My brother in law with history of domestic violence is planning to live with us

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My husband and I are originally from Ukraine and have been living in California for the past 22 years. Both mine and his closest relatives are still there. When the war with Russia started almost 18 months ago we helped relocate my sister-in-law and 2 nephews to Canada through a program they opened up in the first weeks of the war for Ukrainians.
My brother-in-law had been in active forces for a few months but then got dismissed as taking care of a disabled parent. We then filled out his application for the same visa to Canada but because he applied months after my sister-in-law did and I guess there are thousands of people in line at this point, it’s been 8 months and he is still waiting .
Now there are rumors that Ukrainian government is planning to pass the law soon that will prohibit males 18-65 years of age to leave the country even if they were dismissed from active duty. My sister-in-law got terrified that her husband won’t be able to leave whatsoever so she decided we need to fill out U4U for him which is a sponsorship program in the United States that had been opened some time ago for Ukrainians and allows them to be paroled here for 2 years if there is a sponsor that guarantees to host them and pay for their living expenses. The thing is, if my brother in law gets accepted and comes here, but gets refused his Canadian visa, he will have to stay with us for 1.5-2 years till my sister in law gets her permanent residency in Canada and he applies to reunite with her.
I’m finally getting to my point here. My brother in law has a history of domestic violence, attempted sexual assault, and general anger management issues . He attacked his younger brother (my husband) with a knife once (nobody was injured), he beat up his wife once (my sister-in-law, the one currently staying in Canada); also after one New Years celebration where we all got pretty drunk, the next morning he tried to sexually assault me but
since he was still really drunk I was able to just push him off and go to another room. There were also other minor incidents where he wasn’t trying to harm anyone but that were nevertheless scary. That was years ago and since we have lived here for many years, I have no idea if there have been any other incidents like that since we left.
Now if he were to come here and live with us for 1.5-2 years, I would be stuck with him for the most of the day. I mostly work from home, and my husband mostly works from the office and is not there 8am-8pm. Our youngest daughter who is still with us is 14, and our middle one who is 20 goes to college not far from home and comes home for all holidays and long weekends. So it’s me and my 2 girls here (sometimes one), and I’m terrified by the thought about what could happen. He is not planning to learn English or work, he now has PTSD after a few months at war, and he also hasn’t had sex with his wife for 1.5 years since she left to Canada. So he will be literally sitting here all day long with 1-2-3 females under the same roof.
I talked to my husband about this and said I have been scared of his brother since the moment I met him, and definitely never planned to live with him for so long, especially without his wife and kids. He dismissed my concerns as being silly and said that it was years ago, that he was drunk then, and he is now alright. There is an alternate way to get him out of Ukraine before that law passes - we could rent him an apartment in Eastern Europe, we can afford that for as long as he needs it, and he could live there waiting for either his Canadian visa or reuniting with his family. But my husband is insisting on bringing him here. And my sister in law is quite adamant as well - somehow she got this idea that if he is in the States, he will be geographically closer to her and she will sleep better (even though they still won’t be able to see each other sooner).
My question is if there are any legal ways to stop him from coming to live with us, based on his history, which unfortunately is undocumented because nothing had been ever reported. I’ve been also thinking to tell my sister-in-law why I don’t want him here but she will of course get terribly offended and our relationship will be ruined. I tried to talk to her to see what their plan was if he does need to stay here for 1.5-2 years, and I told her that just sitting here not working or doing anything would probably be detrimental for his psyche, but she got angry and said that it looks like we don’t want him here. Any ideas what I should do? I’m prepared to see a lawyer if needed and if hubby and I don’t agree on a solution that works for everyone but I certainly don’t want it to come to that. Thank you so much 🙏🏻

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[+5] - jespah - 08/09/2023Yes, go see a lawyer. As for not telling your sister-in-law that you don't want your brother-in-law to live with you so she doesn't think that you don't want him thereâ��er, do you even...

@odessitka,

Yes, go see a lawyer.

As for not telling your sister-in-law that you don't want your brother-in-law to live with you so she doesn't think that you don't want him there—er, do you even hear yourself?

You don't want him there. Pretending that you do isn't going to do you any good. So, if you have to tank the relationship with your sister-in-law, then so be it.

You need to protect yourself and your girls. Period, end of story. Your sister-in-law becoming offended is the least of your concerns.

I'm actually a lot more troubled by your husband's attitude. He's ready to give his brother a free pass on assaults because it was a long time ago and the guy was drunk.

