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Plato as Humanist

 
 
Reply Wed 20 Mar, 2019 12:05 pm
The works of Plato have one unifying theme, a dramatic/dynamic between the logical qualifier and quantifier. The qualifier would inform us of the character of things by assigning one to another in a logical proposition. The quantifier would extend this character assignment to other things, as in a syllogism, yet in doing so it loses the character of the qualifier. But that loss is quite unrecognized until the quantifier finds its antecedent character completely missing from its presumptive count of it. But that recognition is an act of personal loss. An act only completely real in the recognition of the worth departed in it.

We cannot complete that realness alone. Our opinions are worthless until we offer them to that moment of recognition. And that means an accounting that cannot be achieved alone. An accounting that is rigorous and extensive enough to complete the loss of its extending or attenuating the aloneness of its originary character. Person (the actor in a world of passive effects) shows its quality in the characterology of its conviction. That is, in the changes to the character of that conviction a rigorous exposition of it elicits. That eliciting of personal realness in a world of passive fact can only be inspired by a critical review of differences between views the Socratic dialectic most explicitly embodies. The disciplined exposition of views is an act that has no correlate in a passive effect. Its only articulation is in terms of the community created among us between that act, of lost conviction, and the recognition of the worth of that loss only its alternative view can bring to it. This process may never settle matters of opinion, but by engaging the human, or personal character of interlocutors between opposing views, in a community as contrary to each other as to the conviction that only passive consequence to cause defines reality, we share in the drama, or the characterology, of our convictions. In this way, though we may always differ in our views, we may yet develop a language by which we understand each other and ourselves, who we most really are, as the dynamism of our convictions.

Human worth, the character of our changing convictions in the face of a formulary of extending those convictions only to an accounting of their conservation, becomes the language, not only of who we find ourselves to be, but of reality itself. Every text of Plato's is meant to demonstrate this. The most explicitly so is his Laws, in which two idiot old men from highly repressive regimes assert their laws are of divine origin. The Athenian Stranger proceeds to explore the merits of this theme, counting out a proposed social system designed on the conviction that only what conserves that conviction can be real. In the end we find that the counting out of that extended conviction can only be resolved in a human characteristic. The worth of lost conviction. Value is human, and number can only prove itself, however divinely inspired, inadequate to that worth.

It will be a tedious business to examine Laws for traces of altered perspectives on the part of the Stranger's companions, but as elusive as their powers of reflection may be, and as entrenched their conviction in the certitude and continuity, even the slightest deviation in them is a sweeping transformation so unrecognized by these stodgy old oligarchs as to constitute a perfect foil to the youthful unsettled and enthusiastic embrace of Socrates's reasoning in Republic. Seen in this light I think it is clear why Plato makes these two works the bookends of his career. The energy of reason to sweep away untenable opinion is limitless in youth, when the terms of those opinions have yet to be calcified in a lifetime of habit, as opposed to the minimal perceived alteration of opinion in the elderly even in the face of an ultimate recognition something unquantifiable is missing from them.

Socrates seems to have a genius for anticipating the arguments that will bring his interlocutor to the moment of recognition without bullying or manipulating his capacity as much for freedom as for reasoning. This may be an expedient employed by Plato, the other biographers portray Socrates as far less eloquent and tactful. But I have found that discussions with others tend to get bogged down in predispositions that stymie any effort to bring a new effort to bear in the work of understanding Plato. The very effort to produce a new lexicon of term and formulary of methods gets diverted into extensive efforts of partners in the discussion to correlate them to prepossessing frames of mind. For this reason I have withdrawn from the community. But, if there is anything in humanity that is not limited to being the effect of a predetermining cause, if we really are free, then the act of being that freedom, the act of being that breach in the causal nexus, requires a response in recognition of the worth the jeopardy of that act is places itself in. That act and that response, together, constitute a transforming moment in which every term and rational formulation, of both, is shown to be but an inhibiting stage setting for the real drama. But the ever-persistent and insistent 'background' creates a limitless distraction. No doubt this is why Plato puts us through such a lot of piffle, it is the fog that so tires us of losing our way that when we emerge into clarity we either hardly notice, or vastly overstate our awakening. I certainly have not got the talent for guiding others through that fog, neither yours nor mine. But if I'm allowed to cut-through it somewhat, and to continue to explain the work I have begun and, hope to fruitfully continue, I might be able to produce something of interest to the other contributors here. In any case, the dialectic is not a unilateral affair, and however successful I may think I have been by working alone, a solitary act is no threat to the causal nexus, no resistance to what would keep us from being free, unless it is given its opportunity for the response complementing its danger of becoming nothing at all with a recognition more its very real worth than anything at all. Anything at all, that is, that is no more real than the effect of a predetermining cause.



 
neptuneblue
 
  3  
Reply Wed 20 Mar, 2019 01:58 pm
@Gary M Washburn,
C+

It's hard to read. Sentences are fragmented or don't have a complete idea. Misplaced commas make pauses unnatural. Too many "this" and "that" qualifiers.

