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The Iraqi Logic Puzzle

 
 
Stinger
 
Reply Sun 23 Feb, 2003 11:36 am
For some time now, we have been told by various political leaders, and assorted 'experts', that Saddam Hussein is dangerous, evil, a tyrant, a dictator, and a modern day Hitler. We have also been informed that he gasses his own people, tortures and murders opponents, and basically stays in power by the use of fear or terror. More recently, the 'hot topic' of course has been claims that Saddam is concealing weapons of mass destruction, supporting international terrorism, and is a threat to regional and even international stability.

The solution to the Saddam problem, has been to impose sanctions, and more recently the return of UN inspectors to Iraq. Failure to comply with the UN, Saddam has been warned, will result in a massive military attack, with the goal of removing him from power, and the creation of a 'democratic' government - which will be a refreshing change for Iraq, and something of an oddity in the region....but I digress! In the West, Saddam's removal is euphemistically called, 'regime change'.

While on the surface, it all seems quite simple, and reasonable, the more I have thought about it, the more puzzling it has become.

Since the Gulf War a decade ago, Saddam has probably surmised that there are people in the West, who would quite like to see him toppled. He could hardly have failed to notice! The Bush family being just one cloud on his horizon. Calling Saddam a dictator, evil, etc, and having a policy of 'regime change', was probably a clue about possible US intent. It may even have made Saddam a little suspicious or defensive, knowing that he is a target.

As I have already mentioned, the UN is currently engaged in an attempt to disarm Iraq, of any weapons of mass destruction. Failure to comply, Saddam has been warned, will result in a display of military force, which will ultimately result in his removal. Which is what puzzles me.

Is it possible that Saddam sees this as a possible damned if you do, damned if you don't situation?

We are telling him, get rid of your weapons of mass destruction, or we will attack your country, and topple you.

While at the same time, it's an open secret that the same people who are telling him to disarm...or else, also think he's an evil tyrant, who needs to be removed. That there is a 'moral' reason to oust Saddam, in order to free the people of Iraq, from his dictatorship.

From Saddam's perspective, would he possibly feel that handing over any weapons / chemicals etc, is pointless, since the West intends to eventually remove him, even if complies with the UN resolutions? If that's the case, is this whole process, simply designed to get our support and blessing for forcibly removing Saddam Hussein from power, rather than making him comply with UN resolutions on WMOD?

The ultimate objective, appears to be Saddam's removal, no matter what he does regarding the UN resolutions. His removal, may be a perfectly reasonable and 'moral' objective, but why would he do anything to help expedite his own removal?

Surely our political leaders know this? If they do, then is this whole debate about Iraq something of an illusion for our benefit, if the decision to attack, and for 'regime change', has already been made? Are we simply being conditioned to the concept of an invasion of Iraq?

As with comedy, it just appears to be a matter of timing, plus finding the right excuse for war, in order to win public opinion.
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Anonymous
 
  1  
Reply Sun 23 Feb, 2003 12:04 pm
Stinger, Here is an interesting mini-review of Iraqi History. You will find it VERY interesting.

http://www.scn.org/wwfor/iraqhist.html
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Stinger
 
  1  
Reply Sun 23 Feb, 2003 12:16 pm
FupTheDuck

From the 1950s onwards, it would appear that a lot of people have been puzzled over what to do in Iraq! Or for that matter, what to do with Saddam. He's a good guy....no he's not....yes he is....no he's not.....

Support him....attack him.....support him.....attack him......Oh we can't decide!!


Now, they just can't make up their minds, as to why we should attack Iraq.

It's the weapons of mass destruction......eh no, it's because he's a tyrant......no no, that's not it, it's the moral thing to do.....or maybe it's his support of international terrorism....or his mustache....That's it!! He's hiding the damn chemicals in his mustache! Somebody phone CNN!!
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LarryBS
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Mar, 2003 07:45 pm
Tonight on ABC Nightline 11:35 PM EST (sorry for those of you who don't have it):

Conspiracy Theory:Blueprint for War

TONIGHT'S FOCUS: Several years ago, when President Clinton was still in the White House, and 9/11 was still not even a nightmare in anyone's mind, a group of mostly Republicans wrote a letter outlining a foreign policy strategy that involved regime change in Iraq, by force if necessary.Now that several of those Republicans are in key positions in the Administration, some critics of the White House's current Iraq policy smell something fishy.

