Attention Texans: Religious right monkeying with our kids' t

It's a fight that will go on through all or most of the 21st Century. Eventually, one thought will stamp out the other. I used to believe people would accept evolution because it's true; now, I am starting to doubt the intelligence of people in general much more than in the past. I don't know who is actually going to win, for the first time in 40 years.

I agree.

That's why every time I see stories like these I feel compelled to donate to The National Center for Science Education.

hmm. A good idea, although I'll bet the creationists could come up with more funding.
Why don't they just leave science alone? Galileo won out eventually, so did Newton. Of couse, there were lots of deaths along the way, people saying god said the earth was flat. So we shall see about this Darwin. It's sad that most people who reject his views have never read his work.

Rational arguements just don't seem to work when you are dealing with irrational people. Persons that can take a more or less normal emotion or desire and proceed to construct a theory of everything from it are somewhat less than rational.

I don't know a polite way of stating this that is effective amongst those who find it profitable (one way or another) to completely disregard facts and to base their arguements on their wishes and dreams.

There are still plenty of things upon which reasonable men may differ without introducing the fanciful notions of long dead philosophers and theoligians.

So the problem remains. How do we point out that to the IDers and Creationists that so far the Intelligence or Creator exists only in their imaginations?

Something that exists in the imagination is perfectly real to the imaginer.
We've all had dreams and nightmares, we all can understand how real a dream or nightmare is. Claustrophobia, Agorophobia,and Paranoias are all real things to the sufferer. I suspect that Fear of Sin, Fear of Hell, Fear of Futility (is this all there is?) and Fear of Self Determination are all real fears to the person concerned. All these fears are well reinforced in human literature.



So (probably needs another thread) how can we explain the difference between a dream, a wish,or a reality, and convey that to the persons who are in charge of disseminating necessary facts to our young ones? This problem is compounded when the disbursers of fanciful theories have a real pecuniary and imagined moral interest in the outcome.

Ideas???

Edgar,
I prefer not to term this a "fight" any longer. I used to think that it was a fight between those that had a financial interest in the economic successes of their God(s) and the people in general. This is still true, but I forgive them that in the same way I forgive General Motors or the cigarette companies. They act in a rational way towards their stockholders, not the general public. The same with the churches.

General Motors, The Electric Companies, and the Churches and Mosques all answer a real or imagined human need. When the general public percieves pollution or auto safety as a fact associated with their products then the general public (government) has a duty to ameliorate these problems. I am not surprised that the companies that make unsafe vehicles, or pollute the air are not the first to bring that fact to our attention.

Organized Religion of any sort is in the business of answering peoples real or percieved needs. I would not expect them to be in the forefront of determining what is rational or factual any more than I would expect General Motors or Toyota to tell us that we don't need a car.

I am not surprised that a company that makes and sells devices for the amelioration of guilts, fears, and insecurities of humans does not inform us that most of these devices are not necessary, or that some of the devices are imaginary.

We cannot expect the religious groups to regulate themselves any more than we can expect the phone company to. Nor can we expect the government to do this.
Consequently it must fall upon the rationalists to take up for our youngest generation.
Public arguements, proper debates, and referenced facts must be employed generously, and calmly, and sympathetically.

I know that the IDers, and Creationists are ill.Help them to see facts,theories and ideas as the wonderful things that they are. Then perhaps they would not fear life so much as to need the quacks that they are employing to help them.