0
   

The propaganda is relentless. No wonder so many Americans are brain dead.

 
 
JTT
 
Reply Fri 7 Oct, 2011 09:45 am
Quote:
1st of 'Cuban 5' spy ring out of US prison

MARIANNA, Fla. (AP) — One of the so-called "Cuban Five," convicted of spying in the U.S. for the communist Castro government, walked out of federal prison Friday, the first of the group to complete sentences imposed a decade ago.
Rene Gonzalez, 55, served about 13 years of a 15-year sentence, with time off for good behavior and including time behind bars awaiting and during trial. His attorney, Phil Horowitz, told The Associated Press he picked up Gonzalez at the prison around 5:30 a.m. EDT. Now Gonzalez, a Chicago native who has dual American and Cuban citizenship, must serve three years' probation in the U.S., unless his attorney can persuade a Miami federal judge to let him return to Cuba.
Horowitz said for now Gonzalez wants to remain out of the limelight at an undisclosed location "anywhere from Puerto Rico to Hawaii." Horowitz said Gonzalez is declining interview requests and that he has some concern for his safety.
"He's been in prison for 13 years. I think it's time to give him some peace," he said. "I do believe he needs some time to decompress."

Gonzalez and the other four Cubans were convicted in 2001 of being part of a spy ring known as the "Wasp Network" that sought to infiltrate and report back on South Florida U.S. military installations, Cuban exile groups and politicians opposed to the government of Fidel and Raul Castro.

One of the five was convicted of murder conspiracy for the 1996 shootdown by Cuban fighter jets of planes flown by the "Brothers to the Rescue" operation, which dropped pro-democracy leaflets in Cuba and helped migrants trying to reach the U.S. Gonzalez, a pilot, flew with the group on some earlier missions as part of his intelligence cover as a purported anti-Castro militant, according to court documents.

The Cuban government hails the men as heroes, and they and their supporters have long insisted they were only in the U.S. to detect and prevent violent attacks against their country, mainly by Miami-based exile groups. They also complained that Miami was a patently unfair location for the trial, which took place following the controversial decision by the U.S. to send Elian Gonzalez back to his father in Cuba. The young Cuban boy had been found on an inner tube off Fort Lauderdale, one of three survivors of a boat that sank as those onboard tried to defect to the U.S. His mother was among those who drowned. He is not related to Rene Gonzalez.

At his December 2001 sentencing, Rene Gonzalez was unapologetic, saying the men "were convicted for having committed the crime of being men of honor."
"I have no reason to be remorseful," he said.

Jose Basulto, who heads Brothers to the Rescue, called Gonzalez a "traitor" who should renounce his U.S. citizenship and go back to Cuba.
"If anything were to happen to him, I know we will immediately be blamed," Basulto said. "Let him go to Cuba, and if anything happens to him, let it be there."

The three-year probation term began the moment Gonzalez left the federal prison in Marianna, in Florida's Panhandle. U.S. District Judge Joan Lenard in Miami preliminarily refused to modify probation to allow him to return to Cuba, but said he could request the change again. Horowitz said he will do so in the near future.

Gonzalez has a wife and two daughters in Cuba; his wife was also implicated in the spy network and was deported after the men's arrests. She cannot legally return to the U.S. and the couple has not seen each other for over a decade.

On Friday, the U.S.-based group that has lobbied in favor of Gonzalez and the other Cuban Five members slammed the U.S. for not allowing Gonzalez to return to Cuba.
"He has been a model prisoner, even while suffering the indignity of being inhumanely deprived visits from his wife for more than 11 years," the National Committee to Free the Cuban Five wrote. "However, the U.S. government insists on punishing him and his family even more by requiring him to remain in Florida for the three years of his" probation.
The committee has created an online petition to urge President Barack Obama to allow Gonzalez to return to Cuba.

The case's chief prosecutor, Assistant U.S. Attorney Caroline Heck Miller, said the U.S. opposes allowing Gonzalez to return to Cuba because he might resume his spy career using his U.S. citizenship and because it would "effectively put him beyond any supervision by the court."
"He poses a particular, long-term threat to this country," Miller said in court papers.