The Project for the New American Century. Never heard of it? Well, don't feel bad. Few have. But have you heard of Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld or Paul Wolfowitz? Back in 1997, those three out-of-office politicians and several other like-minded, mostly conservatives, were frustrated with American foreign policy. So they formed this new organization and a year later wrote a letter to then-President Bill Clinton calling for a "comprehensive political and military strategy for bringing down Saddam and his regime."

Today, a 76-page paper written by the organization reads like a blueprint for the policy being carried out largely by Vice President Dick Cheney, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz. In fact, of the 40 people who signed that letter, 10 are currently in the Administration.

Is this a case of democracy in action? Influential thinkers who became policy makers? Or is it, as some international critics of the White House's policy on Iraq have argued, a secretive organization pulling the strings of the President, with an imperialistic goal of dominating the world? Are these criticisms legitimate?

Tonight ABC News correspondent Jackie Judd will explore this conspiracy theory, and the influence and role of the Project for the New American Century. Ted Koppel will then speak with the Project's founder and chairman, Bill Kristol, who served in both the first Bush and the Reagan Administrations.
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mamajuana
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 Mar, 2003 10:54 pm
And this is the letter the group wrote to Gingrich and Lott, after they didn't received the response they wanted from Clinton. Every signatory is still active.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/iraqletter1998.htm

These are people who hated being out of power, had single-track minds, and are pursuing a course of action that we can only pray will not be a disaster.

Meanwhile, during their pursuit of this action, we have seen our jobless rate climb to over 2 million, our economy in a steady downward drift, over 1/3 the population as of now with no health insurance, our students showing up as mediocre, consumer confidence at one of the lowest points in years - but onward, soldiers, to the battle.
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Stinger
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Mar, 2003 12:49 pm
Larry & mamajuana

As they say on the X Files....The truth is out there!

People shouldn't be too surprised at the style of government that exists in the USA today. It's not exactly new. Just look at the background of some of GW's officials. As the saying goes, 'It's deja vu, all over again.'

Iran-contra men return to power
http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,539429,00.html

No more Mr Scrupulous Guy
http://www.guardian.co.uk/bush/story/0,7369,651977,00.html


If you are not familiar with the details of the Iran Contra covert op, have a look at the report using the next link. You don't need to read the entire Iran Contra report, (unless you really want to of course!). Simply looking at the later chapters, detailed in the menu, will give you a good idea of the shady goings on at the White House during the 1980s. Some familiar names emerge from history. It's worth remembering that most of the senior figures in the current administration, have links to Iran-Contra. Some may not be highlighted in the report as they were lower down the command chain at the time. But they were walking the corridors of power back then, and now they have risen to the upper echelons. People such as Colin Powell.

Iran-Contra Report
http://www.fas.org/irp/offdocs/walsh/


Here's a scary little example of 'the ends justify the means', type of thinking. You could of course say that it was just one person, and it was back in the 1960s. It couldn't possibly happen today. But then again....

Operation Northwoods
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/jointchiefs_010501.html

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/northwoods.html

http://www.americanpolitics.com/20011023pitt.html

http://www.emperors-clothes.com/images/north-i.htm


A European perspective, on the corruption of power.
Power corrupts. Absolute power, corrupts absolutely.


Italy: The stratergy of tension
http://flag.blackened.net/revolt/freeearth/fe3_italy.html

Operation Gladio
http://www.copi.com/articles/guyatt/gladio.html

Gelli deported back to Italy
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/195136.stm

An enemy of democracy
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Article/0,4273,4268224,00.html

Democracy in the Industrial Societies
http://www.zmag.org/chomsky/dd/dd-c11-s01.html
0 Replies
 
LarryBS
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Mar, 2003 11:18 am
Thanks stinger!
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