0
   

The World's Leading Butcher

 
 
oralloy
 
  -3  
Reply Thu 1 Jun, 2017 10:40 am
@camlok,
camlok wrote:
That's the case with everything you pretend to discuss. It's all just loosey goosey, silly oralloy opinion. One knows this because of how quickly you flee a topic when you realize just how silly your opinions are.

Your dishonesty is appalling. I am highly informed on every subject that I discuss. That is why you can never point out any fact that I am wrong about. I also rely on facts, not opinion. And I don't flee topics.

I might though, if some bore always responds to my polite and factual posts by savagely lying about me, stop paying attention to that bore.
camlok
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Jun, 2017 12:35 pm
@oralloy,
This post is as full of your typical oralloy BS as any of your other posts. You can tell because there is only oralloy denial and more oralloy BS.

oralloy denying reality isn't illustrative of a person being informed.
0 Replies
 
Glennn
 
  0  
Reply Thu 1 Jun, 2017 12:54 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
I don't know nearly enough about the alleged incident to begin speculating.

Well it's very simple, really. If you destroy the capacity to produce electricity, you also destroy the capacity to power sewage and water plants. And if you also impose sanctions which prohibit importing materials necessary to restoring electricity, then you've effectively caused much suffering and disease as a result. It's not rocket science.
Quote:
I disagree that this statement admits to intentionally causing civilian suffering.

"What we were doing with the attacks on infrastructure was to accelerate the effect of sanctions."

That's pretty straight forward as far as intent goes.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 2 Jun, 2017 05:16 am
@Glennn,
Glennn wrote:
Well it's very simple, really. If you destroy the capacity to produce electricity, you also destroy the capacity to power sewage and water plants.

Only until electricity is restored. At any rate, electricity is a lawful target.


Glennn wrote:
And if you also impose sanctions which prohibit importing materials necessary to restoring electricity, then you've effectively caused much suffering and disease as a result. It's not rocket science.

I thought it was water purification chemicals that sanctions were blocking. The fear was that the chemicals would be used to make illegal weapons.


Glennn wrote:
"What we were doing with the attacks on infrastructure was to accelerate the effect of sanctions."

That's pretty straight forward as far as intent goes.

Yes. They wanted to be able to make life difficult for Saddam for as long as he refused to cooperate.
0 Replies
 
camlok
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 04:41 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
I am highly informed on every subject that I discuss.


You are woefully ignorant on the science and the events of 911.

Quote:
That is why you can never point out any fact that I am wrong about.


You are wrong on every US government lie that you repeat about the fictions created by the Bush government on 911.

Quote:
I also rely on facts, not opinion.


You have no facts, just totally uninformed opinions.

Quote:
And I don't flee topics.


You fled, and continue to flee like a gazelle fleeing lions.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 04:50 pm
@camlok,
camlok wrote:
You are woefully ignorant on the science and the events of 911.

Nope. I know everything about that topic.


camlok wrote:
You fled, and continue to flee like a gazelle fleeing lions.

No I didn't. First of all, not bothering to discuss a boring subject with a lunatic is hardly fleeing.

Secondly, on a whim I actually tried addressing you lunatics by providing you guys with a solid argument that you were wrong.

You guys made no attempt to address anything I said, but merely stopped making your nonsense claims for a page or two, and then started right back up with your nonsense as if it had not been solidly debunked.

Waste of my time.
camlok
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 05:12 pm
@oralloy,
All a lie as big as the US government's 911 lies.

You have failed to address myriad impossibilities in the USGOCT.

1. Nanothermite = no Arab hijackers.

2. Molten/vaporized WTC steel = no Arab hijackers.

3. Iron microspheres = no Arab hijackers.

4. No evidence for Arab hijackers = no Arab hijackers.

5. Molten molybdenum = no Arab hijackers.

6. Vaporized lead = no Arab hijackers.

7. Wrong engines for "UA175" = no Arab hijackers.

8. Human being being blown out of twin tower's window = no Arab hijackers.

9. GW Bush's admission of bombs and explosions in the twin towers "concussing" firemen/first responders = no Arab hijackers.

The list goes on and on.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 06:49 pm
@camlok,
Waste of my time.
camlok
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 07:18 pm
@oralloy,
Total cowardly behavior. And a totally lame excuse.

If the USGOCT had anything to it, if there was any evidence whatsoever, you would be all over this. There are no defenders of the USGOCT because there is no evidence that supports it.

