JOHN GALSWORTH & THE FORSYTES

I read them one summer (@1975) after being sent to rusticate with my grandparents while my parents traveled. My grandfather had a huge collection of literature and I was at an age when long soap opera sagas appealed to me. I remember liking the books very much and spent hours reading them on a screened porch with my grandparent's snoring bulldogs. I attempted a re-read a few years ago but lost interest fairly quickly. I think my brain has been corrupted by faster paced, more contemporary styles of writing. I watched a chunk of the recent Masterpiece Theatre presentation and thought it well done.

I've not ever seen it on film or television, although i suspect it lends itself well to those media. I found that it dragged somewhat in places, especially after the first three novels. Those are a tightly woven story, so i've always wondered what motivated Galsworthy to write six more novels. The first three constitute a single thought, in one sense, or a single investigation of Soames Forsyte and his social class. I've finished The White Monkey (number four) and am now re-reading The Silver Spoon (number five), and although i enjoy them, i don't think they're nearly as well done as the first three.

I also just recently became aware of the way he wrote them. The Man of Property was published in 1906, and In Chancery and To Let were not published until after the war. So the first novel could really be a "stand-alone," and with it's dramatic conclusion, perhaps that was the original intent. The next two are well tied to the first, though, and make a well-written trilogy.

The next six were written in a four year period from 1924 to 1928. They include Soames, of course, and shift the focus to his daughter Fleur, and her husband, Michael Mont. I'm still in two minds about Mont. He seems rather unreal to me, but then, i didn't live in England in the "inter-war" years, so maybe he was of a type that one did find there then.

Damned good writer, though, for whatever anyone thinks of the Forsyte series.

I enjoyed them a lot at the time...especially the first three, though I found them sort of portentous...but they are simply fascinating in terms of the characters and the era.

I found the irony a bit heavy, though.

There was a great Beebs TV production on a bit later, which I loved. (Not the most recent one.)

Portentous?

Love that phrase. It reminds me of my own favorite summer, spent much the same way.

I'm so glad that you started a thread on these novels. You list more novels about the Forsytes than I knew existed.

I have an interesting experience with them that is the opposite of Greenwitch's.

I grew up in Dearborn, MI and was a precocious reader. However, kids were not allowed to borrow 'adult' books until they were in high school. I tested as reading on the college level in the 6th grade and spent a few years totally bored with what would be called "young adult" novels . . . the only one whose title I remember was "Beanie Leads a Secret Life" and the only thing I remember from that book was Beanie's attempt to paint the lawn furniture pale green and to add maroon cushions emblazoned with white seahorses.

Anyway, I am older than Greenwitch. I finally got access to the adult room in 1961 and the first three books I borrowed were Ben-Hur, Main Street by Sinclair Lewis and The Forsyte Saga. Odd collection. Ben-Hur was obvious: I had seen the 1958 sword-and-sandal . . . or was it a Biblical . . . epic and wanted to read the book. I had to wait three years because my mother refused to violate the library policy by borrowing the book on my behalf.


I loved Main Street but, at 14, I thought nothing happened in The Forsyte Saga and could not understand why it was such a well thought of book.

When PBS aired the British production of The Saga in 2003-04, I had to watch it, particularly because of the buzz surrounding Damian Lewis' performance as Soames. The powerful acting made me want to reread the novel.

This time, I thought it funny. I loved it where as at 14, I thought it nothing but the story of a family, not far removed from the "begats" of the Old Testament.

The irony is that I was in a book group around the same time and we read Main Street. I was so bored with Main Street that I found it impossible to read.

I'm certain Galsworthy intended them to be a significant dissection of the Victorian middle class. I surmise, for no very good reason, that the last six novels differ from the first three because he moved beyond the Victorian middle class. As for pomposity, i'd lay that at the door of the characters, and not the author. Soames is definitely pompous--his father James, less so. I'd say Old Joylon was arrogant rather than pompous, and Young Joylon free of either vice. Fascinating stuff.

Yes, i saw a lot of what i thought of as subtle humor. The entire character of Swithin Forsyte. Old James Forsyte's constant refrain: "I don't know. I can't tell. Nobody tells me anything." He extends the humor when in the fourth novel, Soames, now in his sixties, contemplates the bewildering prospect of Fleur reaching a marriageable age--and at one point, actually says that he doesn't know, he can't tell, nobody tells him anything. But the best is old George Forsyte, laughing at them all. For George, his family is a source of constant amusement.

Here's a link to the Masterpiece presentation. I recommend it:

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/masterpiece/forsyte/

I also have to make a pitch for the one section of the mini-series that improved upon Galsworthy's presentation.

We all know that Soames is obsessed with Irene and that he refuses to take no for an answer. In fact, Soames does not give Irene any time to meet another man.

However, during his siege of Irene, there was a period of time when they did not see each other. Perhaps, Soames' will weakened then. As often happens, they accidentally ran into each other. They met at the Victorian resort of Bath.

In both the novel and the mini-series, Irene is cordial to Soames as one would be with someone one hasn't seen in a long time. I'm certain she felt his pursuit had died out and that she could simply regard him as an acquaintance.

In the drama, they are shown talking together in one of the public spaces. Soames looks about the room and sees another couple. The others lean in toward each other and the man holds the woman's hand and occasionally kisses it. They are smiling and there is an element of sexual excitement about them.

Of course, Soames completely fails to realize that these other people are "on the same page," that they mutually respond to each other in a positive way. Soames takes Irene's hand and kisses it. She is so upset that she leaves.

Throughout the drama, Soames is depicted as professionally competent but emotionally and socially at sea.

Damian Lewis' performance is amazing. Lewis, now 39, played the older, tightly wound Soames who is completely unlike his own contemporary, easy going self.

Or even emotionally crippled . . . that entire family dynamic is very interesting. His father and mother obviously love one another, and love their son and daughter. Winifred was a fool about Montague Dartie, but she loved him, and she loved her children--and Val Dartie turns out to be a very decent sort.

Soames only really loves when he loves his daughter Fleur, and she has grown up to be so selfish, so self-centered, that she wounds him constantly. I think it's a marvelous story.

I would have been 14 when I read the books, and that is a good age to take on sagas.

POM, I did have the opposite literary experience of you. I think my bibliophile family believed if it was good enough to keep in the house than anyone should be able to read it. I even read my father's Playboy magazines. When one of my mother's friends saw me curled up on a lawn chair with an issue she commented that she was shocked my mother would allow it. My mother shrugged said "she's the only person I know who really does read it for the articles".

I think the first three volumes of The Forsytes are worthwhile, but I don't think I'd push anyone to plod on to finish the full set. The recent TV version is worth watching just for the costumes and sets.

Yeah, I was 14 as well . . . but I was 14 a decade earlier.

Your mother's remark was funny!

My mother was very Catholic and very much a rules follower. She was an avid reader, but, because we were a working class family, the only books we owned were The Encyclopedia Americana, an Atlas and a dictionary. Notice, there was no Bible. While she took us to the library every week, she made me follow the rules. Wish she bent them from time to time!

NOPE!!. Yeaqrs ago when they had the BBC show,I tried to get through the first one "A Man of proerty?" .Too foppish for me, .

I totally agree. It's odd that Soames is so unaware and so inable to love because his parents did love him.

I'm now nearing the end of the fifth book. Fleur, very much a selfish and self-centered young woman, is learning some hard lessons about love and loyalty and the value of friendship and mere acquaintance. Galsworthy admirably maintains a theme.