rut and reason why we should remain complacent on goals of cleaning up our energy footprint, neglect science and just continue to pollute? (cynical)

Your solution is not an option. So this makes any of your posts moot. Every electron has enough energy to fuel this planet and you want to just burn coal, oil and ruin our water supply with natural gas...?
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Nov, 2012 03:17 pm
@RexRed,
You haven't offered a solution either. Wind and solar power are so much more expensive than conventional sources that their mandated use (on a time scale consistent with those offered by AGW zealots) would cause mass starvation and political havoc.

There have been no facts yet established thast suggest that natural gas extraction will "ruin our water supply". Quite the contrary, the facts suggest the impacts are minimal and easily prevented. You are chasing prejudices and illusions here.

I have no idea what you mean by the following;
Quote:
Every electron has enough energy to fuel this planet,

The fact is the energies associated with changes in electron & ionic reactions, whether through chemical or incident radiation (as in solar cells) are well known and hardly sufficient in any individual case to "fuel this planet". However a somewhat related physical phenomenon, the energy within unstable nuclides of abundant elements, is millions of times greater than any reactions involving mere electrons.

That is the real source of manageable safe mass energy production for the planet without any adverse effects on our atmosphere.
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Nov, 2012 11:12 am
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:

You haven't offered a solution either. Wind and solar power are so much more expensive than conventional sources that their mandated use (on a time scale consistent with those offered by AGW zealots) would cause mass starvation and political havoc.

There have been no facts yet established thast suggest that natural gas extraction will "ruin our water supply". Quite the contrary, the facts suggest the impacts are minimal and easily prevented. You are chasing prejudices and illusions here.

I have no idea what you mean by the following;
Quote:
Every electron has enough energy to fuel this planet,

The fact is the energies associated with changes in electron & ionic reactions, whether through chemical or incident radiation (as in solar cells) are well known and hardly sufficient in any individual case to "fuel this planet". However a somewhat related physical phenomenon, the energy within unstable nuclides of abundant elements, is millions of times greater than any reactions involving mere electrons.

That is the real source of manageable safe mass energy production for the planet without any adverse effects on our atmosphere.


I am just paraphrasing Einstein when he said:

There is enough energy locked up in a grain of sand to boil 10 000 000 kettles and the energy equivalent of the average adult is about 7 x 1018 (7 000 000 000 000 000 000) joules of potential energy, enough to explode with the force of thirty hydrogen bombs!

You must likewise not understand that statement either.

Why? Because we have become complacent using primitive energy forms. Dark energy is only a theory now yet it is the only hypothesis that explains certain physical phenomenon. Were we to actually do some research and development into that field it could also yield new forms of usable free clean energy. It was worth it to spend billions to produce a bomb to blow up our neighbor but not worth it to solve our energy crisis. Seems like the wrong priorities. And you seem to be part of this very problem George. And what of when we run out of oil gas, coal, clean air and water? Oh then this path would be viable had we not already squandered away any chance of using it in a clean environment. You take for granted this earth and that these vital resources are finite while other forms of energy are nearly infinite.

I would rather trust the words of Issac Asimov, he wrote something to this effect, "Oil should be the match that lights the lamp not the fuel in the lamp."

And as for Denmark... It is a start and Germany is also in the upper hemisphere and they have accomplished even significantly greater results. As these technologies become much more efficient, no thanks to you and your kind, our need to use dirty fuels will diminish.

I remember when CD makers said that a CD could only be spun at 24x speed and it was physically impossible to spin it any faster without wobble and unreliable reads and writes. As you well know CD's spin today reliably at 52x speed. Should innovators have listened to the naysayers as yourself and simply give up at 24 speed? The same holds true for various energy cells, batteries and solar panels. This is unless you own stock in dirty energy and will do anything in your power to squelch new technologies so you can continue to make a buck on our nearly guaranteed self destruction.

Not so long ago Easter islanders saw no need to replant trees. They cut, hacked and slashed down the forests and used the trees indiscriminately for their building and energy needs. One day they cut down the last tree. When Spanish and Dutch traders came to their shores the island was bare, not containing a single tree. It is pretty hard to build boats out of rocks...

Not so many years hence we are not overpopulating a tiny island in the pacific but about to overpopulate the entire globe. Now it is not trees but oil and other finite resources. These resource are the one shot deal we have to populate the universe. Instead we are burning and wasting them till every last bit is used up without a single concern of what will replace such resources. We paint this finite commodity on cereal boxes like there is no end in sight. Are we doomed to repeat the mistakes of the past or can humanity learn plant seeds of research and development that will help us to reach into our bright energy future?

"Wind and energy are so much more expensive.." What will be the price of our ruined air, water and earth? We'll cross that bridge when we get there does not float boats... Can you afford to pay that price down the road? So let's just instead cut down every last tree, drill every last drop of oil... Is that the basic gist of your plan George? Well I personally take issue with your plan. Someone has got to.
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Nov, 2012 11:55 am
And how cheap is this energy?

Envision Solar, yes an American company, presents their new Solar tree concept on November 13. How cool is this? ~Emine
https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/382080_508895942462058_2104630357_n.jpg

Would ideals like this have ever gotten off the ground if people subscribed to your philosophy George? If each car side panel, hood, roof and hatch had solar panels that would also increase efficiency...
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Nov, 2012 03:03 pm
@RexRed,
RexRed wrote:

I am just paraphrasing Einstein when he said:

There is enough energy locked up in a grain of sand to boil 10 000 000 kettles and the energy equivalent of the average adult is about 7 x 1018 (7 000 000 000 000 000 000) joules of potential energy, enough to explode with the force of thirty hydrogen bombs!

