Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 08:34 am
I'm NOT an American Idol fan, for obvious reasons. But American Idol is hard to escape, and a bunch of my friends are appalled that Kris Allen won and seem to think that Adam Lambert lost only because he is (almost certainly) gay. I'm just curious what some of the more musically-inclined folk here think. Did Kris Allen deserve to win?
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Type: Question • Score: 13 • Views: 5,635 • Replies: 49
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Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 08:55 am
One of my Facebook "friends" from work has made weekly references to Lambert's "lifestyle".

He also posted something about having googled "adam lambert kissing a guy" and then posted the resulting picture. (I really had to restrain myself from asking a) why would one look for pictures of guys kissing and b) why one would think it a good idea to broadcast that behavior on Facebook.)

Much was also made of Allen's Christian background.
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Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 09:03 am
My daughter is so crushed that Adam lost, she's a huge fan.

I do think that the mid-western christian upbringing of Kris Allen was part of the
outcome. Adam clearly is a better singer and will make it in the music industry, no question about it, but he had to succumb to mainstream conservative America - much like we all do when it comes to elections.

As for American Idol, I think it was very apparent yesterday that conservative values were chosen over talent.
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Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 09:09 am
A few years back when Katherine McPhee from California lost to Taylor Hicks
from Arkansas, it seemed equally surprising, as Katherine clearly had a better voice.

I think that people from the mid-west are just more tuned into TV shows
in general. They do influence what we're seeing today, otherwise one cannot
explain why some sit coms have such a high rating.
Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 09:41 am
I agree - it is the target audience - not necessarily the individual's talent. And isn't that though what the idea is American Idol not most talented. This also is hard for me to determine as I haven't watched it, but from what I heard - Adam though very talented is not an idol to the average watcher of the show so what would you expect?

I had also heard there was a huge % of calls from Arkansas - is Kris from there I would guess - so it is more a demographics thing rather than a who is most talented.

In any case, if the person has talent, he is going to excel because of the publicity of the show - I figure if Adam is as talented as others I have heard said - he will only reap rewards from being on the show whether he is the winner or not so really what does it matter?
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Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 10:48 am
Adam IS a Star. He's the whole package - Unbelievable vocal talent, stage presence, likability, showmanship, etc. He's going to sell more records / downloads and have a longer career than Kris. It was telling that he was at home on stage with Kiss. He held his own with them.

Kris is also talented vocally. He has developed self confidence over the past couple of months, but still not the showmanship of Adam. He did well with his duet with Keith Urban, but there wasn't the comraderie that that Adam and Kiss had.

It's like I told Bear... women got screwed this year. Kris and Adam are both attractive, talented men but one is married and the other is gay.

Women watch Idol. Little girls watch Idol. Little girls and their Mommies dial endlessly to vote, go out to buy tickets to Idol concerts and purchase their CD's. Mommies aren't taking their little darlings to scream and cry and make posters for a gay rock/metal guy that wears make-up. They just wouldn't be good mommies if they did that.

Kris has talent. He'll do well. Adam will do better. That tends to be how it turns out every year. The second place person does better long term. Since Adam was my favorite, I'm okay with that result.
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Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 11:02 am
People in Arkansas have telephones? Who knew?
Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 11:06 am

OK, this has been helpful, thanks.

Re: mommies and gay guys, one thing a major Adam-fan friend of mine said is she's not, like, actually expecting to hook up with him, so she doesn't care if he's gay or straight. He's just very nice to look at!! (And listen to, evidently.)

Glad that also-rans have a good chance at a career though. I saw a few people say that NOT having to sing that horrible "No Boundaries" song was the real reward. Very Happy
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Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 12:09 pm
There was an interesting article in the SF Chronicle the other day (before the American Idol finale) about Lambert's sexuality. The article quotes a few gay rights activists who find it encouraging and promising that questions of Lambert's sexuality have surfaced--and no one seems to care all that much. People are curious about it and the matter gets discussed in gossip columns and such, but there seems not to be much outrage over the fact that an effeminate and possibly (probably?) homosexual man is becoming such a media darling. The gay rights activists mentioned in the article see this as a step forward.

I also heard someone mention yesterday that the finale outcome was probably the best of all possible worlds: Allen, whose wholesome image has its charm but which could otherwise hinder him in the world of entertainment, can only benefit from the victory; whereas Lambert's exuberant personality is strong enough to propel his career in spite of the loss, and so his exposure to the world at large was actually more important than a victory.
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Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 12:32 pm
What about Chris Daughtry - he has hit it big was I believe 4th on American Idol? He wasn't gay or too wild in dress - just a straight rocker type. The one who wins is the one who the audience likes the best bottom line (and whoever wants to spend the time calling in).

