10
   

Debt ceiling?

 
 
Buffalo
 
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 07:28 pm
PLEASE HELP ME...... How is "Raising the debt ceiling", NOT "Raising the debt"?
 
Ragman
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 07:42 pm
@Buffalo,
But it is raising the debt 'cause it stretches the debt out further in time. It's akin to kicking the can (debt problem) down the road, shifting the responsibility to future administrations ... (meaning future tax payers).
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 07:52 pm
@Ragman,
I disagree with you Ragman. Raising the debt ceiling is not raising the debt.

Raising the debt ceiling does nothing to stretch the debt out further in time and it is nothing akin to kicking the can down the road.

All that raising the debt ceiling does is allow us to pay the bills that are already due.

Think about this in terms of your credit card. If you can't pay off the balance, you could get a raise (which would be increasing revenue) or you could decrease spending. Either of these things would be reasonable.

Deciding to stop paying at least the monthly minimum payment on your credit card because your debt it too high isn't reasonable.

Refusing the raise the debt ceiling doesn't lower spending or raise taxes. All it means is that we stop paying the debts we already owe. The consequences for us not paying the money that we already owe are pretty serious.

maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 07:56 pm
Personally I think the debt ceiling is the dumbest thing ever. We should just get rid of it.

America has to pay its bills, period.

Congress passes the budget that sets tax rates and spending. Why do they need a mechanism to prevent us from paying the bills that they themsevles have run up.

The budget battles should be had when we set spending and tax rates, not when the bills come due.
0 Replies
 
Buffalo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:01 pm
@maxdancona,
I wish I could max out my personal credit card limit, then call the credit card company and tell them I they will either have to increase my current LIMIT or else I will NOT pay what I CURRENTLY owe them.

That WOULD NOT FLY! Neither would congress allowing the president to increase HIS debt on the current limit. If HE is not able to budget the limit that has already been passed (THAT HE ALREADY BEGGED FOR) then how would you expect him to budget even more? We are now in debt $17.5 TRILLION! HOW MUCH IS ENOUGH?
Buffalo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:08 pm
@Buffalo,
My point is..... QUIT SPENDING MONEY WE DON'T HAVE!

If the spending does not stop, WE (ALL OF US) will go bankrupt!
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:09 pm
@Buffalo,
It isn't the credit card company setting the limit. The United States has even come close the amount of money that people are willing to lend us. The United States has a credit rating that is high and can borrow right now with a pretty low interest rate.

We have not maxed out our credit card limit. This is a limit set by us.

What we have done is limit the amount of money we are going to pay the credit card company. It is a limit that wasn't set by the lenders, it was set by ourselves (in spite of the fact that we made the decisions, including tax cuts, that racked up this debt).

This would be as if you, after racking up a debt, told the credit card company "sorry I have a limit on the money I am going to give you, I can't give you any more".

If you tried to play that game in the your personal life, there would be real consequences. You to pay your bills. So does the country.

maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:09 pm
@Buffalo,
Or, we could raise taxes.
Buffalo
 
  0  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:15 pm
@maxdancona,
@MAXDANCONA
I hope your debt to income ratio is better than Obama's..... Mine is and I sleep well at night.
Buffalo
 
  0  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:25 pm
@maxdancona,
All raising taxes (MORE) would do is make big corporate businesses cut back their employees even more. The trick is to actually GIVE the corporations that are in the position to employ more people more reasons to employ more people. The only way to do that is to give them financial incentives to bring on more people. Remember, the ONLY reason a corporation is in business is to be more profitable (same as you working for and hourly wage.... You ALWAYS want more $ per hour. If they cut your wage, you cut your productability). As soon as the government gives financial reasons for big businesses to expand, they will. And the work load will ease up on you and me!
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:29 pm
@Buffalo,
Let me ask you a question Buffalo. Are you really anti-debt? Or are you just anti-Obama?

