"The Republic" of Plato

Re: "The Republic" of Plato


Latin : Res publica = public thing.

lol I thought that it was for the public, but I guess I was wrong about that.

I'm not sure whether the concept of a Republic was derived from Plato's book, but I highly doubt it. Plato's political theory is very different from any Republic concept today.

I would have thought that the republic is a Greek concept. Your Latin quotation surprises me, Francis, and I wonder what would be the Greek word for republic.

Yes, Ray, you are right, the ideal society of Plato, as described in "The Republic", is closer to a communist system than a republic as we see it today. I wonder if Karl Marx had "borrowed" some ideas from Plato in writing his Manifesto. Did anyone read that book?

I don't think he did, but I'm not sure. Plato's political views are still quite different from Marx's. I've read excerpts of the Communist Manifesto in my history class, and it was mainly complaining about how the working class have become like a machine, with values destroyed, and this is all due to the Bourgeoisie. He advocated the destruction of the class system so that only the working class remains. Anyways, the only link I could see between Marx's and Plato's work is of the "Vanguard" that Marx mentioned. The Vanguards are the intellectuals that are to lead the revolution. This is similar to the Philosopher Kings from Plato's views, but not exactly.

Plato sees three levels: Philosopher Kings, Warrior Class, and Citizens.
The Philosopher Kings are supposed to be poor, so that no one else would crave for the position, thus eliminating greed as a reason behind being the philosopher king. The Warrior class is to have the virtue of honour and is there to protect the state. The citizens are normal individuals.
There's also a twist in his ideas. The Philosopher Kings are to be "bred". If a child possesses characteristics of a philosopher king, the child could be taken to be a philosopehr king, and they must mate with other intellectuals.

Marx, on the other hand, views that a government controlled state would exist for a while after the revolution, and then when society has enough resources to function on its own, the government would be abolished. Also, there would be no private properties.

Of course, communist countries today aren't communist in Marx's sense, because practically, Marx's theory does not work, although that's up for debate. Same thing with Plato.

I agree with you that "republic" is a greek concept. Only we use latin terms to define it.

BTW,

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No prob Bram. Glad to help a fellow Canadian . I got that off memory so I'm not sure if it's sound.

I think that Marx's materialist hegelian dialecticism is a wrong view to take. Up for debate I guess. It's kinda ironic that he was also influenced by Adam Smith...

Hegelian? Gee, are you sure you speak Canadian, Ray?

Maybe Marx was influenced negatively by Adam Smith? :wink:

Any way, I don't think any system advocated by a single author would be good for all things. Fortunately, I think we learned from our past historical events and modify our systems accordingly. Hopefully, we keep the good things and let go of the bad.

lol, I just learned that... Maybe it's not an actual word , but Hegel was a philosopher. He was an idealist seeing things in opposing views. Marx took this in a materialist style (his view on Bourgeiosie vs. working class)...

Pretty interesting eh?

Yeah, I think Smith influenced him negatively. Maybe he took the "no government intervention" thing a bit too seriously.