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Why did Vikings have 'Allah' embroidered into funeral clothes?

 
 
Reply Thu 12 Oct, 2017 12:07 pm
From the BBC really interesting much longer article.

Quote:
Researchers in Sweden have found Arabic characters woven into burial costumes from Viking boat graves. The discovery raises new questions about the influence of Islam in Scandinavia, writes journalist Tharik Hussain.
They were kept in storage for more than 100 years, dismissed as typical examples of Viking Age funeral clothes.
But a new investigation into the garments - found in 9th and 10th Century graves - has thrown up groundbreaking insights into contact between the Viking and Muslim worlds.
Patterns woven with silk and silver thread have been found to spell the words "Allah" and "Ali".
The breakthrough was made by textile archaeologist Annika Larsson of Uppsala University while re-examining the remnants of burial costumes from male and female boat and chamber graves originally excavated in Birka and Gamla Uppsala in Sweden in the late 19th and mid-20th centuries.
She became interested in the forgotten fragments after realising the material had come from central Asia, Persia and China.
Larsson says the tiny geometric designs - no more than 1.5cm (0.6in) high - resembled nothing she had come across in Scandinavia before.
"I couldn't quite make sense of them and then I remembered where I had seen similar designs - in Spain, on Moorish textiles."
Larsson then realised she was not looking at Viking patterns at all but ancient Arabic Kufic script.
There were two words that kept recurring. One of them she identified with the help of an Iranian colleague. It was the name "Ali" - the fourth caliph of Islam.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-41567391
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ossobucotemp
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Oct, 2017 01:13 pm
@izzythepush,
Textile archeology, or whatever the word is re the research, sounds like an interesting field.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Reply Thu 12 Oct, 2017 02:35 pm
@izzythepush,
The Viking exploits were a co-operative business venture amongst Vikings. This might only mean there was a business relationship, perhaps between Moorish Spain and Vikings? This might only be "a tempest in a teapot."
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Thu 12 Oct, 2017 03:04 pm
@izzythepush,
fascinating stuff.

I'll ask a friend who works at our local Textile Museum about this. It would be right in his area of expertise.
0 Replies
 
Blickers
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Oct, 2017 08:58 pm
@izzythepush,
A few years ago they saw some kind of Middle Eastern jewelry in a Viking dig site, which surprised the archaeologists studying the site.

Well, the Vikings were great seafarers, so it probably shouldn't surprise us too much when we see they have momentos from all over the then-known, (known to Europe), world.
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  2  
Reply Fri 13 Oct, 2017 05:16 am
Maybe it's a case like non football players wearing the logos of their favorite teams.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Oct, 2017 10:33 am
@edgarblythe,
I don't think evidence of contact with Islamic culture is what stands out, they've already found evidence of that. It's the use of Islamic icons in funeral rites, previously it was believed Vikings went from Pagan to Christian, it appears some may have turned towards Mecca instead.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Oct, 2017 12:47 pm
@izzythepush,
I wasn't serious; consumer culture had not originated by then.
Foofie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Oct, 2017 02:25 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

I don't think evidence of contact with Islamic culture is what stands out, they've already found evidence of that. It's the use of Islamic icons in funeral rites, previously it was believed Vikings went from Pagan to Christian, it appears some may have turned towards Mecca instead.


Or, when they went trade/sell their "booty" from the latest raid on the British Isles, it was just good sales techniques to show that they were Islamic friendly.

You do know that many sales efforts match the sales person with the prospect.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Oct, 2017 04:16 pm
@edgarblythe,
I didn't think you were being literal.
0 Replies
 
cameronleon
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 13 Oct, 2017 05:09 pm
This is very strange.

By principle, Muslims are not allowed to wear clothes with the name Allah, but they do when using chains or rings.

https://islamqa.info/en/174372

Quote:

174372: Is it permissible to wear clothing on which are written Islamic phrases?


It does not seem to us that there is any reason not to allow wearing clothing on which are written phrases that promote virtue and good characteristics, or which praise Islam and its rulings and laws.

But one should pay attention to two things with regard to this writing:

1. The phrases should not include the name of Allah. We have drawn attention to this matter in the answer to question no. 1047.


http://www.islamweb.net/emainpage/index.php?page=showfatwa&Option=FatwaId&Id=84075

Quote:

Question
I want to know if it is okay to wear, Allah chains, or chains that have something to do with Islam.... even when you go to washrooms? I do not want to be doing something wrong.

