Who Would Downthumb Something Positively Positive?

The function of the thumbs is to support an ideological group. I am not saying it is the "intent", but it is how it works. That is the reason that engineer, and Real Music and Neptune (users that all have similar progressive views) are defending these thumb scores, while many of the people outside of this ideological bubble do not.

There is a big thumb score next to every post on this site. This thumb score tends to be positive for posts that express a progressive viewpoint whether they are well-thought out, civil or even factually accurate. The thumb score tends to be negative for posts that challenge the progressive viewpoint whether they factually accurate or not.

The thumbs serve as a way to promote group think. Having people hide their own scores from themselves doesn't solve the problem.

What the thumbs do is support an ideological bubble and at times reward rather uncivil posts in support a progressive point of view. If there was any evidence that the thumbs promoted accuracy or civility I would be more inclined to support them.

I am really interested in the term "heinous" (which Engineer used to justify downthumbing). Does heinous mean disagreeing with an ideological narrative?

Obviously things like antisemitism, and calls for violence would be considered heinous by most of us. You don't see that very often, and when I see it, I challenge it. I went to toe to toe with Coldjoints recent racist thread and called him out point by point. I did consider that to be a heinous thread.

But many times progressives use terms like "heinous" to express outrage that people have different perspectives on issues that have two sides. I have found on able2know that once I have been labled as "heinous" people have attacked me for positions that I don't actually hold.

I suppose it is a judgement call. In this case it seems like an intellectual shortcut, if you label people as "heinous" then you don't have to consider what they have to say. That means you never have to question your own beliefs.

If someone makes a good point that challenges your own ideological position, do you thumb them up... or do you thumb them down?

I'm going to assume that you don't have a job or a life outside of a2k. Not everyone feels the need to pointlessly run through a nonsense or heinous post and pointedly go counterblow for blow, counterpoint to point with every post that hits a2k. a2k isn't our occupation or slavish lifestyle. Get over yourself. Thumbing up/down is a tool provided by a2k. People will use, abuse, or leave alone said tool as per their desire in interacting with others here at a2k.

You can stay and continue to interact with people here at a2k or vamoose if you really don't like what's going on here. a2k will continue without you or us... et al.

The purpose of thumbs is to express support or disagreement. Anything else you see in there is part of your ideology or imagination. I can't see why you say giving you the ability to hide the thumbs doesn't solve the problem. You don't want to see that people disagree with you and others who want to express their disagreement can. It's a win-win. You don't get upset when you get negative feedback and others can express their opinions freely.

The purpose of a forum is for people to express themselves freely. (In words) In a democratic society, if someone disagrees with someone's words, that person is free to expess himself. A downthumb is only a sign of disapproval, or in the case of a2k, a way for people who have had personal disagreements to express disapproval of the poster, with no words to explain the reason for downvoting the post.

You want a feature where a group of people can express publicly visible disapproval of you behind your back?

I don't see how this is a good thing.

Not exactly. Posts with five or more downvotes get hidden from everyone.

Thumbdown abuse is being used by leftists to censor facts that contradict their demented ideology.

Turning off the ability to see thumbs would just allow people to be ignorant of the fact that they are being censored.

Geez Oralloy! I am trying to promote a more civil community here. One that accepts differing points of view. I am defending people who don't fit into the popular ideological bubble here... I think that includes you.

Your post calling their ideology "demented" isn't helpful. I don't like the idea that able2know is a place for two ideologies to stand apart and hurl insults at each other.

But leftist ideology is demented. Leftists are bad people.

It's up to you whether you see it or not. If you don't want feedback, you don't have to get it. I imagine the default would be to see it. It's the same as the ignore feature, if it detracts from your experience, you can edit it out.

Let me ask you this directly...

If there were a group of people who were ensuring that there was a big negative number next to all of your posts. If they were voting your posts down because of you as a person (not because of what you were writing).

1) Do you really think that this is a use of "downthumbs".

2) If this happened to you, would turning off the feature help.

(Actually, I don't care that much... and sometimes I get a kick out of downthumbs. But the feature has a negative impact on civility, and it is used by people to sit their own beliefs without truly considering other points of view.)

I have always believed that

- Upthumbs should be used to reward well-thought out arguments whether I agree with them or not.

- Downthumbs should only be used for uncivil behavior. If I disagree with you, that doesn't warrant a downthumb. If you make a personal attack, then I am using the downthumb to disapprove of something that hurts any civil discussion.

I think maybe we should agree on what thumbs are for... so far you have suggested they are a mark of agreement/disagreement, or a popularity contest.

The way you are describing them allows the ideological majority here to put a big fat positive number on each others posts, and a negative number on anyone simply for disagreeing with them (whether the posts are well thought out or not).

To be honest, I think as Neptune suggested, the downthumbs are used as a big middle finger from the progressives on this site to everyone else.

I don't think this is what you are experiencing. I think people are honestly disagreeing with your posts and when you post something people agree with you get up-thumbs. Look at the first page of this thread. You have several of the posts with the most thumbs up. If there were a cabal following you around as you believe, why are your posts so highly rated? You seem to believe that anyone who thumbs you down is doing so out of personal animus, not because they disagree with your position and if they disagree with your position, it is not because it does not conform with their personal experiences and belief system, but because they are trying to curry favor with people they have never met online. You should consider that it might just be because they honestly don't believe the same thing you do.

Yes. Same with the ignore button. I ignore people who make my A2K experience less enjoyable and it works great. If I did not value feedback on my posts or considered it a form of peer pressure, I wouldn't have a problem eliminating the thumbs.

I think you are the only person or perhaps a member of a small minority who considers thumbs as rewards for stating a poor position well. Everywhere else on the Internet and seemly here on A2K, thumbs up means like and thumbs down means dislike or disagree. That doesn't mean you can't use them as you see fit, but no way are you going to get the public at large to follow that lead.

I have had people (from the progressive clique) follow me around from post to post... but that wasn't to put thumbs, it was to throw the same insult.

And I have seen completely innocuous posts with negative scores. Clear people are voting based on the person rather than on the content.

And I've seen entire threads with every post thumbed down - but that is rare. Yes, there are some interesting posters out there. Doesn't mean you should crush down on the website features for everyone because of a few instances.

It isn't just a few instances. Leftist thumbdown abuse is pervasive throughout the site.

I'm just having a lot of fun watching grown ups argue about the importance of a cartoon thumb!....

We're all just kids at heart.

It is wrong for leftists to censor people who post facts.