Those. Are. Not. Good. Enough. Explanations.

They are excuses, and they are exceedingly lame ones.

But let's say for sake of argument that your husband is right, it was a long time ago and the guy was drinking and it was an anomaly.

So, what, exactly, does your husband expect his brother will do all day long, stuck in the house, not knowing English and not working? I have to doubt that there are many Ukrainian speakers in your area. Probably not too many library books in Ukrainian, either.

I enjoy online stuff as much as the next person, but it only goes so far. And this is even getting an online degree, but from the sounds of it, I doubt the guy will be ambitious enough to do that without some massive prompting.

With no English skills, food shopping is probably out of the question. Driving would be problematic at best, and that's assuming he could get a license in the US in the first place.

What sorts of activities is he left with? Here are the only ones I could come up with:

Cooking and cleaning
Drinking
Doing drugs
Masturbating
Breaking the law in some way or another
Bothering you or your kids or both
Having an affair
Writing a book or otherwise making art (if he's shown no inclinations in this area, then he's not about to start)
Volunteering (which will likely require English language skills and will certainly smell a lot like work
Working out

Most of these are not productive uses of his time.

And if anyone thinks that he is going to magically become responsible and get a good job in the US or Canada after 1 1/2 - 2 years of being idle, I have a bridge to sell that person.

In the absolute best possible scenario, the guy will be bored out of his mind, end up being able to run a marathon, keep an immaculate house, make enough art for an art show, run a soup kitchen, and learn how to cook.

If 1/10 of any of those things does not sound even remotely possible (and I bet that's the case), then this scenario just leaves the guy with no social support system, no skills, no responsibilities, and no accountability.

My advice.

Talk to a lawyer, but also talk to your husband. But don't frame it in terms of your own discomfort or your worry for your daughters, as he's (unfairly, and disturbingly) dismissed that already.

Talk to your husband about his brother being bored, and losing his skills. About how if his brother doesn't learn English, he is committing himself and his wife to a life of poverty at best. About how his brother will be wasting a few years of his life.

Insist that your brother-in-law be enrolled in English classes and going to class. Insist that your brother-in-law be working or at least actively looking for work. And if he doesn't know English, then I've got news for him: any sort of interesting positions are utterly off the table. He'd likely be washing dishes or the like.

Insist that your husband lay down these laws to your brother-in-law.

And if your husband refuses, or your brother-in-law doesn't hold up his end of things?

Then take your girls and leave.

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@jespah,

Agree with all this but:

"Insist that your brother-in-law be enrolled in English classes and going to class. Insist that your brother-in-law be working or at least actively looking for work. And if he doesn't know English, then I've got news for him: any sort of interesting positions are utterly off the table. He'd likely be washing dishes or the like.

Insist that your husband lay down these laws to your brother-in-law."

I think your intention is this guy will not do these things. But what if he says he will? Would you take him in then?

No, of course not. I would though say similar to what jespah is saying that he will need these things, but you do not want you or your daughters to live in the same house as him. Does your husband really want to take a chance having them in the same house as this man? Even if it was just because he was drunk; which I doubt. What if he gets drunk again?

I agree get a lawyer so you know your options. This is scary knowing he also has PTSD who knows what that could trigger. Show sympathy for the situation, which I think you have by offering to get him and pay for a place to stay, but draw the line on him living in your house.

Oh just wanted to add, another reason not to agree to this, is you two are likely to be legally responsible for his actions since you are sponsoring him. I am not a lawyer, but it seems likely, I'd ask a lawyer to confirm. Do you really want to be responsible for someone with these issues?

1 Reply

Agree with all of the above. The most disturbing thing to me is your husband's dismissal of your concerns. And RP's point about you being responsible for him is, to me, completely untenable. It also doesn't sound like the guy would be in any way grateful. Sounds like a lazy, entitled ass. As for the PTSD, it comes in all forms and degrees. That's also worrisome.

