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beatification and sainthood

 
 
Ray C
 
Reply Thu 2 Jul, 2015 08:29 am
does everyone beatified eventually get canonized as a saint ?

if not, then what percent get “stuck” at beatification ?
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Type: Question • Score: 7 • Views: 1,031 • Replies: 17
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PUNKEY
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jul, 2015 12:06 pm
@Ray C,
probably the same as those "stuck" in limbo.
0 Replies
 
George
 
  1  
Reply Thu 2 Jul, 2015 12:33 pm
I could not give percentage, but there are quite a few who have never
advanced from beatification. There is a list on Wikipedia (of course)
but I cannot vouch for its accuracy. I followed the links for several "blessed"
that I know about and it seemed correct to me.
Walter Hinteler
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jul, 2015 02:37 pm
@George,
.... but many of those who are blessed with your Latin translations aren't Saints at all.
Frank Apisa
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jul, 2015 02:53 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
That's pretty much what George was saying, Walter.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  0  
Reply Thu 2 Jul, 2015 04:34 pm
@Ray C,
its all politics
0 Replies
 
ekename
 
  0  
Reply Fri 3 Jul, 2015 12:23 am
@Ray C,
Quote:
does everyone beatified eventually get canonized as a saint ?

if not, then what percent get “stuck” at beatification ?


Finding the blessed numerator and the canonised denominator would be nothing short of two miracles.
roger
 
  0  
Reply Fri 3 Jul, 2015 02:28 am
@ekename,
Oh, I see.
0 Replies
 
Ionus
 
  0  
Reply Fri 3 Jul, 2015 05:17 am
Many saints were demoted . There was a very large number in Medieval times, but that has been drastically shortened .
Smileyrius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2015 05:01 am
@Ionus,
Interesting, is there information available as to why? just curious Smile
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2015 05:21 am
@Smileyrius,
I know of 10,989 - because Saint Ursula was accompanied only by 11 virgins and not 11,000 as had been told until the early modern period. Smile
Smileyrius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2015 05:24 am
@Walter Hinteler,
somebody missed a decimal point by a few!
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2015 05:44 am
@Smileyrius,
Over a couple of centuries, and they'd even found the cemetery ...
(It wasn't that someone missed a decimal point.)
0 Replies
 
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2015 08:56 am
@Smileyrius,
Originally, local Bishops decided who was a saint and sent word around to the other Bishops for promulgation . Martyrs were a very popular choice, as were Bishops (surprise!) and of course, Popes .

By the 1000's AD, standards for sainthood among Bishops had become very lax, and several Popes decided that special councils would determine who was a saint . This didn't change anything much, but it did help lessen the number of saints until 1634, when Pope Urban VIII published a bull that made canonization and beatification exclusive to the Holy See. The Pope would appoint a special council, they would advise him and he would make a decision .

In 1969, the Roman Calendar was reformed and whilst 3 months of the year off for Saint's Days and Holy Days (holidays) was a good idea and viable in Medieval Times, it was impractical in a modern world . They had even tried to amalgamate a few with All Saint's Day, or All Hallow's Day, or Halloween . Already many saint's days were no longer celebrated, but it was made official by removing them from the calendar in order to promote more important events such as Lent, Easter and Christmas . As well as demoting saints, prominence was given to some lesser known saints in order to diversify the saints geographically and culturally so everyone could have one . Some places in the New World are still catching up to fill their quota . Very Happy Anyway, the Sainthood of many of the early saints is much suspect .

Now it must be documented after research by 3 experienced men of the church, one of whom plays the Devil's Advocate and consistently tries to disprove the Sainthood . At least 3 miracles are required .

Technically the old Saints are still there but their importance is very much downplayed by the Church because thorough research might reveal they weren't very saintly at all...most would never pass the modern criteria...best let sleeping dogs lie than attract attention to a mistake .
Smileyrius
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2015 09:36 am
@Ionus,
Cheers Io, good usable information
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2015 10:14 am
@Ionus,
The Editio typica des Martyrologium Romanum (2001) in the latest version Editio altera (2004) [only available in the print edition] names 6,650 saints and beautificated persons with their biographies as well as about 7,400 holy martyrs (partly without known proper name).
Ionus
 
  0  
Reply Tue 7 Jul, 2015 09:36 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Quote:
names 6,650 saints and beautificated persons with their biographies
A selected amount of detail was retained by the Church when they were made a saint . Many were no such thing, thus the downgrading . Examine some of the Popes who were made saints...hilarious !
0 Replies
 
ekename
 
  1  
Reply Thu 9 Jul, 2015 01:10 am
@Ionus,
Quote:
At least 3 miracles are required .


A hole I see is that 3 miracles are not required.

Quote:
best let sleeping dogs lie than attract attention to a mistake



0 Replies
 
 

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