Compound sentences like this one needs re-worked and shortened to define what you are actually trying to say:
It will be a tedious business to examine Laws for traces of altered perspectives on the part of the Stranger's companions, but as elusive as their powers of reflection may be, and as entrenched their conviction in the certitude and continuity, even the slightest deviation in them is a sweeping transformation so unrecognized by these stodgy old oligarchs as to constitute a perfect foil to the youthful unsettled and enthusiastic embrace of Socrates's reasoning in Republic.

All in all, not bad.
0 Replies
 
PUNKEY
 
  1  
Reply Thu 21 Mar, 2019 06:17 am
Can you find an editor? There are basic punctuation issues and some of your sentences lose their meaning because of their complexity.
0 Replies
 
Gary M Washburn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Mar, 2019 06:50 am
“up from out of down in under there!”, but I did not come here to discuss Strunk and White, I had hoped there might be some interest in Plato, and maybe even a readiness to suppose I might have something of interest to offer on him. I come here to show how Plato is explaining to us that mind and reality is fundamentally personal. That is to say, there is something to reality that necessitates the potential for something like “person”, and that in the course of the evolution of life that potential energizes, necessitates even the potential for the development of something like what we call “human”. An act. An act that so conveys a legacy of worth only real in our response recognizing it that that act and response reveals and constitutes the engine of reality itself. Time and reality is value, not fact. The Christian era worked mightily to dehumanize value, to “elevate” it to a “higher realm”, and has deeply prejudiced us against the profane realness of that dynamic of act and recognition that is the truer place of our aspirations to understand. Science has got us supposing we have outgrown that prejudice, but in a powerful way it has simply retrenched it as a kind of unrecognized dogma. The very structure of mind we have erected as the form of a proposition proscribes our ever seeing the meaning that Plato tries to teach us. The propositional form is not a rigid determination, it is a qualification of a subject and predicate by each other, equally participating in the moment of that quality. The verb “to be”, usually taking the form “is” in that predication, is so vapid as to shroud any qualifying the subject and predicate otherwise actively engage each other in. In this sense “is” gets used so determinately as to constitute a quantifier, with no possible active modification of the meaning of either subject or predicate of each other. In this way we convince ourselves that established assertions need not be reexamined as we proceed through an extensive strain of reasoning. We put the dog in the kennel, and then suppose we can safely go searching for the cat without being hounded by its nemesis. But Plato shows us time and time again that mind is its own nemesis. And if we don't let it hound us down, finding the cat will not achieve our stated aim of learning how they belong together in freedom.

Is a proposition a placement of one thing inside another? Or a repudiation of such penning things down? Are predicate and subject somehow same? Or do they differ each other in a sense no sameness can ever express or realize? If you study biology, it becomes clear that life is not generated through a process of replication, though only systems of replication can be studied by our current methods and prejudices. No, only differentiation can transform a blob of cells into an organism, and only the ability of that organism to recognize the worth to it of each act of differentiation, that only an individual cell can achieve, can be the reality of that organism. And yet we do not today have the intellectual tools to recognize that reality only the smallest most individual act is of the organism as a whole. In physics we now know that matter gets up to what can only be described a chaos, and that we only experience it as a sort of self-erasure of all that chaos, of which, or so it seems, only regularized, quantifiable forms can be observed, measured, and tested. But, like life that offers us no hope of knowing how valuable untraceable changes among individual cells are to our experience of the organism as a whole, that unquantifiable chaos of matter is only known to us as the unrecognized quality of its activity. Systems of calculation on the quantum level are specifically and explicitly designed to render that activity, and worth, unrecognized (I can fully explain how calculus defrauds us of what it claims to reveal to us). The propositional forms of symbolic logic only succeed, if at all, by relegating the origin of terms, even the terms of those forms, to a status of implacable enigma. We build our “thinking machines” precisely designing them to preclude any active role of terms, or words, in their own emergence. A baby, saying “mommy” for the first time is not computing. There is a chaos hidden from us that enrichens all that is to such an extent it is clearly unimaginable that there ever could be a machine to rival what matter and life does, and does in a profane and mundane way. I'd like to see a robot car try to negotiate a country road in mud season!

I am contemplating a study of Plato's Laws, I have already assured myself that he is showing us here the desperate way we cling to the quantifier, and how that desperation ultimately results in recognition of the qualifier. Three decades ago I did a study of the bulk of his other work that started badly, but improved greatly as I progressed. Over four years into this I decided that I needed to season my thoughts, and spent the intervening years developing and recording the result, which went rather well, in the most important sense. But now that I have an extensive record of my perspectives, and have reached that age Plato was when writing his Laws, I may be ready to proceed with an in-depth analysis of that dialogue, along with several others I got through too early, or deliberately set aside for the current effort. But if no interest is expressed here I must take my effort elsewhere, or just keep it to myself.
neptuneblue
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Mar, 2019 07:41 am
@Gary M Washburn,
F

You received a solid critique only to disregard what was said.

Too many "I" statements, cut back on that.

The over-abundant usage of quotation marks is unnecessary. This phrase, "to “elevate” it to a “higher realm”" does not need quotation marks to set it off.

No breakdown into easily readable paragraphs. Please, work on that.



You are trying to impress the reader with your assessment but failing due to your writing style.

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