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Preparing for the "BIG MOVE" off the planet Earth

 
 
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 07:50 am
More recent timelines of earth's demise say that, while the sun has a potential life of about 4 to 5 BILLION years, the pile of Helium , the "ash" of Hydrogen fusion , will begin to overtake Hydrogen as the main fuel of Sol. This will result in the Sun's " heat reach" will be as far out as Mars and render the first 4 planets of the solar system rather unlivable. Recent math modelling says that we have about less than half a BILLION years of comfy living on our planet before it becomes a true runaway greenhouse like Venus.
First off, I feel that we should begin long range planning and investments in evolving our technologies NOW
Of-course this presents a challenge to the citizens of our planet. Will we look at the needed preparation as a species endeavor or something more local?
What do you think our "Do -LIST" should be organized in order to prepare for the inevitable??
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Type: Question • Score: 8 • Views: 733 • Replies: 51

 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 08:06 am
I agree that it's not too early to begin our planning for a move. A recent thread makes me wonder if a first move could be to a man made structure to circle our sun at an optimal location, if there is no place else to go, fairly early on, as we continue to plan an exodus.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 08:16 am
@edgarblythe,
If we want to colonize moons of Jupiter or aturn we will need to wait for the big Solar System Warming event to reach out and touch these moons with warmth.

Its gonna be an interesting series of projects.
Will we be able to put everything else aside to save ourselves?
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edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 08:18 am
If the early 21st Century is any indicator - Crying or Very sad
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 08:18 am
I'm more concerned about the geomagnetic apocalypse on the horizon, when the north pole is in Antarctica: what bad things will the downunders do with that?
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 09:33 am
@Walter Hinteler,
that happens every coupla hundred millenia (a complete flip), otherwise we suffer partial mag reversals every few thousan years. Now that we have a good GPS system we dont need magnetic instruments.

Course them crazy Ozzians may try to kidnap Santa Claus
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 12:57 pm
@farmerman,
I think the first real step should be to make certain that all people understand that habitability of our planet is but a temporary condition that will end with a really bad week. I dont think we can count on a god to get us out of the jam
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 05:59 pm
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:
I think the first real step should be to make certain that all people understand that habitability of our planet is but a temporary condition that will end with a really bad week.

True. And I suppose leaving the planet is a good first step. But I hope that we eventually leave the solar system altogether.

If we travel to a new star system each time our existing star dies, our civilization can continue on solar power for as long as there are stars to keep traveling to. That should be about 100 trillion years.

After all of the stars burn out, if our descendants want to continue in a dark universe they'll have to generate their own power. But one hurdle at a time I guess.
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 08:33 pm
@oralloy,
Another good reason for leaving the solar system completely is, the Milky Way and Andromeda galaxies are plunging toward each other and are destined to merge.

When this happens, a good number of stars will be thrown into the core of the new galaxy, where there will be a rash of large star formation followed by a long string of close-proximity supernovas. If our star is one of the ones thrown into the core, we will not want to tag along on that journey.

Another good number of stars will be ejected into intergalactic space. Some will stay clumped together near the galaxy (the Magellanic Clouds are examples of this having happened in the past). Some stars will end up alone in the void.

Ending up in a new Magellanic Cloud might not be so bad, but being alone in the void will be a problem. When it's time to move to a different star system, it will be helpful if there are nearby star systems.

It will be good if humanity is not still tied to our existing star system by the time the merger happens, but is free to move elsewhere as necessary.

After the merger we can find a nice quiet red dwarf with a 10 trillion year lifespan and settle around that.
ekename
 
  1  
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 09:07 pm
Quote:
Will we look at the needed preparation as a species


Yeah, in 500 million years a species may marvel at how homosapien ants were so primitive (guffaw snort thru the central hole for all ingestion) but at least came in from the antediluvian rain they created. Still I'd buy that for a dollar because 1 dollar invested at 3% p.a. for 500 million years is infinity give or take. Or we could save money by just setting sail with this primordial DNA now. Gimme a call back in 50 fifty years and ask me what I think.
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Roberta
 
  2  
Reply Mon 5 Feb, 2018 11:16 pm
I don't like to rush into anything. Why not wait a few million years and see what's going on.