Among the conditions of Gonzalez's probation is one barring him from "associating with or visiting specific places where individuals or groups such as terrorists, members of organizations advocating violence (and) organized crime figures are known to be or frequent."

U.S. Rep. Ileana Ros-Lehtinen, a Miami Republican who chairs the House Foreign Affairs Committee, said the U.S. should not keep Gonzalez in this country.
"Rene Gonzalez, like the regime he serves, is an enemy of America," said Ros-Lehtinen, who is Cuban-American. "He has American blood on his hands and dedicated his life to harming our country on behalf of a regime that is a state sponsor of terrorism."


http://news.yahoo.com/1st-cuban-5-spy-ring-us-prison-113511754.html
 
Foofie
 
  3  
Reply Fri 7 Oct, 2011 11:25 am
I really do not understand why you believe that Americans should have your focus? By what authority do you make pejorative comments about Americans for just living a non-political life (which is our civil right as private citizens)? Unless you can explain where your authority to make pejorative comments about Americans for living their lives without your focus comes from, I have to conclude your pejorative comments about Americans are just personal feelings that reflect opinion, and not based on a valid argument. But, have a nice Halloween anyway. Don't eat too much candy.
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Fri 7 Oct, 2011 12:30 pm
@Foofie,
Quote:
I really do not understand why you believe that Americans should have your focus?


Of course you don't, Foofie. Not to long ago you were denying that the US was a terrorist nation, a nation that has a long history of committing war crimes.

Now, you're just bright enough to realize that you can't do that anymore, so this is your next song and dance routine.

Quote:
By what authority do you make pejorative comments about Americans for just living a non-political life (which is our civil right as private citizens)?


Brain dead and a hypocrite you are, Foofie. That's you in a nutshell. But telling truths does not make it a pejorative. The pejorative you heap on yourselves for sitting silent while innocents around the world are murdered, while their wealth is stolen.

The US has reached its world position through a great deal of thievery, through the brutal suppression of peoples around the globe. It's only made all the worse by the constant trumpeting from the US and the brain dead portion of the population, folks like you, about how great it is, how it's out there saving the oppressed of the world.

Such a monstrous lie! And here you are trying to turn the discussion to me.

If there weren't so many brain dead Americans, you wouldn't hear such unmitigated drivel as the following, from, for dog's sake, a high government official:

Quote:
"Rene Gonzalez, like the regime he serves, is an enemy of America," said Ros-Lehtinen, who is Cuban-American. "He has American blood on his hands and dedicated his life to harming our country on behalf of a regime that is a state sponsor of terrorism."


Foofie
 
  2  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 09:53 am
@JTT,
As I have mentioned on this forum many times, I am American and a secular Jew. Now we all know that one of the negative stereotypes about Jews is that "they take over." Now here I am an American, a secular Jew, a veteran, and I swear on my favortie yo-yo, I do not want to take over. If this country is actually still a white Protestant nation that does whatever you claim it does, it is not my business, since I prefer to mind my own business; otherwise the anti-Semites would be only too quick to say, "See the Jew wants to take over." Sorry, JTT, I'm not going to sacrifice my valued position amongst the white Protestants that value my presence, for your obsessive activism. I think ethically, you should proselytize your activism to white Protestants, since they could then not be accused of "wanting to take over," since they already did, and would just be tweaking the society with a few minor changes.

You might also be planting the seeds for a future Thirty Years War in the New World. Did you ever think of that?
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 10:20 am
@Foofie,
There's nothing that compels a Jew to be an apologist for war criminals/terrorists, Foofie. But if that's what you want to be, have at 'er.

Just don't come out with nonsense providing cover for them.

