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TIME.

 
 
Reply Fri 8 Jul, 2022 07:41 pm
Time is not real- it is a human construct to help us differentiate between now and our perception of the past, an equally astonishing and baffling theory states. The concept of time is simply an illusion made up of human memories, everything that has been and ever will be is happening right now. That is the theory according to a group of esteemed scientists who aim to solve one of the universe's mysteries.

But I wonder if that group of esteemed scientists had read the 1912 poem, ‘The Dreamer’ by Robert Service?

THE DREAMER.

The lone man gazed and gazed upon his gold,
His sweat, his blood, the wage of weary days;
But now how sweet, how doubly sweet to hold
All gay and gleamy to the campfire blaze.
The evening sky was sinister and cold;
The willows shivered, wanly lay the snow;
The uncommiserating land, so old,
So worn, so grey, so niggard in its woe,
Peered through its ragged shroud. The lone man sighed,
Poured back the gaudy dust into its poke,
Gazed at the seething river listless-eyed,
Loaded his corn-cob pipe as if to smoke;
Then crushed with weariness and hardship crept
Into his ragged robe, and swiftly slept.

Hour after hour went by; a shadow slipped
From vasts of shadow to the camp-fire flame;
Gripping a rifle with a deadly aim,
A gaunt and hairy man with wolfish eyes . . .

The sleeper dreamed, and lo! this was his dream:
He rode a streaming horse across a moor.
Sudden 'mid pit-black night a lightning gleam
Showed him a way-side inn, forlorn and poor.
A sullen host unbarred the creaking door,
And led him to a dim and dreary room;
Wherein he sat and poked the fire a-roar,
So that weird shadows jigged athwart the gloom.
He ordered wine. 'Od's blood! but he was tired.
What matter! Charles was crushed and George was King;
His party high in power; how he aspired!
Red guineas packed his purse, too tight to ring.
The fire-light gleamed upon his silken hose,
His silver buckles and his powdered wig.
What ho! more wine! He drank, he slowly rose.
What made the shadows dance that madcap jig?
He clutched the candle, steered his way to bed,
And in a trice was sleeping like the dead.

Across the room there crept, so shadow soft,
His sullen host, with naked knife a-gleam,
(A gaunt and hairy man with wolfish eyes.) . . .
And as he lay, the sleeper dreamed a dream.

'Twas in a ruder land, a wilder day.
A rival princeling sat upon his throne,
Within a dungeon, dark and foul he lay,
With chains that bit and festered to the bone.
They haled him harshly to a vaulted room,
Where One gazed on him with malignant eye;
And in that devil-face he read his doom,
Knowing that ere the dawn-light he must die.
Well, he was sorrow-glutted; let them bring
Their prize assassins to the bloody work.
His kingdom lost, yet would he die a King,
Fearless and proud, as when he faced the Turk.
Ah God! the glory of that great Crusade!
The bannered pomp, the gleam, the splendid urge!
The crash of reeking combat, blade to blade!
The reeling ranks, blood-avid and a-surge!
For long he thought; then feeling o'er him creep
Vast weariness, he fell into a sleep.

The cell door opened; soft the headsman came,
Within his hand a mighty axe a-gleam,
(A gaunt and hairy man with wolfish eyes,) . . .
And as he lay, the sleeper dreamed a dream.

'Twas in a land unkempt of life's red dawn;
Where in his sanded cave he dwelt alone;
Sleeping by day, or sometimes worked upon
His flint-head arrows and his knives of stone;
By night stole forth and slew the savage boar,
So that he loomed a hunter of loud fame,
And many a skin of wolf and wild-cat wore,
And counted many a flint-head to his name;
Wherefore he walked the envy of the band,
Hated and feared, but matchless in his skill.
Till lo! one night deep in that shaggy land,
He tracked a yearling bear and made his kill;
Then over-worn he rested by a stream,
And sank into a sleep too deep for dream.

Hunting his food a rival caveman crept
Through those dark woods, and marked him where he lay;
Cowered and crawled upon him as he slept,
Poising a mighty stone aloft to slay --
(A gaunt and hairy man with wolfish eyes.) . . .