That would be one thing that would allow a body to continue in this charade, but the real USGOCT killer is that there are so many total impossibilities in the USGOCT.
Glennn
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 07:31 pm
@camlok,
Yeah, I recall asking how the energy required to pulverize everything in the building below the impact zone, and the energy required to produce the lateral ejection as seen in photos and videos of the collapse still allowed for enough reserve energy to allow for a virtually freefall descent through the course of most resistance--which is an impossibility. I also recall getting no answer.

What proved a waste of time was waiting for an answer from those who claim to know all the answers.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 07:43 pm
@Glennn,
Glennn wrote:
I also recall getting no answer.

I recall answering.
Glennn
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 07:56 pm
@oralloy,
Well, I just revisited that thread and scanned six pages of posts that followed my question. You never offered an answer.
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 08:32 pm
@Glennn,
Perhaps we are remembering different threads.

This is the answer that I was remembering:
http://able2know.org/topic/369947-11#post-6371547

It looks like you did reply to me, but not about the same issue. You'd first asked why the core didn't offer resistance to the collapse, which is what I answered. Your follow up was about why the core failed to remain standing after the collapse, a completely different question.

I can answer your follow up too I guess. But I'm not committing to a lengthy discussion here. This topic bores me extensively.

If you want me to reply obsessively, you'll have to talk to me about the Second Amendment or about Hiroshima/Nagasaki.


My reply to
http://able2know.org/topic/369947-11#post-6371690

Glennn wrote:
You speak as if the 47 columns that made up the core structure were not cross-braced. they were. Surely you've seen photos of the core structure, and have seen that they were not each one standing alone.

Whatever cross bracing there was, was not intended to hold up the steel beams by themselves. They were intended to be cross-braced much more by their attachment to all the floor structures. Once the floor structures were no longer attached to the inner beams, what little cross bracing was left was simply not strong enough to keep the inner beams standing by themselves.


Glennn wrote:
Your video, as you say, shows that as the collapse progresses, it accelerates. That is impossible from a gravity-driven collapse with the core structure intact below the impact zone.

It is perfectly possible. Gravity pulls things down.
camlok
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 08:43 pm
@Glennn,

Quote:
Yeah, I recall asking how the energy required to pulverize everything in the building below the impact zone, and the energy required to produce the lateral ejection as seen in photos and videos of the collapse still allowed for enough reserve energy to allow for a virtually freefall descent through the course of most resistance--which is an impossibility. I also recall getting no answer.


There is no answer except to agree with your conclusions.

Quote:

The observations that the gravitational energy was insufficient to pulverize these buildings and to produce the observed expansion of the dust clouds, and that gravity-driven collapses would not have caused the buildings to fall straight down following the path of maximum resistance, are physics arguments. You don't have to understand how the building was constructed to understand that a tall structure like that wouldn't just collapse through itself, just ripping itself apart and going straight down. It would topple one way or the other. It wouldn't even have to be made out of steel. It could be made out of toothpicks and the flimsiest materials, but it wouldn't fall through itself. That's not even physics. It's just basic intuition. - Jim Hoffman
0 Replies
 
Glennn
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 08:50 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
If you want me to reply obsessively, you'll have to talk to me about the Second Amendment or about Hiroshima/Nagasaki.

Been there, done that. It's over.
Quote:
You'd first asked why the core didn't offer resistance to the collapse, which is what I answered.

Your answer amounted to the idea that the function of the floors was to hold up the core and perimeter structures, when actually the opposite is true.
Quote:
Once the floor structures were no longer attached to the inner beams, what little cross bracing was left was simply not strong enough to keep the inner beams standing by themselves.

That does not explain how the energy required to pulverize everything in the building below the impact zone, and the energy required to produce the lateral ejection as seen in photos and videos of the collapse still allowed for enough reserve energy to allow for a virtually freefall descent through the course of most resistance--which is an impossibility.
camlok
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 08:56 pm
@oralloy,
Glennn wrote:
Your video, as you say, shows that as the collapse progresses, it accelerates. That is impossible from a gravity-driven collapse with the core structure intact below the impact zone.

Quote:
It is perfectly possible. Gravity pulls things down.


That is 100% false. A gravity collapse where the only energy available is from the building itself cannot accelerate unless the underlying structural components have been removed. The only way to do that is by controlled demolition or by the Verinage Method, which the French use.

The Verinage Method proves that a gravity collapse cannot accelerate thru out its fall.

But you still have these myriad total impossibilities of the USGOCT, which you, and the "scientist" are avoiding like the plague.