Quote:
If this country is actually still a white Protestant nation that does whatever you claim it does, it is not my business, since I prefer to mind my own business; otherwise the anti-Semites would be only too quick to say, "See the Jew wants to take over." Sorry, JTT, I'm not going to sacrifice my valued position amongst the white Protestants that value my presence,


First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
Foofie
 
  2  
Reply Tue 11 Oct, 2011 07:36 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.


Based on your pejorative comments about me in the past, I would not look a gift horse in the mouth, so to speak.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Wed 12 Oct, 2011 08:58 am
@Foofie,

Quote:
Based on your pejorative comments about me in the past,


When the shoe fits, Foofie, you wear it - you brought it on yourself. You attempted to defend the most evil of men, the most evil of actions out of a badly misguided sense of patriotism. Actions that were the equivalent of those of a Hitler, a Pol Pot, a Stalin.

Foofie
 
  3  
Reply Thu 13 Oct, 2011 11:03 am
@JTT,
JTT wrote:


Quote:
Based on your pejorative comments about me in the past,


When the shoe fits, Foofie, you wear it - you brought it on yourself. You attempted to defend the most evil of men, the most evil of actions out of a badly misguided sense of patriotism. Actions that were the equivalent of those of a Hitler, a Pol Pot, a Stalin.




You seem to be rationalizing your penchant for bullying me by claiming to have an ethical right to CONTINUE pejorative comments about me, rather than the position I have. An ad hominem argument is not a valid argument.

Also, you are totally anonymous. Your geographic region, age, background, etc. are all anonymous. So, one cannot give credence to your position, since it might reflect some personal beliefs that may have nothing to do with the validity of your positions. Sort of like not knowing that a pro-Israel poster is Jewish, or a pro-Palestinean poster is Moslem. Get it? Your anonymity can make one suspicious that your positions are ideological from some unknown ideology.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Thu 13 Oct, 2011 01:12 pm
@Foofie,
Quote:
rather than the position I have.


It's your position that attracts the pejorative comments. Someone who makes apologies for war criminals/terrorists really doesn't have a "position". A person who verily delights in the slaughter of innocents deserves all the pejoratives contained within the dictionaries of all the language of the world.

Foofie
 
  3  
Reply Fri 14 Oct, 2011 10:18 am
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

Quote:
rather than the position I have.


It's your position that attracts the pejorative comments. Someone who makes apologies for war criminals/terrorists really doesn't have a "position". A person who verily delights in the slaughter of innocents deserves all the pejoratives contained within the dictionaries of all the language of the world.




But then you are not participating in a discussion about a "political position," but rather just deciding to throw ad-hominems at someone that does not subscribe to your set of beliefs (moral, etc.).

You, in effect, are PRESUPPOSING that your moral position is a priori correct, and anyone that deviates from it is a bad, bad person. Meanwhile, you have made no cogent argument for the position you take, nor made a case why anyone that does not agree with your position would be wiser to adopt your position. You have no argument to win converts. Just ad-hominems.

Perhaps, you need to take a course in marketing.

In my opinion, your posting style (ad-hominems based on disagreement) is less that mature, nor academically sound.

Plus, your obsession with the U.S.'s political involvements are just accusations that leave out the goal that those involvements pursued. Perhaps, you do not care if the U.S. economy remains robust in the world? Well, try to convince me that your claim to moral behavior trumps the U.S. economic position, in a country that historically valued economy over much other criteria? Or, have you taken over the U.S. society and now mandate that the U.S. function in a more universal moral manner? Do you get your moral position from a burning bush?

Lastly, claiming that it is my "position that attracts the pejorative comments" is just your claiming a reason to be non-analytical in your arguments, in my opinion. You cannot prove the veracity of your moral judgements, in a world where the Japanese where using biological weapons against the Chinese in WWII and we only saved the Chinese by nuking the Japanese. There are always two sides to every argument. You ARGUE neither side, in my opinion, since you presuppose the moral superiority of your side. That is not debating in any sense of the word.
JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 14 Oct, 2011 10:24 am
@Foofie,
Quote:
Perhaps, you do not care if the U.S. economy remains robust in the world?