The great stone crashed. The Dreamer shrieked and woke,
And saw, fear-blinded, in his dripping cell,
A gaunt and hairy man, who with one stroke
Swung a great ax of steel that flashed and fell . . .
So that he woke amid his bedroom gloom,
And saw, hair-poised, a naked, thirsting knife,
A gaunt and hairy man with eyes of doom --
And then the blade plunged down to drink his life . . .
So that he woke, wrenched back his robe, and looked,
And saw beside his dying fire upstart
A gaunt and hairy man with finger crooked --
A rifle rang, a bullet searched his heart . . .

The morning sky was sinister and cold.
Grotesque the Dreamer sprawled, and did not rise.
For long and long there gazed upon some gold
A gaunt and hairy man with wolfish eyes.
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Type: Question • Score: 0 • Views: 465 • Replies: 9
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steve reid
 
  1  
Reply Sat 9 Jul, 2022 12:16 am
@The Anointed,
I'd agree time is a human construct, but constructed from what ?

We experience life through perception, but our perceptions are illusions created by the brain that show us things in a way that they don't exist

Take colour, light and dark, sound, smell, taste and touch, we perceive these things, that is they are created by the brain and exist in our minds but these things do not exist in the form we perceive them in the real world outside of our heads

If the above perceptions are illusions and we perceive time, which I assume we do, then it is not unreasonable to assume that the brains interpretation of time is also a distortion of the true reality of time

I used to think time flowed from the past to the present to the future, until I realised that the future is just an idea in my mind, and the past is just a memory in my mind

In a universe without life with no brain to perceive, there would be no colour, light and dark, sound, smell, taste, touch or time in the way we perceive them, time would always be the present, the past and future could not even be ideas as there would be no life to have ideas

As to THE DREAMER, it has numerous interpretations
The Anointed
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 9 Jul, 2022 03:27 am
@steve reid,
Correct, "THE DREAMER," can have numerous interpretations.

We indeed do experience life through perceptions, we perceive shock waves, which are created by a falling tree or some other impact as sound, and that sound is not an illusion, but is a reality, a reality that is created by our created ears, explained in its simplest form, when those waves hit our ear-drums they are converted to neurons (Electric pulses) which are sent to the brain where they are translated as sound, much the same as colour, scent, touch, taste, etc, which are all created by our already created senses.

Our eyes, ears, tongue, nostrils, nerve ends, etc, are not illusions, and neither are their translations.

As long as there is space and momentum there is time, only when the world is crushed back into the singularity from which it originated, does time cease to exist.

A singularity is a region of space-time in which matter is crushed so closely together that the gravitational laws explained by general relativity break down. In a singularity, the volume of space is zero and its density is infinite.
Scientists believe such a singularity exists at the core of a black hole, which occurs when a super-massive sun reaches the end of its life and implodes.

General relativity also demands such a singularity must exist at the beginning of an expanding universe.

Like yourself, the average punter erroneously perceives time as being one directional forever forward linear flowing, rather than being multi-directional.

Just because someone may not be born for another thousand years, that does not mean that they cannot mentally visit the world today.

When referring to the fourth dimension I am speaking of the Minkowskian notion of time as being the fourth dimension. As in the fact that we can move forward and backward, [One dimension], sideways, [Two dimensions], up and down, [Three dimensions], and through time; [Four dimensions], and not that which is called 4- dimension Euclidean space.

We all have the ability to enter into our innermost being and mentally merge with the mind of our ancestor and to mentally relive the life and times of he/she, who we once were.

Come travel with me on a journey through time, Not in some capsule but in our own minds. To the innermost sanctuary will we descend To that single cell from which you began. In the Holy of Holies where all are one Where all of space and time is joined We’ll mingle there with other minds From other lands in other times. Minds of the past who seem dead and gone And minds of the future who are yet unborn. For they in their times whether here on this world Or some distant planet to which they’ve been lured Will enter their innermost sanctuary too And perhaps in there they might merge with you. Ahh! To travel through space in the wink of an eye Merged with a child from some world way up high Now, if this is but madness then madness it be But, come my mad brothers, come----follow me! ……… The Anointed.

