Plastic bag ban?

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There is going to be a vote shortly in Austin regarding an ordinance that would prevent supermarkets from using the ubiquitous plastic bag. I have just vaguely heard of this, but duh...seems like a good idea.

I wonder what would replace this bag, as of course not everyone will start to bring their own bags.

I stopped at a supermarket this morning, and asked the cashier if she knew anything about it, and she said "yeah, I hope that ordinance doesn't pass"

I asked why, but to be honest, she was very soft spoken, and it was kinda noisy in there, but I could make out something about political kickbacks and so on. I couldn't hear very well.

She did then say something about bags from woven straw, which I don't know anything about.

Here's a link to the newspaper in San Francisco, but I don't know anything beyond this.

Anyone care to educate or give an opinion?

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Here's Iowa's take.

We used to have some manufacturers making plastic bags out of cornstarch. That was at least 15 years ago. Apparently the bags were not as strong. The grocery baggers don't even ask if I want paper or plastic.

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i have heard of people bringing their used bags back the next time they shop.

the shopping bags we get have a recycle triangle on them

http://www.mendip.gov.uk/Images/image005.jpg

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Some stores in Massachusetts will pay 2 cents per plastic bag returned to the store.

Nothing quite like the "big ideas" of Massachusetts!

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i've been preferring paper bags for years, thinking how good of me, how easier they are to recycle and all...

turns out that more harmful chemicals are used during the treatment of the paper than during the making of the plastic bags Confused

in the last year i did put a lot more effort to remember to always bring my tote bags, and i usually do. back in slovakia, we have to buy bags if we forget to bring our own. they're plastic bags... but it helps you remember to bring your own.

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Region Philbis wrote:

i have heard of people bringing their used bags back the next time they shop.

the shopping bags we get have a recycle triangle on them

Well, yeah, but how many people actually do that?
2 cents a bag? wow, I can stop contributing to my IRA. Kidding aside, I don't see that as a big incentive.

Cornstarch bags?
Maybe they are made stronger than back then?

are they totally made of cornstarch?

What other material can be used?

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Chai wrote:

Cornstarch bags?
Maybe they are made stronger than back then?

are they totally made of cornstarch?

What other material can be used?

Cornstarch bags aren't 100% cornstarch. The starch is the "glue" that holds the bag together. The starch breaks down faster than a 100% plastic bag would so instead of a plastic bag remaining as a plastic bag for years on end it turns into a pile of pastic powder in 6 or 8 months.

They were created in response to the issues of littering,damaging wildlife and landfill mass. They don't really address the issue of things like energy conservation.

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There can be complications re different bags and different waste management practices in cities and counties...

Two short LA Times articles on this -

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-plastic11apr11,1,2097199.story

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/editorials/la-ed-trash12apr12,1,586643.story

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How about using boxes?

If you have to drive to the store, you could put a couple of boxes in your cart, shop, and the bagger would just reload the groceries back into the boxes, which would fit nicely into your trunk.

we all probably have some sturdy boxes around the house anyway.

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dagmaraka wrote:

i've been preferring paper bags for years, thinking how good of me, how easier they are to recycle and all...

turns out that more harmful chemicals are used during the treatment of the paper than during the making of the plastic bags

All this stuff can start geting interesting when you dig into it. There is a guy that did some research on foam vs. paper vs. glass vs. ceramic coffee cups that is pretty illumunating too!

http://www.ilea.org/lcas/hocking1994.html

It looks like foam cups aren't as bad for things overall as many people assume.

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dagmaraka wrote:

i've been preferring paper bags for years, thinking how good of me, how easier they are to recycle and all...

turns out that more harmful chemicals are used during the treatment of the paper than during the making of the plastic bags

in the last year i did put a lot more effort to remember to always bring my tote bags, and i usually do. back in slovakia, we have to buy bags if we forget to bring our own. they're plastic bags... but it helps you remember to bring your own.

I remember them doing that here - for a short while - they would charge you a small fee for the bags. It didn't last long though.

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Chai wrote:

How about using boxes?

If you have to drive to the store, you could put a couple of boxes in your cart, shop, and the bagger would just reload the groceries back into the boxes, which would fit nicely into your trunk.

we all probably have some sturdy boxes around the house anyway.

We do that for the warehouse stores around here (BJs and Costco). The boxes that were originally used to pack the products are then available to use to carry your groceries. Seems like a good compromise.

