I Don't Buy it: Sub-Saharan African Iron Age

"Re: Pamela Rosa (Post 7074547)
This post from Pamela Rosa made me laugh.

Most Archeologists agree that human beings evolved in Africa, and then spread to other parts of the world. It is not a very controversial theory these days; all of humanity has roots in Africa.

And yet somehow hearing it from Pamela makes it sound like racist bullshit. My point is that no matter who says it, it is still true.Re: Pamela Rosa (Post 7074547)"

That is true of every case regardless of who what one is talking about. The truth takes precedence over everything else. It doesn’t matter who says it as long as it is true. At the beginning of science, the first scientists were dedicated to this principle. They accurately reported their observations even when they appeared to contradict their belief in God. But in recent years political correctness has crept into science and now the public can no longer take at face value what scientists proclaim. We have to look for a political or cultural agenda.

You are completely incorrect. It is quite the opposite of what you are saying.

Science is based on measurable data. At the core are facts that are testable. Any time there is a scientific fact, a scientist can tell you what data would disprove his claim. Only after a claim is tested (people look for the data that would prove it wrong) can it be called a "fact".

If you aren't listening to the objective facts from the experts... the only alternative is to listen to your own political biases. Being "politically correct" doesn't make a claim right. But, being "politically correct" doesn't make it wrong either.

When someone claims that "science is corrupted"... what they are really saying is that the actual facts don't match with their own prejudices. The political right does this with climate change. The political left does this with genetically modified foods. The facts are the facts no matter which side approves of them.

"It happened, only a racist would deny it."

Ok, you describe how iron making could have been discovered by accident by people with no knowledge of metals. I don’t think it is possible; iron making is too hard and too complex to be discovered by accident. People don’t put that much work into something like making iron unless they know there will be something to be gained from all the sweat. Of course, there is another possibility. The ancient African could have been vastly superior in intelligence to Eurasian, but that would be a racist. Do you agree?

Wouldn't the same argument apply to Europeans?

You’re a racist, and like most racists you’re pig ignorant and thick as mince, and I have far better things to do than waste time talking to an idiot like you.

"Wouldn't the same argument apply to Europeans?"

That is true, but as far as I know, no one claims that ironworking originated in the European subcontinent. Ironmaking had it Start in Asia, in the country we now know as Turkey, and spread all over Eurasia. I know there is a claim that ironworking had an independent origin in India, but I don’t agree. I believe iron was discovered once in Turkey and eventually spread from there across the world.

"You’re a racist, and like most racists you’re pig ignorant and thick as mince, and I have far better things to do than waste time talking to an idiot like you."

I am not surprised; this is the reply expected. But I did give you the chance to explain your opinion.

Got a call; playtime is over for now. It is time for me to go to work.

What the hell does it matter if iron working begin in one location and then spread or was developed in a number of places both over a few hundreds year.

It seem a mildly interesting question but not something that should generate heat a thousand or so years after the fact.

Exactly. Steel could have been developed by Eskimos, for crying out loud. Someone, somewhere worked it out - obviously.

Of course it matters, this fact from thousands of years ago has now become part of two competing 21st century ideological narratives.

You are either a racist or a communist... come on! Pick a side.

LOL.........

"Of course it matters, this fact from thousands of years ago has now become part of two competing 21st century ideological narratives.

You are either a racist or a communist... come on! Pick a side."

I choose neither I try to avoid stupidity where I can. Both are ignorant ideas, there is no superior race and workers do not work for the glory of work. Communism is, truly, an evil system; they believe they can use terror to change people. Terror can cause pain but it doesn’t change people. People work to make a living not some ideological reason. And, racism is just ignorant; anyone who has been around has come across people of other races that they could see as quite intelligent. I have worked with black technicians that were better technicians than me.

I have to say of the two groups communists are more dangerous. Racist commit crimes from time to time, but communist once they gain and consolidate power exterminate their enemies. It is referred to as political purification.

Many communists (and other authoritarian groups) are racists......

Apparently we like to think of human cultural evolution as a high school football score??

Pardon me if I gag

"Apparently we like to think of human cultural evolution as a high school football score??

Pardon me if I gag"

Could you expand on that; I don’t get your meaning.

I could tell you how I read it but I don't speak for farmerman, and I don't think you would really understand no matter how detailed I make it, it just wouldn't sink in. Not because I think you're stupid, but because I think you're a lazy thinker. It's not your fault, reality shows are not reality, people can't add or subtract without a calculator, history classes have become stultified and sodden to the memorization of dates, Civics classes hahahahahahahahahaha..we have decided we don't need to teach the young people how their very own government works and what the responsibilities are for our elected officials and for our citizens. In other words, we no longer respect scholarship, research or expertise because somewhere along the line smart experienced people have become vilified as elitists or smartypants........and they need to be owned or 'triggered'.

"Many communists (and other authoritarian groups) are racists...."

That is true; communist China is very racist, but they get away with it because of their power; the Africans feel they need them too badly.

https://thediplomat.com/2020/04/racism-is-alive-and-well-in-china/

China has a superiority complex that goes back thousands of years. The Chinese are invested heavily in Africa; I suspected the Africans may be in for a rude awakening someday.

But, it is not just the sub-Saharan Africans they feel superior to is everyone including us. Hopefully, it will be a while before they think of themselves as our masters.

" In other words, we no longer respect scholarship, research or expertise because somewhere along the line smart experienced people have become vilified as elitists or smartypants........and they need to be owned or 'triggered'."

I respect scholarship, but I don’t worship it. Just because one is a recognized expert in a particular subject doesn’t make one right. Science is the one area in life where one person can be right, and the ninety-nine can be wrong; it all depends on the evidence. When the expert says things that are just wrong, it is up to us to question it: The is no way the sub-Saharan Africans could have had an independent iron age when they had no copper or bronze age. It is possible to accidentally discover copper and bronze, but it just not possible to accidentally discover iron making; it is just too complex and requires too much work.

Izzy says that is racist because he has nothing else. Liberals always pull out the race card when that is all they have. But he is wasting his time. I won't be manipulated; I will control my own thoughts. I won't share that task with anyone else.