17
   

FORENSIC USE OF REGIONALISMS

 
 
Roberta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 03:08 am
@contrex,
contrex wrote:

Roberta wrote:
Sack means poke?


And vice versa. Where I come from, (England), "a pig in a poke" is something you shouldn't buy, a purchase made without prior inspection.



I've heard of a pig in a poke. I know you don't want one of them. I didn't know that a poke and a sack were the same.
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 03:27 am
@Roberta,
The expression (pig in a poke) is common to English speakers about anywhere, i'd assume, from its currency in North America, which despite the narrow vision of other English speakers, is not a monolith of a single idiom, or even of a handful of them. People in one part of a state or province will comment upon the strange speech of those from another part of the same state or province. In Illinois, people from the Chicogo area will often say "Saint Louie," while in the central part of the state, they will say "Saint Louis," and in southern Illinois, many of the native born say "Sant Louis."

It can also be observed that although people all over the country may use "wicked" as an intensifier, it frequent use in New England makes it noticeable as a regionalism. Some people will say sack rather than poke, while others will say gunny sack rather than either.

All in all, i'd say FM has a good point about regionalisms being a useful forensic tool. You would expect the dispute between sack, poke and gunny sack among countrymen--not so much among city dwellers. The use of particular words, and the pronunciation of them, can be clues to more narrowly identify someone. Arthur Conan Doyle's medical school mentor, Dr. Joseph Bell, was said to have been able to identify the exact neighborhood from which a patient came by their speech, and their profession from their appearance. I have no reason to assume that a veteran investigator today would be any less clever.
Roberta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 04:11 am
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:


All in all, i'd say FM has a good point about regionalisms being a useful forensic tool. You would expect the dispute between sack, poke and gunny sack among countrymen--not so much among city dwellers.


Aha! A gunny sack. Now you're talking my language.

Just remembering one of my first encounters with someone from a furrin land (someplace west of the Hudson River). She wanted pop. I thought she wanted an ice cream pop. No. She wanted soda.
0 Replies
 
solipsister
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 04:13 am
@farmerman,
forensics 4 and 6
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 04:35 am
Im familiar with the Pa Dutch dialect and its English regionalisms that result. People who are "Dutch Speakers" will always have the object of a sentence up feront just behind the verb.
"Throw the horse over the fence, some hay". This maintains itself as smaller regions will doctor that kind of sentence up by adding several different kinds of ejaculations as a separate phrase.

Like

""Throw the horse over the fence some hay" (Now once)--Fleetwood to Kutztown

"Throw the horse over the fence some hay" (say?!) Robesonia to Wernersville

These little speech mannerisms , included with several pronunciation clues can almost allow someone to pinpoint the town of origin for the speaker. Trouble is, not many Dutchman are criminls , and those that are , have usually been shamed into turning themselves in .

0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 04:40 am
It's them English ya gotta watch out for . . . they's the ones with the strange ways . . .
0 Replies
 
Letty
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 05:15 am
I'll bet not one of youse guys or gals know what this is.

http://www.banana-tree.com/catalog%20images/image323.jpg

Remember Homer and Jethro?

Parody on Jo Stafford's, "You Belong to Me."

Send me paw paws in a paper poke,
Send me money, honey, when I'm broke.
Make your will out to me
When you croak.

You Belong to Me. Razz
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 05:19 am
@Letty,
Very Happy
0 Replies
 
MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 10:41 am
As I remember, a gunny sack is a burlap sack, i.e. a very coarsely woven, rough sack, not just any sack but a particular kind, so it doesn't really contrast with sack, bag, poke.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 11:33 am
There are plenty of people in the United States who use the term gunny sack to mean any kind of non-descript sack, whether or not it is made of burlap. And they use it in contexts in which sack and poke are used by others.
0 Replies
 
Roberta
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 01:41 pm
It it ain't burlap, it ain't gunny (IMO).
0 Replies
 
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 01:49 pm
@edgarblythe,
I was fixin' to say something like that.
0 Replies
 
Chumly
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 10:51 pm
Forensic use of regionalisms would be iffy if using thesauri.
0 Replies
 
Rockhead
 
  1  
Reply Fri 19 Jun, 2009 11:03 pm
have we discussed bags yet?
0 Replies
 
High Seas
 
  2  
Reply Wed 24 Jun, 2009 03:04 pm
@farmerman,
Farmerman - forensic linguistics is a vast field, with applications in encryption, AI, textual analysis to determine the author, etc. Here's one of several books on your subject:
http://books.google.com/books?id=i3399LFSzqQC&pg=PA109&lpg=PA109&dq=word+frequency+test+linguistics+forensic&source=bl&ots=0FwlUoMCer&sig=se8uG1tBPRjoRlILyueqdO51Qbw&hl=en&ei=SJNCSuHfNJq0NYzqmcQH&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1

And this is another, specifically addressing law enforcement:
Quote:
....an analysis of all of the most important types of forensic text, including ransom demands, suicide notes, hate mail, smear mail, trick mail, and terrorist mail.

http://books.google.com/books?id=i3399LFSzqQC&dq=word+frequency+criminal+investigation+test+linguistics+forensic&source=gbs_navlinks_s
0 Replies
 
 

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