While drinking from God’s fountain, that vast and endless sea
I felt a strange sensation, as someone else there drank of Me. ……The Anointed.

Carl Sagan in his old TV program, which I believe was called “The Cosmos”, speculated that a two dimensional being having length and breadth would experience his world as a one-dimensional world.

Having only length and breadth and no height, it would not be able to look down on any two-dimensional object in its world and would only see a line, which would appear to be the length of the object, irrelevant as to which direction it was seeing that object from. Unless the two dimensional being was lifted up by some unseen force, it would never know that the objects in its world had breadth as well as length.

We are fourth dimensional beings, who are able to mentally traverse time.

We are fourth dimensional beings, who, in a state of deep meditation or hypnosis, are able to regress into our inner most being where space and time are as one, and relive memories back to and beyond our own birth, and there, we are able to merge with a living mind of our past [Who we once were] and experience the life and times of our living ancestor.

And while merged with a mind of our living ancestor, [Who we once were] our comatose body in the present will sometimes speak in the tongue of that ancient ancestor, which language is totally foreign to the comatose person in question, while the ancient ancestor in his own time, babbles incomprehensively, sometimes speaking in a strange tongue, in the as yet unknown language of his future descendant, in his attempt to give form and terminology to the visions that he is receiving from the mind of his as yet unborn descendant of the future, which terminology to express such visions have not even developed in his point in time.

That person is seen as a prophet, when speaking of a giant grasshopper that spits fire from its tail, with wings above its head that sound like the roaring of a mighty waterfall, in his attempt to describe a Black Hawk helicopter as seen in a vision while merged with the future mind.

We all remain alive, to one who can descend into his past.
steve reid
 
  0  
Reply Sat 9 Jul, 2022 01:42 pm
@The Anointed,
The Anointed wrote
Quote:
We indeed do experience life through perceptions, we perceive shock waves, which are created by a falling tree or some other impact as sound, and that sound is not an illusion, but is a reality, a reality that is created by our created ears, explained in its simplest form, when those waves hit our ear-drums they are converted to neurons (Electric pulses) which are sent to the brain where they are translated as sound, much the same as colour, scent, touch, taste, etc, which are all created by our already created senses.
Ok, sound is not an illusion it is our reality, as it is what evolution has given us, but sound is not a pressure wave, just as light is not coloured nor light or dark. What we perceive is not what exists in the world ouside of the mind

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
Our eyes, ears, tongue, nostrils, nerve ends, etc, are not illusions,
True

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
and neither are their translations.
Their translations are our reality, which to me are distortions of the true reality that exists outside of our minds

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
As long as there is space and momentum there is time,
Yes

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
only when the world is crushed back into the singularity from which it originated, does time cease to exist.

A singularity is a region of space-time in which matter is crushed so closely together that the gravitational laws explained by general relativity break down. In a singularity, the volume of space is zero and its density is infinite.
Scientists believe such a singularity exists at the core of a black hole, which occurs when a super-massive sun reaches the end of its life and implodes.

General relativity also demands such a singularity must exist at the beginning of an expanding universe.
Ok

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
Like yourself, the average punter erroneously perceives time as being one directional forever forward linear flowing, rather than being multi-directional.
As I stated in my first post "I used to think time flowed from the past to the present to the future", Now I believe time doesn't flow in the real world outside of my mind, time appears to flow in my reality but this could be an illusion created by the brain

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
Just because someone may not be born for another thousand years, that does not mean that they cannot mentally visit the world today.
Does not compute

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
When referring to the fourth dimension I am speaking of the Minkowskian notion of time as being the fourth dimension. As in the fact that we can move forward and backward, [One dimension], sideways, [Two dimensions], up and down, [Three dimensions], and through time; [Four dimensions], and not that which is called 4- dimension Euclidean space.
Ok

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
We all have the ability to enter into our innermost being and mentally merge with the mind of our ancestor and to mentally relive the life and times of he/she, who we once were.
I don't know how to achieve this

