Walter Hinteler
 
  4  
Wed 1 Nov, 2023 08:10 am
@hightor,
hightor wrote:
Welcome back – good to see you here again.
Exclamation
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  2  
Wed 1 Nov, 2023 11:29 am
Thank you thank you. Miss the intimate conversations we have over here from time to time. The rest of the internet is so….big.

Glad to see you sane people still keeping the crazies in check.
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Mon 6 Nov, 2023 03:04 pm
@izzythepush,
Or over here either.
0 Replies
 
tsarstepan
 
  3  
Thu 16 Nov, 2023 03:35 pm
@Lash,
0 Replies
 
PoshSpice
 
  -1  
Fri 1 Dec, 2023 10:20 am
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/4289365-rfk-jr-trump-votes-biden-three-way-race-poll/amp/

Kennedy is making quite a splash in the 2024 contest.

Oddly, for some, he seems to pull more from Trump and may help Biden. Of course, Biden has hemorrhaged A LOT of support from black voters and voting Dems, so this one is waaaay up in the air.

_______________

Independent presidential candidate Robert F. Kennedy Jr. appears to pull more support from former President Trump than President Biden in a hypothetical general election matchup, according to a new poll.

A Quinnipiac University poll released Wednesday showed Biden narrowly ahead of Trump by 1 point — 47 percent to 46 percent, within the margin of error — in a head-to-head matchup. But with Kennedy in a three-way race, Biden is ahead with 39 percent to Trump’s 36 percent and Kennedy’s 22 percent.
bobsal u1553115
 
  2  
Fri 1 Dec, 2023 10:41 am
@PoshSpice,
Quote:
Kennedy is making quite a splash in the 2024 contest.


Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Fri 1 Dec, 2023 10:51 am
@bobsal u1553115,
With all the many things Kennedy gets wrong, and since he's best-known these days for spreading dangerous conspiracy theories: he will certainly attract some.
PoshSpice
 
  -2  
Fri 1 Dec, 2023 10:51 am
22% is considerably more than the less than 3% Jill Stein got that Democrats cried robbed Hillary.

So less than 3% is more substantial than 22%?

Or you concede Stein had no effect on Hillary’s loss?

Just pick one.
hightor
 
  2  
Fri 1 Dec, 2023 02:51 pm
@PoshSpice,
Quote:
So less than 3% is more substantial than 22%?

I don't think Stein got over 2% in 2016. The point is moot, however. The 2024 election isn't until next November. For some reason, lots of people are simply attracted to the Kennedy name. He's downplaying his crackpot credentials right now but with more exposure his numbers will drop. How's Cornel West doing?
PoshSpice
 
  -3  
Fri 1 Dec, 2023 03:00 pm
@hightor,
Cornel **** the bed needlessly, as you obviously know.
He had about 6%—encountered some horseshit from Green outliers and decided to dump the greens for an independent run.

I was working with Greens on ballot access (which is Job 1) & we dumped his ass+ our Green Party volunteerism.

He had the potential to blow a hole in politics as usual, but he didn’t seem up for the challenge. Great boon for Democrats.

Still time to find someone worthy of our time and energy.

It’s anyone’s game.

Don’t even know how I’ll vote—except for the knowledge it will be outside the corrupt genocidal duopoly.

And you?

engineer
 
  4  
Fri 1 Dec, 2023 03:24 pm
@PoshSpice,
PoshSpice wrote:

Oddly, for some, he seems to pull more from Trump and may help Biden.

Why would you find this surprising? Trump has a lot of issues but a lot of Republicans aren't looking to vote Democratic so Kennedy seems like an option. There are some Democrats not happy with Biden, but those middle of the road independents look at a thriving economy (despite years now of economists telling us a recession is just around the bend) and no wars and no covid shutdown and say "not so bad". The reality is that Biden is an old fashioned (very old) Democratic centrist. If you are in the center, he might not get you excited, but you're not looking to switch horses to a person like Kennedy.
PoshSpice
 
  -4  
Fri 1 Dec, 2023 03:44 pm
@engineer,
Well, first of all, for the average voter, the Kennedy name is exciting, it denotes Democrat Party, and it brings votes.

Those in the loop who have the kind of knowledge we do see a lot of nuance, but we’re a distinct minority—and most will vote that name and they’ll be thrilled to vote Independent because of disgust with Trump and Biden—more so Biden.