1. How did US proprietary nanothermite get into WTC?
2. How can you explain the molten/vaporized WTC steel?
3. How can you explain the vaporized lead?
4. How can you explain WTC7 free fall?

These are all impossibilities according to the USG official story but they are realities that won't go away, because truth and science are the only realities.

“Science is a way of trying not to fool yourself. The principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool.”
― Richard Feynman

Yours is not of science and you know you are trying to fool yourself but you can't. Because science doesn't lie, but people do.

0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 09:03 pm
@Glennn,
Glennn wrote:
Your answer amounted to the idea that the function of the floors was to hold up the core and perimeter structures, when actually the opposite is true.

Depends on what you mean by "hold up".

That the floors provided necessary cross bracing is very true.


Glennn wrote:
That does not explain how the energy required to pulverize everything in the building below the impact zone, and the energy required to produce the lateral ejection as seen in photos and videos of the collapse still allowed for enough reserve energy to allow for a virtually freefall descent

Correct. I covered that issue in my first answer.

What I was explaining there was how the central columns remained standing after the collapse, an issue that you raised after I answered your first question.


Glennn wrote:
through the course of most resistance--which is an impossibility.

It wasn't the course of most resistance. There was very little resistance at all.
Glennn
 
  0  
Reply Wed 14 Feb, 2018 09:15 pm
@oralloy,
Quote:
Depends on what you mean by hold up. That the floors provided necessary cross bracing is very true.

You're under the mistaken impression that the core columns were not themselves cross braced. They were extensively cross braced.
Quote:
Correct. I covered that issue in my first answer.

Yeah, you said that the floors pulled down the core and perimeter structures at virtual freefall speed. That's not possible. You have not explained how the energy required to pulverize everything in the building below the impact zone, and the energy required to produce the lateral ejection as seen in photos and videos of the collapse still allowed for enough reserve energy to allow for a virtually freefall descent.
Quote:
It wasn't the course of most resistance. There was very little resistance at all.

It certainly was the course of most resistance! That's where the core structure was. Saying that there was little resistance at all is to say that you have not seen photos of the core sturcture. Basically, you're saying that since it looked like the core structure offered very little resistance, it must have offered very little resistance. But we know that it would offer substantial resistance.
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Thu 15 Feb, 2018 01:47 am
@Glennn,
Glennn wrote:
You're under the mistaken impression that the core columns were not themselves cross braced. They were extensively cross braced.

Not to the extent that they could stand on their own with no floors attached to them.


Glennn wrote:
Yeah, you said that the floors pulled down the core and perimeter structures at virtual freefall speed.

No I didn't. I said they fell without pulling down the core and perimeter structures.


Glennn wrote:
You have not explained how the energy required to pulverize everything in the building below the impact zone,

Having countless tons fall on top of you tends to have that effect.


Glennn wrote:
and the energy required to produce the lateral ejection as seen in photos and videos of the collapse

Energy? That was a natural result of each level getting crushed from above.


Glennn wrote:
allowed for enough reserve energy to allow for a virtually freefall descent.

The weight of the falling building was more than enough energy.


Glennn wrote:
It certainly was the course of most resistance! That's where the core structure was.

No. The core was in the center of the building, not where the falling floors were.


Glennn wrote:
Saying that there was little resistance at all is to say that you have not seen photos of the core sturcture.

I've seen enough. The core structure was in the center of the building. The floors that fell were all open spaces.


Glennn wrote:
Basically, you're saying that since it looked like the core structure offered very little resistance, it must have offered very little resistance.

More that, since the core structure was not the part that failed and collapsed, its resistance to collapse was irrelevant.


Glennn wrote:
But we know that it would offer substantial resistance.

Maybe. But since it was not the part that failed and collapsed, its resistance wasn't of any use in preventing the collapse.
camlok
 
  0  
Reply Thu 15 Feb, 2018 10:22 am
@oralloy,
Quote:
Not to the extent that they could stand on their own with no floors attached to them.


This has no connection to reality at all. There wasn't anything at all that could have made the twin towers fall except controlled demolitions. The fires were never hot enough to begin with. The fires in both towers were going out, except for the planned explosions, described by over 118 firemen and others, to pre-weaken portions of the structure.

You see this in the molten iron/steel flowing out the windows of WTC 2 minutes before the collapse initiated right at that part of the building.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_d1XHtHix_ZM/SZkJRsFieyI/AAAAAAAAADE/sAOUMFrFpm4/s320/wtc2-corner-9-53-51.jpg

 

 
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