Being on the show gives you exposure - it can help launch a career - winning the show doesn't matter.
Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 01:01 pm
And of course there's Jennifer Hudson too.
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Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 01:07 pm
Trying to apply logic to this situation is bound to end in failure.

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Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 01:52 pm
Idol is a guilty pleasure but I never expect to hear anything new and Adam's retro-glam-rock was no exception. He has a good voice but so does Kris. Adam can hit the higher range notes but has to be carefully with "the screech." The vocal stylization -- both are equally adept and coming up with their own version of a vintage song. I think Kris got most of Danny's votes and tipped him over the edge -- if we ever learn how close the margin was, it was probably really thin. This time, however, I think the winner and the runner-up will both be equally successful. Adam is going to get signed to a label and do concerts and actually make more money to begin with. I always thought that Idol's cut-rate royalties on CD's and their weekly salary -- I believe it's $ 2,000.00 a week -- could be taken as a penalty for actually winning (they're trying to defray some of the cost of the show, obviously). The studio recording of Kris singing "No Boundaries" is far better than what he delivered on the stage and the interpretation better than Adam's (the song isn't as bad as most are making it out to be after hearing the studio recordings online but I noticed Simon naturally shied away from criticizing the song by subtly stating he wouldn't judge either one by the performance but by the body of work on the show). As far as the judges go, the dark horse won. His Christian roots? I believe he and Adam are both sincere when they stated that they had become close friends and we're going to show true sportsmanship when the winner was announced. So as far as Adam being gay (I think that's a given), it's obvious to me that Kris is a true Christian (not really many of them around) and doesn't pass judgment based on someone's sexuality.

Check out Kris' fairly length post-show interview:

Who's CD would I buy to make driving more pleasurable? Kris'.
Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 02:12 pm
I agree with alot you said - also another aspect is the type and style of their music. It is very different. That doesn't mean one is better than the other, simply it is difficult to rate two good singers that have different singing styles. If you like country, but dislike rap, you would naturally think the country singer is better (assuming both have talent of course). Perhaps that is why a more "mainstream" type of singer is more likely to win - just it appeals to more people in general.
Bi-Polar Bear
Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 02:20 pm
Adam is the complete package... the best that american Idol has ever offered. I suspect he's been signed and meeting with career planners for a few weeks. Kris is okay but shouldn't even have been on the final. It should have been danny. Adam will be better off financially and everyone except a few teeny boppers know who the real star is., so it doesn't matter. I wish them both the best but Kris isn't good enough to be Adams personal assistant.

The red headed girl is headed for one hell of a career as well if she gets a good manager. 17. wow.

as for gay, who gives a ****? Rob halford is gay...who wants to get in the ring with him? Laughing
Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 02:40 pm
@Bi-Polar Bear,
What? Rob Halford is gay?

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Green Witch
Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 02:41 pm
I think Adam came across as a little arrogant. Kris got the teenage girl vote and that's a lot of votes.

Below is a quote by Adam that makes it seem like America has never seen a metrosexual in eyeliner before:

"I think, maybe, I opened people's eyes up a little bit to something different. I'm a little different, and it was really exciting to have the support of the country," said Lambert. "Just to be able to take risks and be celebrated for that felt really, really good."

What about Marilyn Manson? David Bowie? Steven Tyler? etc. I think most Americans are fine with androgeny in the entertainment world.

Although, I agree with Gene Simmons when asked if Adam should join Kiss
- he said:
"He'd be better off joining Queen."
. I don't think he meant it as a gay slur, but literally because they need a new lead singer with Adam's abilities.

Here's where I pulled the quotes:

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Merry Andrew
Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 02:47 pm
Gad! I'm feeling sooo out of the mainstream. I have no idea whatever who-all you-all are talking about.
Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 02:55 pm
@Merry Andrew,
Aloha Andy, good to see you back at a2k!
I think the further west you go the less people watch TV. The weather is
too good to stay indoors and watch TV.

I've watched the last two seasons of American Idol mainly because of my
teen. She was complaining that all of her classmates were discussing the show
and she didn't want to be left out.
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Walter Hinteler
Reply Thu 21 May, 2009 02:57 pm
@Merry Andrew,
My niece and Mrs Walter are watching just now something, which could be/is equivalent to what is talked about here.

"Ignoramus" I was named by the Latin-speaking niece ...
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