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Science as Faith and Following Jesus as fact

 
 
Reply Mon 8 Aug, 2016 04:29 pm
We forget that at the highest levels of science education is where science is shown to be completely subject to interpretation. The postgrad prof puts a problem about lawn mowing on the board and concludes 'So it take 2.4 boys to cut the lawn in the alloted time" THEN he starts on how ALL Physics must be re-interpreted in terms of the reality that was analyzed in the problem

All Christianity's claims revolve on the one question, Is Jesus the Son of God, whereas science always has to adjust all data and theories to be compatible, hence that amazing but true statement of Polanyi's :

" a series of observations which at one time were held to be important scientific facts, were a few years later completely discredited and committed to oblivion, without ever having been disproved or indeed newly tested, simply because the conceptual framework of science had meanwhile so altered that the facts no longer appeared credible."

And his friend Einstein also had this view of the naivete of almost all his contemporaries
"How does it happen that a properly endowed natural scientist comes to concern himself with epistemology? Is there no more valuable work in his specialty? I hear many of my colleagues saying, and I sense it from many more, that they feel this way. I cannot share this sentiment. ... Concepts that have proven useful in ordering things easily achieve such an authority over us that we forget their earthly origins and accept them as unalterable givens. Thus they come to be stamped as 'necessities of thought,' 'a priori givens,' etc."

"The path of scientific advance is often made impassable for a long time through such errors.
" Einstein, 1916, "Memorial notice for Ernst Mach," Physikalische Zeitschrift 17: 101-02.
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maxdancona
 
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Reply Mon 8 Aug, 2016 05:47 pm
@AugustineBrother,
Would you fly on an airplane built by faith?
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 8 Aug, 2016 06:01 pm
@AugustineBrother,
Your attempts to equate faith and science will go nowhere. Faith is faith. Science is the ability to test its veracity over and over objectively.

Quote:
faith
fāTH/Submit
noun
1.
complete trust or confidence in someone or something.
"this restores one's faith in politicians"
synonyms: trust, belief, confidence, conviction; More
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maxdancona
 
  2  
Reply Mon 8 Aug, 2016 06:14 pm
@AugustineBrother,
Thinking more about Science vs Jesus. The fact is that Jesus is pretty ineffectual compared to science.

What did Jesus do? He cured a few people, the raised a couple of people, including himself from the dead (which was a pretty cool trick). He changed water into wine. He got a bunch of religious people upset with him (which isn't that difficult given how uptight religious people are). Really the raising people from the dead bit is the coolest thing that Jesus did... and sure, science can't do that.

But then Jesus went away. He lied when he said he was coming back soon (for goodness sake, 2020 years is not "soon" even in the biggest metaphorical stretch). Since then, Jesus has done nothing.

Jesus' followers have been a wreck for the past 2000 years. They have caused and fought wars. They supported slavery. They now are drugging child soldiers and electing Republicans.

All of this time, Jesus' followers claim to be able to heal people... but they aren't demonstrably having an impact. They aren't emptying hospitals or curing epidemics.

Now let's look at science.

Science let's humans fly. We don't just fly a few of us... any of us can step in a scientific machine and jet around the world.

Science has literally doubled the human life expectancy. Jesus raised (I think) 4 people from the dead. Science has extended the life expectancy of billions people by fighting pests, creating fertilizers, vaccinations, antibiotics.

And science has brought the information age. We now have a world of knowledge at our fingertips and can communicate almost instantly.

And science has left the planet with humans on the moon, robots on Mars and a craft sending messages from beyond Pluto.

The score

I give Jesus points for the raising from the dead trick. Especially after days... that is a cool trick that science can't replicate. Although science can keep people from dying in the first place with vaccinations, epidemiology and cures... I think science wins in terms of practicality.

But for the rest of it, science clearly wins over Jesus. Walking on water is nothing compared to even a wind-surf board. Refrigerated trucks are better than turning water into wine.

And certainly for the past 2000 years (during which time Jesus has failed to return when he said he would) science has left Jesus in the dust in terms of everything that matters; extending life, curing diseases and advancing humanity.



cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 8 Aug, 2016 09:58 pm
@maxdancona,
Wow, I couldn't have said it any better. I've been your fan reading your posts, but now I'm "dedicated." LOL
I'm gonna have to remember this; science vs jesus.
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