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
Come travel with me on a journey through time, Not in some capsule but in our own minds. To the innermost sanctuary will we descend To that single cell from which you began. In the Holy of Holies where all are one Where all of space and time is joined We’ll mingle there with other minds From other lands in other times. Minds of the past who seem dead and gone And minds of the future who are yet unborn. For they in their times whether here on this world Or some distant planet to which they’ve been lured Will enter their innermost sanctuary too And perhaps in there they might merge with you. Ahh! To travel through space in the wink of an eye Merged with a child from some world way up high Now, if this is but madness then madness it be But, come my mad brothers, come----follow me! ……… The Anointed.
We can dream

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
While drinking from God’s fountain, that vast and endless sea
I felt a strange sensation, as someone else there drank of Me. ……The Anointed.
God/God's are words that have no meaning for me

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
Carl Sagan in his old TV program, which I believe was called “The Cosmos”, speculated that a two dimensional being having length and breadth would experience his world as a one-dimensional world.

Having only length and breadth and no height, it would not be able to look down on any two-dimensional object in its world and would only see a line, which would appear to be the length of the object, irrelevant as to which direction it was seeing that object from. Unless the two dimensional being was lifted up by some unseen force, it would never know that the objects in its world had breadth as well as length.
I'm old enough to remember watching that

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
We are fourth dimensional beings, who are able to mentally traverse time.

We are fourth dimensional beings, who, in a state of deep meditation or hypnosis, are able to regress into our inner most being where space and time are as one, and relive memories back to and beyond our own birth, and there, we are able to merge with a living mind of our past [Who we once were] and experience the life and times of our living ancestor.

And while merged with a mind of our living ancestor, [Who we once were] our comatose body in the present will sometimes speak in the tongue of that ancient ancestor, which language is totally foreign to the comatose person in question, while the ancient ancestor in his own time, babbles incomprehensively, sometimes speaking in a strange tongue, in the as yet unknown language of his future descendant, in his attempt to give form and terminology to the visions that he is receiving from the mind of his as yet unborn descendant of the future, which terminology to express such visions have not even developed in his point in time.

That person is seen as a prophet, when speaking of a giant grasshopper that spits fire from its tail, with wings above its head that sound like the roaring of a mighty waterfall, in his attempt to describe a Black Hawk helicopter as seen in a vision while merged with the future mind.

We all remain alive, to one who can descend into his past.
Err, um, hmm ok, I'll have to have a think about this
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sat 9 Jul, 2022 02:38 pm
@The Anointed,
so sediments are all collective and'In the moment"
0 Replies
 
The Anointed
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 9 Jul, 2022 04:48 pm
@steve reid,
Quote:
God/God's are words that have no meaning for me


From the Universal dictionary---- Atheism--- The doctrine that there is no God or that the word “GOD” and statements about it or using it are meaningless.

Quote:
In a universe without life with no brain to perceive, there would be no colour, light and dark, sound, smell, taste, touch or time in the way we perceive them, time would always be the present, the past and future could not even be ideas as there would be no life to have ideas.


Because General relativity demands that a singularity must exist at the beginning or before an expanding universe in which there is space, momentum and ‘TIME’, then we can assume that there was a universe in which there was no colour, light and dark, sound, smell, taste, touch or time in the way we perceive them, and that universe was in fact ‘This Universe’ as it was before the 'TIME' of the Big Bang, when the singularity of origin was spatially separated and the liquid like plasma of electromagnetic energy, which would in ‘TIME’ become this universe of today, was spewed out in the trillions upon trillions of degrees, or, according to scientific measurements (180 million trillion, trillion degrees Fahrenheit), which electromagnetic energy has been converted to that which we perceive as matter, only to be reconverted to its original form as electromagnetic energy during the phase of the Big Crunch, when all is eventually condensed back into the singularity of origin.

In fact, it has now been revealed that matter is no more than an illusion.

Quantum physicists discovered that so called physical atoms are made up of vortices of energy that are constantly spinning and vibrating, each one radiating its own unique energy signature.