Were you worried the effects the Bush tax cuts and the Iraq war would have on the debt? Or is just a new worry when there is a Democrat in the White House?

I don't think that debt is our biggest problem right now. I do think we should do something to lower our debt, but the fact is that we can borrow money at very low interest rates (10 year treasury bills are selling with a 1.4% yield). Borrowing money very cheap for the US.

But I respect people who are consistent. If you really anti-debt, and have been in Republican as well as Democratic administrations, then I might not fully agree with you, but at least I respect you.

It is the partisan hypocrisy, people who are upset that a "socialist Kenyan" is in the White House and suddenly start panicking about the "debt crisis", that I find really annoying.

Buffalo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:48 pm
@maxdancona,
I could care less who is in the white house. I love the United States and the United States Constitution and I want it to remain in tact for my future generations. The world works with finances (believe it or not). The more finances you have, the more powerful you are. The United States is currently (STILL) the most powerful AND most financially stable country in the world. I want to keep it that way. I want ALL Americans to be successful, and live the American dream. But It does NOT come by living ON all the other American taxpayers who ARE working, earning a living, AND paying vry high taxes already. The way to improve America IS NOT to increase the taxes on those American's who are already working there A__ES off to earn a good living and are already paying high taxes. It is to give tax incentives to those who are in the position to HIRE more people to help them earn a profit on the investment RISK they made to make a profit.
edgarblythe
 
  3  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:53 pm
@Buffalo,
Teabagger?
Buffalo
 
  0  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:57 pm
@edgarblythe,
"Teabagger"? Is that all you have? If you disagree with what I have to say, I accept that, but please explain why if you are willing to speak up.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 08:58 pm
@Buffalo,
You love the United States and the United States Constitution. This is a good thing since at least we start on common ground. You understand that we elect a president and a Congress to represent us and that together they have the power and authority to set policies and budgets and tax rates and debts.

So there are some things you and I agree on. It seem on fiscal policy we disagree. I believe that America should invest, through government programs, in education and research and infrastructure. And I also believe that America should take care of its less fortunate citizens through food stamps and medicaid etc.

So when American citizens disagree, the Constitution has a way of resolving. We send our representatives to Congress and to the White House and they have the power to enact policy. Some of this policy you will disagree with, and some of this policy I will disagree with... but that's democracy. After all the people in White House and Congress were all elected at least once.

We can argue about policy, and more importantly we can vote for our respective representatives. These representatives have the responsibility for the debt and the sole authority to make the decisions needed to change it.

However, once they have set these policies... to then decide they aren't going to pay for them is simply ridiculous.




Buffalo
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 09:11 pm
@maxdancona,
I did not vote on Obama-care.... did you? Even if you DID vote on it somehow, the President has changed it some 7 times, since then. It is no longer the same law that was originally passed. It will cost the American People an UNCOUNTANTABLE amount of money and freedom. Even if it is financed, IT WILL FAIL..... but we, THE PEOPLE, will still be paying for a LONG TIME!
Buffalo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 09:33 pm
@Buffalo,
Also, I am a hard working American, with a college bachelor's degree, working 50+ hours per week for less than $50,000 per year (hard work), with a wife and 2 kids, trying to keep up with the bills. I would LOVE to hear from other people who have similar situations as mine, and what their opinions are. I have a job.... I wonder why.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  4  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 09:37 pm
@Buffalo,
I voted for Obama twice, as did tens of millions of us.

Personally I think Obamacare is too much of a compromise. What we really should have is a single payer, government run system. However, this is not possible in our current political environment. But such is democracy.


Buffalo
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 09:47 pm
@maxdancona,
Yes, and I would like to add to my last comment that I also ALREADY have medical insurance for myself and my family through my current job that I worked for many years through college and many years of sweat and tears to get! What have you done to deserve your insurance?
Buffalo
 
  0  
Reply Thu 19 Sep, 2013 09:50 pm
@Buffalo,
And I STILL pay for a portion of my insurance out of my paychecks.
 

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