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@jespah,

I appreciate your input so much. THANK YOU. I know how that sounds about my husband not taking my concerns seriously. He has always been like that when it comes to his relatives in Ukraine. He feels guilty that we were brave enough to leave and start a new life here, and have what we have now having been working hard all these years. And they haven’t. We have been trying to help them relocate all these years. Have been asking to learn the language, offering to help with visas and getting jobs, and generally help settling in until they can be on their own completely. They didn’t want to. They have actually never come to even visit in 22 years, even though I told them we would pay for their air tickets and absolutely everything they will need here. We wanted to show them our beautiful state so much and take them to Disneyland :-). Nope. So now when there is a war, they really need us and we have been helping financially and with all the paperwork as much as we can. And he thinks if there is anything else we can do, we should do it. His brother is his only sibling, and I’m the only child so they are our closest relatives apart from elderly parents. Also, the issues I described are not considered big issues in Ukraine but having lived here for so many years I now know better, and I don’t want anything to happen to my daughters or myself. I was reluctant to explain anything to my sister-in-law just yet but I did ask her what the plan was if he needs to stay with us for almost 2 years. As I said before she got kinda angry that I brought that up (it looks like she was expecting me to just say yes to anything they’d ask) but from a few of her long rants I gathered he was planning to just sit here and wait. He doesn’t have any hobbies, and with no English it’s going to be really hard to find anything, either a job or a volunteering position. And I know I won’t be able to just drag him to ESL classes against his will, and how long will that take even if he does agree to that. I guess I’ll keep talking to my husband and will also talk to my sister-in-law. Absolutely not looking forward to it, and I’m 100% certain she will pass everything I say to our mother-in-law, and that will make things much worse.

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@RPhalange,

Thank you very much for your reply! Do you know what kind of lawyer I need if it does come to that? Just a family lawyer? An immigration lawyer won’t be able to advise on this, correct? Or do I need both?

1 Reply

@Mame,

He’s not really entitled or lazy to be honest. At this point my sister-in-law is the one who has been pushing for this and pretty aggressively. And apparently the idea came from my mother-in-law. Like I said in one of my replies above, it feels like they are expecting us to do anything and everything for them because of the war, and it might be justifiable to some extent but they obviously didn’t even think about the possibility that that arrangement might not work for us or we might refuse for whatever reason. My husband would never ever say no to his parents or his brother, that’s just how he is. No matter what they do or say or how they are or what they did before. And again like I said we have been doing a lot for them, literally everything that we possibly could. And in this situation a great alternative would be to pay for his stay in Eastern Europe - but somehow they got offended by this offer and don’t understand why I don’t want him to come. Well, I guess I need to brace myself and tell them.

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@jespah,

Running a marathon is out of question - the guy, at his 52, has a ton of health issues and is a heavy smoker. Never cooked or cleaned in his life. He is handy with tools but won’t do anything by himself, he always needs my husband to keep him company and give instructions. And hubby works Mon-Fri and doesn’t get back till 8pm or later than that. Which only leaves weekends for any possible home improvement projects they could potentially undertake. There are really not many things he could busy himself with, and actually so many things he would be missing out on without learning the language.

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@jespah,

Hubby talked to him a couple days ago, and he literally told him (I heard that) that he would need to learn English and look for a job, that just sitting here doing nothing for such a long time is out of question. He said he understands but did not elaborate. There is a big chance that once he’s here hubby won’t be able to do anything. He can say he doesn’t feel like learning English at 52 and will want to, I don’t know, drive an Uber or something (if he’s able to pass the driving test that is). For which we would have to provide a car that we don’t have because we use ours on daily basis. Or will want to work construction which he should avoid at all cost because of his back and other health issues.

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Also, if we are legally married and the house legally belongs to both of us, can my husband really bring someone to live with us against my will? Does anybody know?

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@odessitka,

Odessitka, you have gotten some solid advice here and I just wanted to add some other aspects to it that haven't been mentioned yet!

First of all, you need to tell your husband that you're prepared to move with your daughters if he doesn't accept your very valid concerns towards your brother-in-law. If he's still insisting, consult a family attorney, they're the ones to help you.

Second, it's not only sponsoring a family member for up to 2 years, it a complete financial responsibility. You said he's 52 and in poor health. You've been here in the US for 22 years and since I also live in California, I know how expensive healthcare is everywhere and despite him probably getting Medi-Cal, this could be a very expensive endeavor for you to attend to his healthcare. You have kids in college and your youngest daughter wanting to go to college, that's where your money should be spent.

One of my neighbors is from the Ukraine and she brought her mother over to live with her. The family embraces her and help her feel at home, but.... She's too old to learn English and she doesn't know a soul here and is completely dependent on her daughter for everything. Financially it's quite a strain on my neighbor and she's dealing with a very unhappy person. Mom has been here for almost 2 years and is ready to go back home, because she's miserable. She wants to see her friends and family, everything that is familiar to her and she'd take the war over the living situation here.