I care for the principles that the US makes a huge pretense of following, Foofie. Why don't you?

You really are filled with these foofieisms, aren't you? The US economy has remained robust precisely because it has stolen the wealth of the poor of the world.

You go on and on about Germany and other European countries that have put the dollar before principle but you do nothing but make lame excuses for the same behavior that the US has engaged in for two centuries.
Foofie
 
  2  
Reply Fri 14 Oct, 2011 06:40 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

You go on and on about Germany and other European countries that have put the dollar before principle but you do nothing but make lame excuses for the same behavior that the US has engaged in for two centuries.


Again you are trying to empower me with the phraseology "lame excuses." I do not need "lame excuses," since I am not part of your crusade. I am a private citizen that has no interest in your obsession with U.S. policies. You keep pretending I am one of your minion, and you just need to give me the correct information, and I will be a loyal follower. Sorry, I do not follow strangers, as my mother warned me decades ago. Allow me to read your autobiography, and I'll decide if you are worthy of my attention, Your Lordship.
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Fri 14 Oct, 2011 06:44 pm
@Foofie,
Quote:
I do not need "lame excuses," since I am not part of your crusade.


No, clearly you have no intention of trying to right this major wrong. You have made it abundantly clear that you would do all in your power to cover for war criminals.
Foofie
 
  2  
Reply Sat 15 Oct, 2011 07:39 am
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

Quote:
I do not need "lame excuses," since I am not part of your crusade.


No, clearly you have no intention of trying to right this major wrong. You have made it abundantly clear that you would do all in your power to cover for war criminals.


You are making false accusations. I cover for no one. I am just not involved in "taking over" this country for a supposedly better political posture, since as a Jew, I am not qualified to effect such a monumental task in behalf of the vast majority of Gentile Americans. You are acting anti-Semitic, since as a Gentile you are harrassing a Jew in behalf of your goals. May I remind you that Jews only sin with a sinful act, not the sinful thought, like in Catholicism. Please refrain from such proselytizing Your Lordship.
JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 15 Oct, 2011 09:07 am
@Foofie,
Quote:
You are making false accusations. I cover for no one.


You sure have, Foof, but you found that it was impossible so, as I've mentioned, you've changed your tack.

Quote:
You are acting anti-Semitic, since as a Gentile you are harrassing a Jew in behalf of your goals.


Stop whining, Foofie.

Foofie
 
  3  
Reply Sat 15 Oct, 2011 03:27 pm
@JTT,
JTT wrote:

Quote:
You are making false accusations. I cover for no one.


You sure have, Foof, but you found that it was impossible so, as I've mentioned, you've changed your tack.

Quote:
You are acting anti-Semitic, since as a Gentile you are harrassing a Jew in behalf of your goals.


Stop whining, Foofie.




Your rhetoric is becoming hostile. Listen, Your Lordship, I believe that whatever my country has done in its history, or will do, is 100% correct, based on the fact that the U.S.A. is the best country in the whole wide world. Now, if you believe that the U.S.A. has not always acted as you would prefer, I cannot change your opinion. But, you are bullying one little New York Jew, since in my opinion, because you believe your concerns are so righteous, bullying a Jew is quite acceptable. My being a Jew should be quite important in your analysis, since this is a Gentile Christian country, and I am quite fortunate to be a citizen here. You do not see this from my perspective. You seem to be falsely believing that we can both work towards a better country. You are ignoring the fact that, as soon as a Jew wants to make changes, the ugly head of anti-Semitism rises. So, Your Lordship, I wish you no good fortune in your endeavors to change the U.S.A. It has been very good to me and my family, and not being an ingrate, I also have the good sense of any dog, and do not bite the hand that feeds me. In my opinion, you seem to feel it is acceptable to bite the hand that feeds one.

Again, I wish you a small lump of coal in your Christmas stocking.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Sat 15 Oct, 2011 04:20 pm
@JTT,
As communist spies, thay shoud have been SHOT (or electocuted, like the Rosenbergs).





David
0 Replies
 
 

 
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