It's also possible that in a half a billion years humans won't be around anymore. I'll be damned if I'm gonna knock myself out for beings I don't even know and who will probably not appreciate our efforts.
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Feb, 2018 12:16 am
As I've said before, I want a home in the Noctis Labyrinthus (Mars--the Labyrinth of Night) and a summer home on Luna, on the Sinus Iridium (the Bay of Rainbows)--just 'cause I like the names. Far enough south in the Noctis Labyrinthus would put you in the Martian southern hemispheres, where the summers, although short (only about four or five months), are the warmest weather on the planet.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Feb, 2018 01:16 am
@Setanta,
looking ahead , in 1.5 Billion yers, they predict e will be at a 10% increase in surface temps throughout the inner planets. Mars should almost be climatologically livable( if we can somehow maintain an atmosphere that can retain water or constructing water saving domes). Otherwise we will still have to rely upon any groundwater reserves , demineralization and even extracting connate or Formational water from interstitial layer water, oxyhydroxides or clay minerals.
Water's gonna be a physical problem but not a technological one. We can make and save water at our present level of engineering.

Solar furnaces will be easier as that plant attains a solar energy budget almost like earth now.
Mars will be just another "temporary" stop anyway because in another Billion years MARS too, will become unlivable . We will be looking at rocky satellites of some outer planets for another Billion before the sun goes Brown Dwarf.

By then we will have to be thinking of becoming forced travelers of the galaxy or just go "star hopping"
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Feb, 2018 01:37 am
The northern polar ice cap on Mars is more than a mile thick, and more than 600 miles in diameter. That means that there's almost 400,000 cubic miles of water ice in the northern polar ice cap. The population of Mars would have to get very large indeed for water to be a problem. You'd just need robot miners and robot transport vehicles to go get the water ice and bring it "home." If one lived in or near to the Vastitas Borealis (the Northern Waste or the Northern Desert), which is where almost all of the rovers have operated (Curiosity is in the southern hemisphere), getting water would not really be a problem.
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Feb, 2018 01:41 am
@farmerman,
farmerman wrote:
Mars will be just another "temporary" stop anyway because in another Billion years MARS too, will become unlivable.


We'll need to head to Titan, a satellite of Saturn. It's half again as large as Luna, and 80% more massive. It's atmosphere is more than 98% Nitrogen. It's a good candidate right now, although it's a mite cold.
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farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Feb, 2018 01:44 am
@oralloy,
apparently our own galaxy has already munched on a part of Sagittarius and it was fairly gentle. Tyson said its name should have been "lunch". So theres a lot more space to consider ,(the mapping of which is also something wed better be good at soon in the future). We can use the two Magellanic Clouds as "Road markers as we move along".
Were talking mega generational travels under present physics
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Feb, 2018 01:53 am
@Setanta,
I thought that most of the polar ice caps were CO2 because it seems to sublime rather than melt . There is an amount of ground water associated with the polar caps and this is one of the trget areas to obtain "drillable" water under present techniques.
The way I unerstand it, the polar ice i arranged in sorta lamellar "slabs" of CO2 with some water ice stacked in between (Im not sure how it is collected as CO2 atmosphere is deposited from the atmosphere.

Ill do a Google search some time in the AMto see if I can find anything about HOW MUCH water (on a % basis) actually xists in the caps. Now I gott get back to the pens in the barn.
Night all
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Feb, 2018 02:10 am
@farmerman,
That was the "standard model" for a long time. However, NASA, the European Space Agency and the Indian Space Research Organization have been doing a lot of orbital surveys, which have demonstrated (in some cases with radar imaging that goes down to the permafrost, which is deep on the otherwise arid planet) just how thick the polar caps are, and that the CO2 ice is just a seasonal deposition which sublimes in summer. Even this out of date article from Space Today-dot-org, states that the ice caps are more than 50% water ice.

This article from Arizona State University is about the THEMIS (Thermal Emission Imaging System) payload on the Odyssey orbital mapping satellite. It has shown that the southern polar cap, once thought to be almost entirely OC2 ice, is just a much smaller version of the northern ice cape. All of the old assumptions about water on mars and the composition of the polar caps are being exploded as sophisticated imaging systems are deployed by NASA, ESA and ISRO. From that article:

Quote:
This indicates the south polar cap, just like the north, is almost entirely water ice.
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Feb, 2018 05:42 am
@farmerman,
Artificial evolution through gene editing along with cybernetics will outpace space exploration to the point where we will be looking for very different places to live long before we need to leave. And we’re already heading down that path, so no extra effort required. By the time the earth fries we’ll be swimming through zero gravity and hard radiation like fish in the sea.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 6 Feb, 2018 05:53 am
@Setanta,
Ha, excellent. So Ill take water down a notch in recovery strategies. Now itll seem to be a model of distribution of water similar to what we do in Antarctica . Looks like at lleast a few hundred square miles.

Ill have to rid my mind of the CO2 storage and seasonal atmospheric density stuff
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