Where is East?

You're just spreading more bullshit. There is absolutely no reason to suggest that religion spread from Babylon to the rest of the world. It is certainly hilarious to see a claim that anything in the middle east had an influence on Mesoamerica--until the Spanish arrived in 1519. The city of Babylon did not exist 6000 years ago. It was not founded until circa 2300 BCE. Really, you should just stop.

Go!
Too much sun son
Sun sun sun sun

He's clergy ordained (sun sun sun sun)
Babble on's his game
The hiya power's disguise
Is a gas ball in his eyes
Pagans in the moon and the sun

Go!
Too much sun son
Woo oo ooo err

Set you share your vinegar and ego in your own threads please. All you are adding to this conversation is arrogance.

Can you quote where I said Babylon existed 6000 years ago?

If not then please leave this thread.

It is funny that whenever I get a thread that lands on the popular page you have to come in and bugger it all up with your lousy attitude and puffed up innuendo.

6000 years ago is when the Jews say the flood occurred and Noah lived. If you were not thinking out of your ego you might have gleaned that from my writing.

I can show hundreds if not thousands of cases where Babylonian learning has spread throughout the world but frankly you are about one shade away from me putting you on ignore. I really don't like your attitude and how you have to constantly twist my words to try and provoke anger out of me. I have better things to do.

I will place you on ignore with all of the other a2k trolls if you can't be erm... civilized...

Perhaps you don't like a discussion on Babylon because they conquered Judea... I get it but, get over it. The rest of the world has.

Alexander the Great then conquered Babylon... that is the way it is, like it or lump it.

Paganism conquered Judea long before Babylon did.

Also, someone voted down one of your posts here. It wasn't me, it seems you have ruffled a few feathers of others with your prevalent and arrogant attitude.

Paleo-Indians
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleo-Indians

According to this wiki article it seems "the archaic period" was the time when Mesoamericans changed from small bands of hunter gatherers to larger groups of people capable of some sort of ritualized life.

You need to be more careful about what you write. Most of it is vague and ambiguous enough that you always have an escape hatch. Babylon was not an entity that did anything. I don't give a rat's ass about anyone's religion or religious obsessions. I'm not about to leave the thread, and you are welcome to put me on ignore. That will certainly be no skin off my nose. As long as you post bullshit here, I'm going to call bullshit.

Your English sucks, too.

Fine, on ignore...

Oooo . . . there's the end of my social life.

First ignored post.

That almost made me laugh.

Thumbs down on that attempt to convey your ignorance.

I will be the first to admit that I have holes in my understanding of many things. I am also humble (contrary to what some may think) and I can readily admit to being wrong or half right. There are many examples of me admitting my mistakes on this forum. I have been on this forum since it began and was on the Abuzz forum for many years which most of the people here on this forum migrated from. I am here to learn and I am grateful for much of the things that other members have contributed in educating me. Even in school as a youngster I loved learning and I do have some college also. I have changed my position on many subjects here and I do not fault myself for being wrong nor do I lash out at others if they can disagree while being kind and considerate.

But, I refuse to communicate with someone who is condescending and hateful.

I am quite adept at Google search and love to read so I have other resources such that my options to learn can avoid people who feel the need for constant insults.

Setanta has been rude to myself and newcomers in this forum and they have simply just left due to his unwelcoming demeanor. I have a tough skin and refuse to be bullied away.

This forum is worse without them and worse with him, IMO.

As for my English skills. I have my prepositions memorized and the form of the verb to be, conjunctions etc... (other rules)

If I use the wrong verb tense it is usually not intentional but a typo where I have made a long post, which I am known for, and did not have the time to proofread it yet another time.

Some of the posts on this thread alone took me 4 hours one night to write so I am also tired after posting a lot and things can slip by me. If all people have to fight me over are my English oversights then I am doing fine I think.

I admit that I tread a thin line when it comes to some of the things I write and I am not upset to be reminded of those things as long as it can be done with respect and decorum. Feel free to correct me; if anyone has a problem with anything I have written here please speak up and if you can do it in a reasonable manner then we can all learn from this interaction.

I will be the first to admit when I am making stuff up, I think that is quite obvious at times. So I have an imagination, perhaps even fabrication. Being challenged goes along with the territory but people can challenge one another without resorting to insults and pettiness.

I am an agnostic because I refuse to live my life with absolute certainty regarding matters I really cannot be sure of. This agnosticism is rooted in honesty and integrity regarding knowledge.

I am not an atheist for the very same reason, because I think being certain there is no God is just as dishonest as being certain there is one.

I do not think God is unknowable, I just believe I do not know with certainty there is a god or not.

So as for any "mystery religion", religion in itself is a mystery and oxymoron and a conundrum of the highest order.

Religion is the very definition of mystery.

Honesty is the definition of truth.

If I write much more I think I will just be blathering on.

A good standard of living and an attitude of heart are a prosperous way to be. I am not a doormat for some to wipe their feet on, You can walk on my feet until you can walk on your own but you cannot walk on my face... I choose not to put up with other people's hate, I prefer pulling my own strings while being conscious and considerate of the strings of others...

Best

very hard to disagree with this approach

Excellent! And mystery is the definition of religion. Belief or non-belief has nothing to do with it, because these are positions of the intellect and the intellect is useless in the realm of spirituality. Spirituality and faith is letting go, whereas belief or non-belief is holding firm to a position and is antithetical to an open, creative mind.

Reading Alan Watts clarified this for me.

By 'known,' you must mean 'known to Europeans.' Europe might have been completely absent from the 'known world' for some people in the 1400s.

Some medieval maps did have east as up, and they were centered on Jerusalem:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T_and_O_map#/media/File:Hereford_Mappa_Mundi_1300.jpg

North was rarely put at the top for the simple fact that north is where darkness comes from.


But maps do not necessarily have to be to the north. This is a practice that only became established in the early modern period, the origin of which cannot be determined with certainty. (Mercator’s world map, from 1569, was the first [important] north-up map.) The fact that maps have a north-south orientation is certainly due to the emergence of navigation with magnetic compass: the needle of the compass is aligned along the magnetic lines running north-south (it does not point north, as you can often read).
But it could also be the south on top.

None of what Rex Red/The Cobbler has to say about me personally alters that he is peddling pure bullshit here. I don't hate him, he's just not that important. He is also indulging the fallacy of the enumeration of favorable circumstances in his hateful diatribe against me. He ignores how rarely I ever comment in the threads--many of which I consider silly--he has started. He lives in his own little world here, and almost never enters anyone else's threads.

The narrative he has attempt to forward here is not supported by the historical record, nor by the archaeolgical record, nor by any scientific evidence. Many parts of it are patently absurd--such as the hilarious allegations about influences from Babylon on Mesoamerica. His narrative anthropomorphizing Babylon as though it were a conscious, sentient entity is not only absurd, it is a painfully obvious relic of fundamentalist, ranting christianity. This thread is a mess, and Rex/Cobbler deserves all of the derision which I have heaped on his silly story.

Psalms 103:12 As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.

Comment:
The north and south have a finite distance between them but east and west have an infinite distance between them.

These biblical writers of this particular passage seem to have known that.

Only a round earth would have infinity between directions like east and west.

It also might imply that the earth was, back then, traveled and "known".

There is no point in putting me "on ignore," only to read the posts and vote them down. There is notning in the passage you quote which supports your allegation.

Babylonia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babylonia

Babylon was not just a city but it was a city state and an empire.

So when speaking about "the Babylonians" on can mean, the people of the city Babylon or the people of Babylonia, the Empire.

Saying the Babylonians were not a culture is like saying Greece was not a culture.