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Where does all the dirt come from?

 
 
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 07:46 am
This question may be archaeology, geology, geography or even bio-chemistry.

Basically, where does all our soil come from? I'll clarify the question. I understand that most archaeology (Roman coins, neolithic camp-sites, Georgian cellars etc etc) is found underground. I have heard that the reason for this is that, over a long period of time, the average 'ground-level' of the land rises - hence old stuff gets buried and built on top of. This makes sense. What doesn't make sense to me is why ground-level is rising in the first place?

The extra dirt/soil must come from somewhere. As soil is a mixture of sand, clay and organic matter, these constituents must come from somewhere. Does the sand & clay come from erosion of hilly/mountainous areas and get redistributed to low-lying areas? If all the organic matter comes from the death & decomposition of flora & fauna, does this mean that eventually there will not be enough spare free orgainc elements as they will have all been tied up in the soil? Will land-level increase over time until cliffs are a mile high? Or am I wrong?

Basically - is it a case of redistributing old soil, or the creation of new soil? Is the overall global amount of soil increasing, or staying the same?
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roger
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 08:53 am
I seem to have heard that granit decomposes, the feldspar breaking down into a clay, leaving the quartz as particles of sand. Organic material gets in there from growing stuff and solids from air polution settling out of the air.

Oh, ask farmerman. He knows all about clay and stuff.
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Craven de Kere
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 10:10 am
Re: Where does all the dirt come from?
Grand Duke wrote:
I have heard that the reason for this is that, over a long period of time, the average 'ground-level' of the land rises


Dunno if the average rises but it definitely becomes more average (more level).
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Noddy24
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 01:52 pm
Wind. Believe it or not, earthworms. Definitely believe people dumping trash on ruins. Trash attracts trash.
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roger
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 02:32 pm
That too. Middens are priceless finds, from what I hear.
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patiodog
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 02:49 pm
Well, if all the old civilizations were built on mountaintops, nothing would be buried. But mountains are worn down and deposited on the plains, were most of the old stuff was built. And why was the old stuff built on plains? Because that's where the soil was. And why was the soil there? Because it was always being deposited there.

A gross over-simplification, of course, but civilizations tend to get built where soil accumulates rather than where soil gets blown away, for the simple reason that it's a lot easier to grow food in the former place than in the latter. (Think Egypt, Mesopotamia, China's great rivers, most of India, the Mississippi River...)

Also, the people who lived in Rome after the Romans didn't necessarily think all that crap was worth saving, so they threw their own garbage on top of it.

And there may be a certain amount of entropy at work, even where there isn't much soil deposition (like, say, Macchu Picchu): keeping something on top of the ground means keeping it in orderly, which doesn't happen without the input of energy. Left on it's own devices over centuries, the stuff of a civilization is going to get mixed up with its surroundings, increasing disorder (entropy) and making the universe happy.

Or something. Just talking out of my ass (Francis the Talking Ass, wasn't it?).
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Noddy24
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 02:57 pm
We haven't even considered sliding mud and volcanic ash, to say nothing of weeds growing and rotting, growing and rotting.
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dyslexia
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 02:58 pm
most all dirt (so I'm told) originates from under my finger nails.
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patiodog
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 03:17 pm
Quote:
...to say nothing of weeds growing and rotting, growing and rotting.


Yes! Grabbing carbon dioxide from the air, mixing in a little light and water, and making sugar and oxygen! Those damn weeds are beautiful, aren't they?
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Noddy24
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 04:40 pm
Weeds are one of the most important products of the first agricultural revolution--they thrive best in disturbed soil and cut down on wind erosion.

Nature abhors a vacuum.
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Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 04:49 pm
Only sunlight penetrates to Earth (plus some cosmic dust and meterorite material) and only heat leaves the planet. Everything else is recycled. So if earth is building it comes from Earth.
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SealPoet
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 06:59 pm
There is a fairly large amount of that cosmic dust...

On a cosmic time scale, you could build a whole planet out of it.
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patiodog
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 07:09 pm
No I couldn't. I'd get tired.
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littlek
 
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Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 07:14 pm
Trees/plants are natural erosion deterents. They hold dirt to them and yes, when they die, they decompose into dirt. Mountains are slowly eroding into dust which is blowing/rolling/washing down to lower elevations. Rain depostis airborn dust on the ground, flooding waters deposit silt near rivers and other water bodies. Glaciers (for very old archeaology) deposit boulders/rocks/gravel/pebbles/dust onto many areas in the upper latitudes. And everything, basically, that's already been said before my post.
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roger
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 07:38 pm
um?
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Noddy24
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 07:43 pm
Other sources of debris:

Broken promises
Exploded rumors
Dashed hopes
Discontinued stories
Flailing egos
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littlek
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 10:24 pm
roger?
0 Replies
 
patiodog
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Nov, 2003 10:25 pm
what's the vector, victor?
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neil
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Nov, 2003 08:56 am
My guess is first world cities are not being buried, as we haul out many tons of trash, dirt, dust, and rubble from old buildings out of the cities. Typically we excavate deeper than the foundations of pervious building to get a firmer foundation for each new structure.
The older practice was to leave such portions of the old structure that seemed to make a good foundation for the new.
On the other hand my lawn is at least an inch higher than 40 years ago unless my fence posts are sinking deeper. Sinking of fence posts likely accounts for only about 1% of the apparent elevation increase. Neil
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Brandon9000
 
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Reply Wed 5 Nov, 2003 09:12 am
Dead animals probably also contribute to formation of soil, but I guess that was stated in the original post.
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