Your brother-in-law would face similar problems: no friends, no familiar surroundings and no English would isolate him terribly. Having PTSD already, where do you think this isolation would lead him to?

If your husband is not listening to you, please write it down for him in a note and list all the points you have concerns with and all the points that are a deal breaker for you. If he's still unwilling to work with you on a solution, you are prepared to accept, then you need to think long and hard if you're an equal partner in your marriage.

The best solution for your brother in law is to live in another Eastern European country where they speak Russian and wait until he can reunite with his wife and children. You footing the bill for his stay there should be the only help given.

Your sister in law can check with immigration in Canada if it's possible to expedite her husbands visa so the family can be reunited. Usually, family members will receive preferred status. If her English is not good enough yet, then help her from your end. The goal is to reunite them without any detours to your home.

Good luck!

1 Reply

@odessitka,

Honestly I do not know what kind of lawyer. Here is a thought you speak about your mother in law coming up with this idea. Here is an idea, shouldn't your mother in law be helping her son and not you and your family? You and your husband have your own family unit to deal with and take care of.

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@odessitka,

This is a good question for a lawyer; you could ask a family lawyer and see if they would handle something like this, if they don't they would advise you who is best to speak with.

Also all you would need to bring up is the potential abuse of this man. If they feel the children are in danger (if they are minors), they will not allow this man to live there and if your husband allows it, they could take your children away from you.

Each state is different as far as laws, so you would need to speak to a lawyer in your state.

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@CalamityJane,

Thank you, greatly appreciated and all valid points all around . I completely understand all that. We have already checked on his visa status twice and they replied they are working on it but he still didn’t get it. It’s been 8 months and from what she’s been reading on FB most people that applied around the same time had already received their visa. I mean, there is still hope but the longer it’s taking the bleaker the outcome is seeming to be. The situation with elderly parents is familiar - mine came when the war started and only stayed for 6 weeks here. Since we both work full time, we could only spend evenings and weekends with them, and apparently it wasn’t enough and they felt lonely, even though we spent our every free minute with them, most of the time ignoring the kids because my parents only wanted to talk about the war, and the kids started leaving us at it on the third day. There is no Ukrainian community where we live or even any groups or anything.
It’s very hard for me to make this decision and refuse accommodation for our brother-in-law. He and his wife have been through so many hardships because of the war and this situation breaks my heart. But I’m scared out of my wits for my girls. What if all the stress really gets to him and he does something bad, given his prior behavior. Even the thought about it makes me break out in a cold sweat.

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@odessitka,

It is all in your head. Do not be anti-social just play along and be the best family member you could be.

Just give him a room or shed or build an area for him to live. Then convert it into a house extension or garage.

Seriously if lack faith in your own family then you might as well not have any faith at all to begin with.

If your really uncomfortable then just make some ground rules. I see tons of people from Ukrainian and Russia all over where I live.

1 Reply

@PoliteMight,

Thank you for taking time to reply! I’m wondering if you have children. I’m also wondering if you ever witnessed a man attack his brother, who happens to be your husband, with a knife. Or had your sister-in-law knock on your door in the middle of the night sobbing, with her face severely bruised, because her husband just beat her up. Or waken up in the morning because a drunk guy has mounted you and is trying to do something to you, while his wife is there in the same apartment. Because that’s the man that wants to come live with us. And if anything happens to my daughters, that is going to be my fault because I let that man into our home. We are not refusing help - we have been providing help for 18 months now and have offered a different kind of help this time that will work just as well. This is not an easy decision to make but I need to know my children are safe, especially in their own home.

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@odessitka,

So what have you decided? You've asked for advice and received some. It's up to you now. Don't listen to PM - he may be off his meds.

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@Mame,

I’ve tried to talk to my husband just this morning and unfortunately it didn’t go well. His arguments were, “this is my brother, he is a different person now, you are close minded, you need to learn to move on, and your fears are in your head - nothing’s gonna happen”. This is completely moot. He started shouting at the end and it was kinda scary. We have been together for 28 years, married for 23, and I have never seen him this furious before. We always made things work out but today he seemed completely out of his mind. He said even murderers get forgiveness🤷🏻‍♀️
I think I’m going to make an appointment with a family therapist to maybe make sense of things first, and will work from there.

1 Reply

@odessitka,

odessitka wrote:

I think I’m going to make an appointment with a family therapist to maybe make sense of things first, and will work from there.

That's a wise choice and I think this will give you a clearer picture in how to
proceed with your life. Good luck!

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