What do you think of the symbol: dragon? What does it imply?

Mostly evil as their legends always involve a dragon being slain. It could be from the mongols or huns invading eurasia. They probably revered the dragon and so the slaying of the dragon was to defeat and identify the enemy.

How to make a change
What do you think that if Chinese people change this dragon to panda or some other animal?
In tradition dragon is an imaginative figure to which Chinese people worship. For many years it's a symbol used to represent cohesion of the nation and many Chinese people regard them as offsprings of the dragon. The question is whether it is necessary to change or what other symbol to be chosen to take the place of the dragon?

Actually, the dragon symbolized the Emperor of China.

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What is a change
That conclusion may have been out of date sine there is no emperor inn China now. Like any other country China is entitled to a symbol to outstand itself and what is that?

muoyuer, There is no longer an emperor in China, but the symbol still lives on. If one visits the Forbidden City in Beijing, the imperial dragon still remains as the symbol for the emperor. The summer palace still has a dragon at the front gate.

btw, WELCOME to A2K.

symbols for 2008 Olympics
The dragon in the eyes of Chinese is just a symbol like the white house in the states carrying no more powerful color or religion at all. It's rooted in the heart of Chinese people. There is a debate in China that dragon be changed. By the way, have any one seen the symbols or mascots for the oncoming Olympic in Beijing. There are five different figures not including dragon. What do you think of that?

Muoyuer--

Welcome to A2K.

Since I'm a firm believer in democracy, I think the Chinese people should have the major voice in choosing a national symbol. Perhaps since China is such a large and diverse country there should be several national symbols?

mainstream and cultural diversity
Yes, China is a big country with cultural diversity where it should be the mainstream as the majority Chinese are Han nationality. If there should have been so many kinds of symbols it would damage unity of the entire Chinese nation. Suppose a national anthem is sung by as many languages as those existing within one country when the national flag is raised.

Here in the U.S. each of the fifty states has a state animal and a state bird and a state tree and a state fish....and on and on and on.

I associate a dragon with all of China, but then my perspective is that of a westerner.

In the West, dragons tend to guardians of treasures of one sort or another. They are dangerous obstacles to be overcome, and usually are slain rather than outwitted.

In China the dragon is a quite different character. Dragons are associated with water, and are generally regarded as "lucky". The rivers, streams, lakes are the natural habitat of the dragon. Larger, more powerful and dynamic are the dragons who live in the oceans. Each body of water has its own sort of dragon. The faster and more turbulent the water, the more likely the dragon is to escape his lair and lay waste to the countryside. One of the great periodic disasters of China are the floods when the Yellow River is swollen above the dykes that contain it. Flood is a great killer and destroyer of China.

The Chinese also associate the Dragon with the sky, because it is the sky that brings life giving rain to the people, thus providing agricultural abundance against another one of China's great killers, famine. The rains must remain in balance for the country to remain prosperous. Too little rain, and famine results. Too much rain and the rivers overflow sweeping away homes, crops and people.

The Emperor (really a Western term) is the "Son of Heaven", and rules China only so long as he retains the Mandate of Heaven. The Mandate of Heaven is manifest by how well the country is governed and by the prosperity and fortunes of the kingdom. The Emperor is responsible, and therefore is required to correctly perform all the rituals required for keeping the Chinese world in balance. The Emperor's life was pretty constrained by those around him who kept faithful records of his bowel movements, his sex life, and his annual rituals performed at various temples and significant landmarks. The Emperor's symbol was indeed a dragon, but with a different number of toes on each limb. Only the Emperor and his household could sport the Imperial Dragon. The Emperor's minders were one branch of the Taoists who specialized in astrology, alchemy and magic.

Actually there was a correspondence between the Emperor's behavior and the prosperity of the realm. The government was headed by professional bureaucrats called Mandarins. To become a Mandarin one had to pass the Imperial Civil Services tests, and even the poorest commoner could become a Mandarin if he was able to pass the Examinations. A family's fortunes could be greatly improved by having even a remote cousin pass the Imperial Examination. Thus, the Chinese cultural bias for educating the children for success. The Examination covered the classics of Confucism and poetry, for instance, but was very short on what we would regard as practical training to be government managers and judges. People cheated, and over time the Mandarate became filled with people unqualified, even by Imperial standards.

Mandarins were somewhat like little kings in the districts they were sent to govern. They were responsible for maintaining the local dykes and food storehouses meant to carry the people over periodic threats of famine, collect the Imperial taxes, and to administer Justice. While the Emperor and his Court kept a close eye on things, this system worked pretty good and the country was at peace. However, by the third Emperor of each Dynasty the system would begin to break down. The Emperors as time passed turned their interest more and more to personal indulgence. They commissioned great Artworks, gathered ever larger and more luxurious Courts, courtesans, and eunuchs around them. eunuchs were always popular with the Emperor because being deprived of their sexuality, they were more docile and less of a threat to the Dynasty. The Emperor's minders also tended to neglect their ritual duties, and the Court minders became less willing to thwart the Imperial Will.