From that more knowledgeable minority, Kennedy still means primarily liberal policies, but in this time of great distrust of our institutions, a Kennedy vote hinges on his seemingly conflicting policies (Zionism—pro-Dem —& — vax skepticism—pro-conservative + Ind.).

Free speech is also a rallying cry for a mixed segment of voters (conservatives, lefties), but the antiwar left considers RFK poison now because of his allegiance to Israel (& Schmuley & genocide of Palestinians.)

Recapping: I don’t think anything good can happen at this point.
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Fri 1 Dec, 2023 10:20 pm
@PoshSpice,
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahha!!!! Stop it, Lash yer killin' me!
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Fri 1 Dec, 2023 10:26 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
Quote:
He will certainly attract some.



The kind of people who gawk at auto accidents, and low information voters. And no doubt, Biden and whoever the GOP nominates will get some portions of that marginal pool, too.
0 Replies
 
PoshSpice
 
  -3  
Sat 2 Dec, 2023 01:36 am
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2023/11/11/politics/robert-kennedy-rfk-2024-election-outcome/index.html

How RFK Jr. could change the outcome of the 2024 election

CNN

There are few things you can be more certain of in life than a Democrat or a Republican winning a US presidential election. We don’t usually do third parties or independents in this country. Chances are Democrat Joe Biden or Republican Donald Trump will be elected a year from now.

But it would be foolish to dismiss what the current polls are telling us: Independent Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is polling higher than any independent or third-party candidate in a generation. He, along with other non-major-party candidates, has a real chance to affect the outcome of the 2024 election.

Take a look at a recent Quinnipiac University poll: Kennedy hit 22% among registered voters. That struck me as very high, so I went into the polling vault.


The last independent presidential candidate to earn over 20% support in a poll within a year of the election was Ross Perot in 1992. He ended up getting 19% of the popular vote.

Perot is a bit of an exception in that independent or third-party candidates usually fade as an election nears. John Anderson was polling above 20% during the 1980 campaign, before pulling in just 7% in November. In 1968, former Alabama Gov. George Wallace topped out at 21% in pre-election polling as a third-party candidate before picking up 14% when the votes were cast.

The amazing thing, though, is that these three have been the only non-major-party candidates in the history of polling to hit more than 20% within a year of the election. Kennedy is now part of this select group.

Moreover, those three prior candidates ended up getting above 5% (if not 10%) in the final outcome.

Democratic Presidential candidate Robert F. Kennedy Jr. speaks during The World Values Network's Presidential Candidate Series that discusses fighting antisemitism and championing Israel, in New York City, U.S., July 25, 2023. REUTERS/Amr Alfiky
RFK Jr. is polling high for an independent. But it may not last
We don’t know where Kennedy will end up, obviously; however, his numbers in the swing states should be turning heads. According to New York Times/Siena College surveys, Kennedy was in the high teens to upward of 25% in the six closest states that Biden won in 2020 over Trump: Georgia, Arizona, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Nevada and Michigan.

The Times/Siena polls were notable, of course, because they sent some Democrats into a tizzy and some Republicans into euphoria earlier this week. Trump came in with a higher share of the vote than Biden in five of these states among registered voters and in four of them among likely voters.

If the final results matched those polls, Trump would win the election.

But when Kennedy was introduced as an option among likely voters, Trump was ahead of Biden in only two states (Georgia and Nevada). His 5-point leads in Arizona and Pennsylvania disappeared into ties. Biden held a well-within-the-margin-of-error edge in Pennsylvania, while the two were tied in Michigan.

Put another way, a clear Trump polling lead became a jumbled mess with no clear favorite to win in the Electoral College thanks to Kennedy. Both Biden (34%) and Trump (36%) were south of 40% in an aggregate across the six states.

The fact that an independent candidate could take such a large chunk of the vote shouldn’t be surprising. Both Biden’s and Trump’s unfavorability ratings were in the high 50s in the Times/Siena poll (and others as well). They’re tied with Democrat Hillary Clinton and Trump in 2016 as the two least liked front-runners for their party’s nomination in polling history.


Given all that, it’s no surprise we’re seeing other independent and third-party candidates jumping or potentially jumping into the 2024 race.

Independent Cornel West got 6% and 4% in the recent Quinnipiac and CNN/SSRS surveys.

Jill Stein announced Thursday she was running for the Green Party nomination in 2024. She got about 1% of the vote nationally in 2016, but notably earned more votes in Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin than Trump’s winning margins over Clinton in those states.