Answer
It is permissible for you to wear a chain Allah's Name is written on it provided there should not be any disrespect to it. Taking it to toilet or exposing it to impurities is considered as disrespecting it. It is narrated from the Prophet (Sallallahu Alaihi wa Sallam) that he used to remove his ring when he went to a toilet since the ring was engraved with Muhammad Rasool-Ullah (Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah). Allah Says (interpretation of meaning): {…And whosoever honours the Symbols of Allâh, then it is truly from the piety of the heart.} [22:32].
Imam Ibn Abi Shaibah narrated from Ikrimah who said that Ibn Abbas used to give him his ring before entering a toilet and said to him, 'if you are compelled to enter the toilet with it, take hold of the Name of Allah or cover it with a cloth or the like'.
Imam Ibn Abi Shaibah narrated from Ikrimah from Ibn Abbas who said: 'If someone enters a toilet while he is wearing a ring with the Name of Allah, should take it inside of his palm and then hold it with his finger'.
Imam Ahmad said: 'If a ring or the like contains the Name of Allah, one should take it inside of his palm'.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Oct, 2017 02:08 am
@izzythepush,
The presence of Eastern silk in Scandinavia's Viking Age grave sites has been known as well.

It seems that some Viking Age burial customs were influenced by Islam and the idea of an eternal life in Paradise after death.
The ideal of the Vikings was the warrior and the aim was victory. Therefore "the suffering Christ" on the cross was not received sympathetically amongst the Vikings, and perhaps some thought 'Allah' to be better.

"In the Quran, it is written that the inhabitants of Paradise will wear garments of silk, which along with the text band’s inscriptions may explain the widespread occurrence of silk in Viking Age graves,” Annika Larsson [researcher in textile archaeology at the Department of Archaeology and Ancient History at Uppsala University] said.

izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Oct, 2017 02:22 am
@Walter Hinteler,
The suffering Odin was familiar though, there are parallels with Christ.

Quote:
Odin hung himself from a branch of Yggdrasil, pierced himself with his spear, and peered downward into the shadowy waters below. He forbade any of the other gods to grant him the slightest aid, not even a sip of water. And he stared downward, and stared downward, and called to the runes.

He survived in this state, teetering on the precipice that separates the living from the dead, for no less than nine days and nights. At the end of the ninth night, he at last perceived shapes in the depths: the runes! They had accepted his sacrifice and shown themselves to him, revealing to him not only their forms, but also the secrets that lie within them. Having fixed this knowledge in his formidable memory, Odin ended his ordeal with a scream of exultation.


https://norse-mythology.org/tales/odins-discovery-of-the-runes/
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Oct, 2017 03:45 am
@izzythepush,
Odin was associated with war and bloodshed from the Viking perspective, although in earlier times, no such association was present.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Oct, 2017 03:50 am
@Walter Hinteler,
He does, like Christ, Marduk and Osiris, fit the sacrificed god ideology. I accept that outwardly he's very different to Christ, but he is part of the thread that runs through so much of Paganism and Christianity.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 16 Oct, 2017 02:06 pm
Possibly you all will now come to the conclusion to "return" the ten commandments, and Genesis (old testament) to their original authors. Or, is this thread leading up to another effort at misappropriation?
InfraBlue
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Oct, 2017 03:33 pm
@Foofie,
The goyim didn't go to the ten commandments and Genesis; the ten commandments and Genesis went to the goyim. Take it up with your proselytizers.
Foofie
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 17 Oct, 2017 02:28 pm
@InfraBlue,
InfraBlue wrote:

The goyim didn't go to the ten commandments and Genesis; the ten commandments and Genesis went to the goyim. Take it up with your proselytizers.


O.K.; I don't remember what goyim means?
hightor
 
  1  
Reply Tue 17 Oct, 2017 02:32 pm
Whoa...
Quote:
An expert has disputed claims that Allah's name was embroidered into ancient Viking burial clothes - a discovery hailed as "staggering" when Swedish researchers announced their findings last week.

Independent
InfraBlue
 
  2  
Reply Wed 18 Oct, 2017 02:44 pm
@Foofie,
Foofie wrote:

InfraBlue wrote:

The goyim didn't go to the ten commandments and Genesis; the ten commandments and Genesis went to the goyim. Take it up with your proselytizers.


O.K.; I don't remember what goyim means?

"The nations," i.e. "you all."
0 Replies
 
 

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