You must likewise not understand that statement either.

In the contrary, that is exactly what I was referring to. The nuclear binding energy that is released in the decay of unstable nuclides or neutron induced fission of others is a a source of energy many orders of magnitude greater than that associated with the combustion or oxidation of organic molecules. These organic fuels are in turn far more concentrated sources of energy than are the photon collectors used in solar cells or the wind driven rotors used in wind turbines. Your favored solutions are going in the wrong direction, and aren't likely to be able to replace existing sourcers at a comparable cost anytime in the forseeable future. However we have at hand some very well, studied and mature nuclear technologies that have huge future potential, Unfortunately they are rejected out of hand by the naive advocates of green energy, despite the fact that the energy so generated has a far better safety record and involves far less environmental impact (anbd zero GHG emissions) than any comparable (in terms of generating potential) alternative.

My strong impression is that is precisely the "progressive" advocates of Green energy that you appear to so admire, who are the most vigorously opposed to either research or development of new forms of nuclear energy. The complacency you criticize is the mote in your own eye.
[/quote]
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Nov, 2012 03:40 pm
@georgeob1,
I am talking about future research into the electron and other sub atomic particles not using the current nuclear energy technology we have. The problem is once again current nuclear technology it is not clean... Yet a wind turbine is clean... Ask the people of Japan how clean nuclear energy is...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2012/11/20/would-a-carbon-tax-reduce-emissions-sharply-not-on-its-own/?wprss=rss_ezra-klein

The money from this tax (which I fully support and should have been implemented many years ago) should go into researching other clean technologies. We have been robbing the energy tax for years, we tax gas then divert the funds to other agencies. A carbon tax should go to finding non carbon energy solutions not towards building more roads and bridges (roads and bridges should come out of taxing the rich... After all, the rich need them to sell us their products...) but new schools dedicated to the science of better energy source discovery etc...


georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Nov, 2012 04:22 pm
@RexRed,
18 thousand people were killed in the offshore earthquake and tusnami that struck Japan. No one was killed by the Fukushima reactor damage that followed. At most about four workers were exposed to radiation above the level at which anyincreased incidence of long term disease is indicated by clinical data.

Nuclear powerplants emit zero GHG and they deliver energy at a cost that is competitive with coal or natural gas. The engineering problem of waste storage is well-understood and easily managed. France has produced more than 70% of its electricval energy with this technoilogy for over thirty years (thery're at 80% now), and done so without any ill effects. We have produced about 20% of our electrical power with nuclear energy for over thirty years, also with no ill effects. (Three Mile Island killed no one and the Public Health Service finds zero increased incidence of disease in the area since the accident.)

The research you are advocating is both poorly defined (physicists have yet to even detect "dark energy" - its existence is merely inferred by some gaps in our our cosmological theories - no one has ever found direct evidence or measures of it. There is no possibility that such research could deliver even the beginnings of a solution on the time scale indicated by the unproven theories of AGW zealots.

The carbon taxes in Europe haven't been measurably effective in either reducing emissions or fostoring research or innovation there. On what basis do you recite the illusory claims of others that defy actual experience.

You are merely casting about with your preconceived ideas, and ignoring reality. If you wish to be taken seriously by knowledgable people you will have to do much better than that.
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Nov, 2012 06:23 pm
@georgeob1,
georgeob1 wrote:

18 thousand people were killed in the offshore earthquake and tusnami that struck Japan. No one was killed by the Fukushima reactor damage that followed. At most about four workers were exposed to radiation above the level at which anyincreased incidence of long term disease is indicated by clinical data.

Nuclear powerplants emit zero GHG and they deliver energy at a cost that is competitive with coal or natural gas. The engineering problem of waste storage is well-understood and easily managed. France has produced more than 70% of its electricval energy with this technoilogy for over thirty years (thery're at 80% now), and done so without any ill effects. We have produced about 20% of our electrical power with nuclear energy for over thirty years, also with no ill effects. (Three Mile Island killed no one and the Public Health Service finds zero increased incidence of disease in the area since the accident.)

The research you are advocating is both poorly defined (physicists have yet to even detect "dark energy" - its existence is merely inferred by some gaps in our our cosmological theories - no one has ever found direct evidence or measures of it. There is no possibility that such research could deliver even the beginnings of a solution on the time scale indicated by the unproven theories of AGW zealots.

The carbon taxes in Europe haven't been measurably effective in either reducing emissions or fostoring research or innovation there. On what basis do you recite the illusory claims of others that defy actual experience.

You are merely casting about with your preconceived ideas, and ignoring reality. If you wish to be taken seriously by knowledgable people you will have to do much better than that.
One of today modern nuclear complex plants if it were to suffer a complete meltdown could render most life extinct on planet earth... And you were saying?...
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Tue 20 Nov, 2012 06:35 pm
Mutant Butterflies Found Near Fukushima
http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/08/14/mutant-butterflies-found-near-fukushima/

Now. If Japan were to go, it would be Chernobyl x4000. One meltdown would trigger another and all 4 of the nuclear plants will go off. It would ravage the country, making it unsuitable to live in. Not only that, it will contaminate the sea and the air around it, spreading hundreds of miles in all directions. Once it gets into the winds of the sea, the possibility of it reaching the American west coast is high (65-95%) with enough radiation to kill.

Comment: In light of this, how costly is nuclear power versus wind turbines and solar power again?
 

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