Senator Joe Manchin (D-W.V.) boards an elevator after casting a Senate vote, at the U.S. Capitol, in Washington, D.C., on Tuesday, November 7, 2023. (Graeme Sloan/Sipa USA)(Sipa via AP Images)
Manchin’s retirement may end up being his biggest tease yet
Also on Thursday, West Virginia Sen. Joe Manchin said he would not run for reelection next year. He was entertaining the idea of running as a third-party candidate earlier this year. Manchin took 10% as a No Labels candidate in an PRRI poll during the summer.

Now, none of these non-major-party candidates are likely to win. That, though, really isn’t the point when talking about them.

They’re worth talking about because they are far more likely than usual to take a large chunk of the vote from the major parties, which a lot of Americans feel disenchanted with. The ultimate winner could come in with well less than a majority.

If political analysts don’t take into account the fact that someone like Kennedy is getting north of 20% in some polls, they may be missing a potential sign of where 2024 is heading.
bobsal u1553115
 
  0  
Sat 2 Dec, 2023 07:30 am
@PoshSpice,
Hahahahahahahahahahaha!

Lash, you are a comedian!

Now post one on how cows flying could revive the umbrella and raincoat businesses!
0 Replies
 
hightor
 
  3  
Sat 2 Dec, 2023 08:50 am
@PoshSpice,
Quote:
Cornel **** the bed needlessly, as you obviously know.

I never considered him a serious candidate and haven't been following his campaign; that's why I asked the question.

Quote:
Don’t even know how I’ll vote—except for the knowledge it will be outside the corrupt genocidal duopoly.

So, as a Green, you're willing to hand the fate of the biosphere to Trump and industrial polluters? You think it's okay to allow christian nationalists to dictate education policy and ban books from public libraries? You're on board with the continued disenfranchisement of non-white voters? Do you really want to see corporate hypercapitalism given free rein in an unregulated economy? The loss of women's freedom to make their own reproductive choices and the persecution of the LGBT community is of no concern to you? Is this really what the Green Party stands for?
PoshSpice
 
  -1  
Sat 2 Dec, 2023 09:31 am
@hightor,
I’m not ‘a Green.’
I work toward what I think is the best outcome.

It’s a complete shitshow right now. Nobody’s worth my time.
hightor
 
  4  
Sat 2 Dec, 2023 10:49 am
@PoshSpice,
Quote:
I'm not 'a Green.'
I work toward what I think is the best outcome.

Okay, than as an individual, you're willing to hand the fate of the biosphere to Trump and industrial polluters? You think it's okay to allow christian nationalists to dictate education policy and ban books from public libraries? You're on board with the continued disenfranchisement of non-white voters? Do you really want to see corporate hypercapitalism given free rein in an unregulated economy? The loss of women's freedom to make their own reproductive choices and the persecution of the LGBT community is of no concern to you?
0 Replies
 
PoshSpice
 
  -3  
Sat 2 Dec, 2023 12:49 pm
Okay, than as an individual, you're willing to hand the fate of the biosphere to Trump and industrial polluters?
✅No one has polluted more than Biden.

You think it's okay to allow christian nationalists to dictate education policy and ban books from public libraries?
✅ Local pressure is best for this issue. As bad as this is, there are much worse things happening that I prioritize.

You're on board with the continued disenfranchisement of non-white voters?
✅All voters in the US are disenfranchised. Voting is practically meaningless. D & R are equally guilty.

Do you really want to see corporate hypercapitalism given free rein in an unregulated economy?
✅I’ve BEEN seeing it.

The loss of women's freedom to make their own reproductive choices and the persecution of the LGBT community is of no concern to you?
✅It’s been intentionally left unprotected by Ds so Ds can trot it out as a reason to vote for them every four years. Save democracy? Ha. Tell me another one. Democrats are the most virulent adversaries of democracy—bar none. Rs aren’t nervy enough to try the gaslighting Ds get away with for decades. The LGBT community seems to be beating the hell out of the women community. Maybe we should ask them for help?

———————

What scares me is Israel owning both houses of Congress and the WH & being homicidal maniacs.

It affects the dramatic clampdown on speech, the freedoms this country was based on, and our country denying the needs of Americans to pay for genocide and piracy around the world.

That’s my priority. Too bad for me because the overwhelming number of presidential candidates D&R are hard core Zionists.

So, hell on earth is here.
All bets are off.
#FreePalestine
And we’re all Palestinians.
Some of you just don’t know it yet.
 

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