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My old coop grocery in California had a stack of boxes by the cash registers - I preferred using them to paper bags (they are making those less and less sturdy) or plastic bags. I have some canvas bags, but am lame at remembering to bring them to the store.

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fishin wrote:

dagmaraka wrote:
i've been preferring paper bags for years, thinking how good of me, how easier they are to recycle and all...

turns out that more harmful chemicals are used during the treatment of the paper than during the making of the plastic bags

All this stuff can start geting interesting when you dig into it. There is a guy that did some research on foam vs. paper vs. glass vs. ceramic coffee cups that is pretty illumunating too!

http://www.ilea.org/lcas/hocking1994.html

It looks like foam cups aren't as bad for things overall as many people assume.

bleech, foam cups.

I read the part in your link about making a reusable item worthwhile means of course using it a number of times, and the energy expenditure of the dishwater, water, etc.

Sometime I think people go a little overboard, or rather, they have a short sighted view of reusable.

I drink a cup of java in the morning, and usually a cup of green tea during the day, meaning liquids that have to be put in some sort of cup like thing to drink from.

Ceramic mugs don't do it for me, I don't know, something about the feel of it on my lips when I'm drinking. Foam cups? I'd rather go without for how that feels on my mouth.

A while back I ordered I think 200 of of 8 oz "Anthora" paper cups. You know, the one's you see in NYC, with the Greek design that says "We Are Happy To Serve You" on it? Well, I got them because, frankly, coffee tastes SOOOOOO much better out of those cups.

I didn't want to run out after just 200 mornings of coffee, so I found myself just swishing one out with a little water and leaving it on the drainboard. The cups lasts a week. I mean, what? there's liquid in it for about 15 or 20 minutes. Like you couldn't use it again without putting it through a dishwasher?

I'm getting that way with paper towels in the rest room. You know how you'll automatically pull out at least 2 or three sheets to dry your hands? I watched someone pull out about 6 or 7 a while back, wiped the whole wad over her hands and tossed it. I thought "how wasteful" Just to see, when I washed my hands I pulled one sheet. It quickly got mostly soaked, and I wondered why the manufacturers made them that size so you'd have to take more. Then I realized something.....Yeah, the paper towel WAS almost all wet, but...my HANDS were almost all dry. I swiped the towel over my hands once more, dry hands, completely used towels....cut paper useage by 50 per cent.

A little thing? Yeah.

How many little things do we ignore each day?

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I don't know about that "2 cents in Massachusetts". I've never seen that anywhere here, BUT most grocery stores I've shopped in do have a recycling barrel for used plastic bags, so I just stuff a plastic bag full of other plastic bags and every couple of weeks take it in and dump it in the barrel. Remember, what plastic bags are made of is oil. Every time you get one, you're increasing US dependency on foreign oil, and adding that little bit to global warming. Tho whoever said that paper making uses lots of noxious chemicals was right too, as those of us in MA know who have ever driven by a paper mill in NH or ME. Cambridge Public Works recycling picks up cardboard and paper, but only if it's bundled or in paper bags, NOT plastic bags. I get paper bags from the grocery store just to recycle other paper in, but weirdly they put the paper bag inside a plastic bag when they do it. Now what's the point in that.

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Our Whole Foods and Trader Joe's will also pay 5cents when you bring your own bags - 5c for each of them. It's not a huge incentive, but it helps. it's a "we notice that you care" and then you feel good about yourself encouragement. Works for me, i like to feel good about myself, heh.

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username wrote:

I get paper bags from the grocery store just to recycle other paper in, but weirdly they put the paper bag inside a plastic bag when they do it. Now what's the point in that.

The girl specifically requests that they do that when she shops. She claims the paper bag allows her to fit more in one bag than plastic alone and the plastic gives her handles to hold on to.

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Why not (like Trader Joe's) have paper bags with handles?

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CalamityJane wrote:

Why not (like Trader Joe's) have paper bags with handles?

Now you're just talking silly! Razz

(My grocery store has them. Her's doesn't.)

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One of the problems with canvas bags is they are big and when filled, they are heavy. I'm limited how much poundage I can carry at one time and I hate to invest in $200 worth of bags to carry $75 worth of groceries.

Still, that bit of wild extravagance is coming. I have Moments of Madness and thanks to the Internet I can act on those moments at any hour of the day or night.

I lie: They are on sale at Amazon (A2K link)

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw/102-5805506-0965726?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=canvas+grocery+bags

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