This opened the gates of opportunity for massive improprieties. The Mandarins put their family members into important positions, swelling the Civil Service payrolls. The costs of government went up, and so did the taxes. At every linkage point from the local Mandarin to the Courtier closest to the Emperor took greater and greater portions of the taxes for themselves and their families. The costs of government quickly became greater than the taxes could bear. The solution tended to be that Mandarins either neglected to maintain the dykes, or used inferior materials. They stole the grain from the warehoused and resold for money that went straight into the Mandarin's family coffers. Local peasants, pressed hard and witnessing the graft and corruption became ever more restive, and the Mandarate's administration of Justice became more and more harsh.

These conditions revived the Secret Societies, and the peasantry formed networks of mutual support. That prompted the government to station more troops in the area where potential rebellion might erupt. The peasants now had to pay and keep the soldiers hanging about doing what idle soldiers tend to do. Small revolts led to larger revolts. Then, either the rain failed or the country was flooded. All of these signs were taken as symbolic of the "fact" that the Emperor no longer possessed the Mandate of Heaven. As the Emperor's authority came into question, rebellions became widespread and extremely violent ... another sign that the sitting Dynasty was illegitimate. Soldiers, drawn from the peasantry would begin to mutiny and join the revolt whose leaders were often peasant leaders of the Secret Societies. Once the Emperor was overthrown, the country would go into chaos as one leader/warlord fought to gain supremacy over all contenders. Eventually, someone would be successful in brutally seizing all the power, and a new Dynasty would begin its reign of a few centuries.

All the result of the Emperor's failing to to constrain the dragons within the proper balance necessary for the Middle Kingdom to remain secure and prosperous.

How about a change?
Since dragons carry too many implications uncomfortable to people other than Chinese why not change another animal for the national symbol. More and more westerners tend to regard China as a threat in this ongoing century should Chinese change dragons to a mild animal, say panda?

One doesn't erase thousands of years of deeply inbred culture easily. Why should the Chinese bother to change the folk beliefs of their remote ancestors to present a more PC brand to the world? How easily do you think you might banish Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny if some yahoo in another culture thought them somehow offensive? People don't wear their folk beliefs and values around as a fashion statement.

Knowing a bit about the significance to dragons to the Chinese tells us a lot about their culture and values, and helps us to re-examine the sources of our own icons. Oh what a dreary world it would be if only a single culture and set of values reigned supreme. Diversity is a good hedge against tyranny, oppression and plain old boredom. Celebrate differences.

Asherman--

Well said.

how to keep tradition
I am Chinese and found that there are articles in newspapers raising the debates on whether we should change and some favor westerners and some insist on our tradition, the latter say we should stick to our tradition and enhance cultivating our values in our children's mind with a very fast change taken place in China. Our kids are more and more interested in Westernization or Americanization. They like Harry Porter better than our heroes in history. They prefer American fast food to local dishes. They keep the rhythm with what is going on in backstreets in New York. Those who are in favor of changing dragon image advocate that China should go together with the world trend and they say the world is a village and we are all the same villagers. They even go as far as to say in order to make China milder to the outside, the dragon should be changed.

Cultural diversity is the thing it should be like different people in different colors. The question is that even in China there are fewer people who know the origin of dragon and how it comes into being in the blood of Chinese people. Should we make some change only for the sake of catering to westerners?

The Welsh have their dragon - and you'd have a fight on your hands if you suggested they swap it for something less dragon-like... say a sheep

Is there a China Threat?
There are two viewpoints toward China. One is China threat and the other being demonizing China. In fact China is pursuing its peaceful rise without interfering others' affairs. She is focusing its priorities onto its people, their clothing, shelter and their health care. Changing from planned economy to the market economy requires not only time but also lessons and experiences from the advanced world so China cares very much about her image on the international stage. It's fair for people to know more before they make up their attitute toward China.

Actually, in the West there are many more than just two attitudes towards China. China remains a mysterious place to most people outside Asia. Some fear China, some see it as a financial opportunity, and even more have no fixed opinion whatsoever. Politically, the West remains distrustful of a nominally Communist State, especially one with the world's largest population, a "homeland" larger than Europe, and a whole lot of major problems. In a world increasingly concerned over environmental pollution, China is among the worst polluters, and the pollution gets worse every day.

China maintains one of the most active espionage apparatuses in the world, and they aggressively pursue highly sensitive military and industrial secrets. China has maintained a very large army for the past sixty years. Now they are greatly improving their airforces capability, and will soon have a respectable Navy. Chinese domination of Tibet is very unpopular in the West, and Taiwan remains a concern. China's military potential will be closely watched, as it should be.

Those who know China a bit, admire the fortitude of the Chinese People. We wish them well, and hope that the MIddle Kingdom becomes prosperous and secure against famine, flood, and disease. The efforts being made by the PRC to provide for the People's long-term welfare are admirable. Whether China can successfully escape the several potential disasters that threaten, no one can say. The hurtles to be overcome are great, and changing cultural values to slow down population growth is an almost hopeless task. The recent rise of a strong consumer oriented ecconomy is going to be difficult to manage.

China is a major element in whatever direction humanity takes over the next few centuries. Hopefully, the world will find a balance where all of humanity can live together peacefully. Unfortunately, the lessons of history make that a pretty long shot.