If you observe the composition of an atom with a microscope you would see a small, invisible tornado-like vortex, with a number of infinitely small energy vortices called quarks and photons. These are what make up the structure of the atom. As you focused in closer and closer on the structure of the atom, you would see nothing, you would observe a physical void.

The atom has no physical structure, we have no physical structure, physical things really don’t have any physical structure! Atoms are made out of invisible energy, not tangible matter.

Pioneering physicist Sir James Jeans wrote: “The stream of knowledge is heading toward a non-mechanical reality; the universe begins to look more like ‘A GREAT THOUGHT’ than like a great machine. Mind no longer appears to be an accidental intruder into the realm of matter, we ought rather hail it as the creator and governor of the realm of matter. (R. C. Henry, “The Mental Universe”; Nature 436:29, 2005)

In other words, “THE GREAT THOUGHT” in which all exist, ‘IS ALL THAT EXISTS.’

But the foolish atheist sayeth that there is no God.
steve reid
 
  0  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2022 04:33 am
@The Anointed,
Quote:
Pioneering physicist Sir James Jeans wrote: “The stream of knowledge is heading toward a non-mechanical reality; the universe begins to look more like ‘A GREAT THOUGHT’ than like a great machine. Mind no longer appears to be an accidental intruder into the realm of matter, we ought rather hail it as the creator and governor of the realm of matter. (R. C. Henry, “The Mental Universe”; Nature 436:29, 2005)

In other words, “THE GREAT THOUGHT” in which all exist, ‘IS ALL THAT EXISTS.’

But the foolish atheist sayeth that there is no God.


R. C. Henry, “The Mental Universe”; Nature 436:29, 2005, thanks for the pointer to a very interesting read

I don't have faith, and if not having faith equates to being a fool then I am a fool
The Anointed
 
  0  
Reply Sun 10 Jul, 2022 04:00 pm
@steve reid,
Undoubtedly you have faith, it's just that you don't have faith in the fact that a God who is all that exists manifests himself as this universe and all herein.

Perhaps you might find the following a good read also.
https://able2know.org/topic/569211-1#lastPost
steve reid
 
  0  
Reply Mon 11 Jul, 2022 01:16 pm
@The Anointed,
I struggled with the post as I always do when people start quoting from the bible

As I stated earlier I don't have faith, and I regard the bible as a work of interwoven fact with fiction, as it was written over 2000 years ago by numerous authors over a great time span, it would be nigh impossible for me to work out what is true and what is false even if I had the interest to do so, which I don't. Then there are the things that I just can't accept as true, such as people living hundreds of years or Jesus rising from the dead or walking on water, (which I note you allude to later in the thread)

I finnished reading the post but found it arduous going, so I started at the beginning of the thread, first three posts are interesting, I will continue and see where it goes

The Anointed wrote
Quote:
In fact, it has now been revealed that matter is no more than an illusion. Quantum physicists discovered that so called physical atoms are made up of vortices of energy that are constantly spinning and vibrating, each one radiating its own unique energy signature.

If you observe the composition of an atom with a microscope you would see a small, invisible tornado-like vortex, with a number of infinitely small energy vortices called quarks and photons. These are what make up the structure of the atom. As you focused in closer and closer on the structure of the atom, you would see nothing, you would observe a physical void. The atom has no physical structure, we have no physical structure, physical things really don’t have any physical structure! Atoms are made out of invisible energy, not tangible matter.


I could accept that an atom has no physical structure, it may change how I think of atoms but a brick wall is still a brick wall, a ball thrown at it the ball bounces back (though theoretically the ball could go though the wall), the wall is not an illusion ?, if it is then everything is an illusion ?, much to ponder
The Anointed
 
  0  
Reply Mon 11 Jul, 2022 02:52 pm
@steve reid,
You may find the following link interesting.

https://www.bing.com/search?q=quantum+physics-Atoms+are+swirling+vortices+of+energy.&form=ANNNB1&refig=9dfb7bf19d8e48749cdcf80228726aa3
0 Replies
 
 

 
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