The pursuit of wisom

It might be the pursuit of "wisom" for some, but there are a few who seem to enjoy arguing as a hobby, or something.

I'm not sure how much wisdom there is to be found in particular posts, but the process, I think, can maybe teach something valuable.

That is what I am hoping for.

I know that I've really had to sharpen up my ability to construct and defend arguments since I've been on discussion forums. That has helped me a lot in my grad school papers. I've also learned to examine my assumptions before engaging in a debate. Seems to be the sort of wisdom I'd hoped to gain...

Wisdom might be simply be the realization that the "pursuit" is futile.

If it means anything, it includes being tolerant of one's own mistakes and thereby being tolerant of the mistakes of others.

Yes, I have noticed that it tends to be my failures that grant me wisdom, not my successes.

"Why do we post in a2k?" My reasons for posting questions is because I want to be told that I'm wrong by someone around my intellegence level. It doesn't matter who's right or wrong. It helps to expand my understanding and learn more about the world around me. Generally when we choose our personal friends, we find people here who share our views and that we have a lot in common with. In these type of forums, I actually look for the opposite. The further someones views from mine the better. Whether they're completely right or wrong is irrelevant, because what they do is help to show me different ways of thinking and expand on things I didn't see or understand before...sometimes...sometimes it's just pointless ranting and jibberish.

An example of this would be: http://able2know.org/topic/165004-7
My posts start towards the bottom.

Our reasons, it seems, are very similar. But I sometimes let myself get riled up by posters who seem to care for nothing but arguing silly points that don't add up no matter how you spin it. Through the years I have posted my share of outright nonsense, no use in denying that. But we have people like Setanta, JLNobody and Fresco and many others, who give good input, each in their own way. I consider it a matter of integrity to be able to step down when it becomes clear that I am talking nonsense, even in the face of great insult. But recently we have had some additions to the forum who takes such gestures as signs of inferiority, and I find the fundamental lack of mutual respect in such attitudes to be distasteful, and on such occasions I find myself leaving the constructive discussion and entering the battle...

I also get riled up in a way myself. I sometimes enjoy arguing with a person being silly or ridiculous, not because I really get anything out of it. I just find it to be fun. It could help them see the error in their argument (assuming they're just really ignorant), or help other's to learn from their mistakes. I've posted nonsense as well, but I never step down if I'm talking nonsense. I learn from my mistakes to help better my argument, or make new adjustments with the insight that I receive. The very first post that I made which stated off this insatiable thirst for knowledge was:

"I like how people on both sides are so blind. Every christian who exclaims the "truth" of the religion is an idiot. The very definition of truth is: Conformity to fact or actuality. Since all religion is based on faith, that statement is nothing but a hugh contradiction. Faith is the belief in something that is not based on logical proof or material evidence (aka facts). Even if you could prove that God exists it would ruin the whole religion because all faith in it would be gone because you can't have faith in what you know, without a doubt, to be true. "

A later post by someone else reveled a great deal of "gross" ignorance in my post (as I'm sure many can see). I've actually derived a lot of my thoughts on the subject from him and someone else in which I'm ever so greatful for...although they'll sadly never know the extent of it. Without them I never would have been able to keep up with your thoughts on everything we've discussed (at least not initially). I know we haven't seen eye to eye on everything but it's been great non-the-less. So thanks for everything...so far anyway ;-) hope to disagree with you again soon!

What I mean by "step down" is simply admitting your error when someone makes it clear to you.
As for making people see the error in their argument, that works if whoever you are talking with is interested in learning and deepening their understanding. Too many of the people who joined recently are of the mind that their understanding is perfect and there is nothing anyone here can teach them. I learned that the hard way.

I believe that you should only really "step down" if you were intentionally ignorant, especially if it was in an arrogant way. If you're ignorant for the simple fact that you didn't know, then I don't believe that there should be a reason to "step down". You learn that you were wrong, if you're wrong, you'll find out from that person why you were wrong. Once you find that out, you can incorporate that into your own idea's (to varying degree's) and continue the debate from there. If it's a drastic error, as in you're going 180 degrees in reverse, then it would simply be an "aha!" moment, and continue the discussion on the correct path.



To me, it doesn't truly matter to me if they see their error, it would be nice, but not neccesary. Every instance in our lives is an opportunity to learn, whether it's from the smartest person on the planet or the dumbest. You learn just as much from the smart and wise as you do from the dumb and dull. Just depends on your perception of the situation.



Very true, there have been a lot of people like that. I, however, enjoy greatly flustering people who are ignorant and calling them out each time. By doing so, it only flusters them more, only to then make more mistakes in their arguments. It's not really about them learning they're wrong. It's more a matter of making an example out of them for the benefit of everyone else observing. I know it not a great feeling to be...humiliated?...in such a way, but it's a sort of wake up call...hopefully they'll hear. It's happened to me, I know I didn't like it, but I feel it made me a much better and more humble person in general.