Loan me some lamb's blood, I'm worried about my first born

I decided to pass over passover. 'Course I never had occasion to celebrate it in the past, either. But: Happines to those who do.

Cav...there are no words...

I'm still upset about my matzoh village... Plagues indeed...

When I'm old I'm going to pretend to be senile, because I bet I could get away with it. My first plan is to stand in a field of cows, pointing at one at a time, saying "Heaven... heaven... hell... heaven... hell..." until someone comes up and says, "Are you crazy?" And I'll respond, "Crazy about cows!"

(tumbleweed blows by)

Reminds me of Passover at Harvey's house.

Oh, never mind.

We said the blessings and drank some wine, with a nice full seder plate on the table. So it wasn't a seder, but then again we explained the matzoh, the maror and the charoseth to each other and I believe those are the only real requirements.

Good Yontif to you and yours, cav!

Thanks be to the tradition for the sdeder and the Jewish tradition of a pass over meal. This ceremoney helped so much when I needed help the most. I hope this will not offend but the experience was a communion for me.

Last Supper
Mark 14:22-23
While they were eating, Jesus took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to his disciples, saying, "Take it; this is my body." Then he took the cup, gave thanks and offered it to them, and they all drank from it.

Jesus poured water into a bowl and then knelt in front of each of the twelve disciples, washing their feet and drying them with His towel. Jesus told them "Now that I, your Lord, have washed your feet, you should wash one another's feet. I have set you an example, that you may learn that all of your are equal, that the master is not greater than His servant, and kindly toward each other." Jesus and His disciples were reclining at their Passover meal. Jesus blessed the matzoh bread and broke it, saying to them "Take this and eat it, for this is My body."
Then He blessed the wine and passed around His cup. "Drink this, for this is my blood."

Then Jesus looked at each of his disciples. His face was full of sorrow. "One of you sitting here will betray me." Jesus answered, "The one to whom I shall give this bread." Then Jesus took a piece of bread from the loaf, dipped it in the dish of wine and handed it to Judas Iscariot. "Do whatever you have to do, but do it quickly." Jesus said. With a start, Judas got up from the table, left the room, and walked out into the night.


Maundy Thursday
The day on which Christians remember the Last Supper is also known as Maundy Thursday. The word Maundy comes from the latin word maundatum which means "command".
When Jesus and His disciples ate the "Last Supper" it was on the first night of the Passover festival, or during the Seder Meal. During this meal Jesus explained to His Disciples that The Bread was His body and the wine was His blood of the new covenant, shed for the remission of our sins. Jesus instructed us to "Do This in remembrance of Me" (Luke 22:19)


The example Jesus set in washing the feet of His disciples is sometimes still done today on Maundy Thursday before the Passover supper. Most Churches offer a Maundy Service in which they end the service with Communion, Breaking the Bread and Drinking the wine in remembrance of Jesus' death.


Passover
Passover is the celebration of God delivering the Israelites out of Slavery from Pharaoh, the Egyptian Ruler.
God commanded the Israelites to remember the Passover as a festival to the Lord for generations to come (Exodus 12:14). Most Jewish families continue to observe the feast of Passover Seder (supper) on the first day of Passover. Passover is a week long celebration.

Why would a Christian family celebrate a Seder Meal?
In the New Testament Jesus commanded us to remember His death by observing The Last Supper and it was the Seder meal that He was eating when He instructed us to remember Him by partaking of the Bread and Wine together. In the Old Testament God commanded the Israelites to remember the Seder Passover meal as a festival unto the Lord for generations to come. (Exodus 12:14) Today, the meal in the Upper Room has become part of Holy Week. Each ingredient in a Passover Meal has a special meaning.

As Christians we can explain that we are all "chosen people" if we have been "born" into God's family by believing in His Son, Jesus, as our Messiah. We can share the cup of joy with other Christians out of thanksgiving that Jesus became the final "Lamb" to be sacrificed in order that our "joy may be full".


Food For Passover
In Exodus 12:8 God instructed the Israelites to eat 3 foods ~ Roasted Lamb (Pesah), to be eaten with bitter herbs (Maror) and unleavened bread, or bread made without yeast (Matzah). Below are the Passover foods and the explanations of the meanings from the Old Testament Exodus story (and the New Testament story of Jesus' as our Messiah.)

*Three whole Matzos (unleavened bread). A reminder that the Israelites did not have time to wait for the yeast bread to rise because they had to be ready to move when God said. A piece of the middle one is hidden for a child to find. (New Testament represents the Body of Jesus Christ broken for our sins. As Christians it is a reminder to live so that we are always "ready to go" when Jesus returns. Also yeast sometimes represents the evil in the world. God wants His people to be pure.)

*A roasted lamb ~ placed to the host's right ~
in memory of the lamb sacrificed by Israelites the night before their flight from Egypt.
(Jesus is our final perfect Lamb sacrificed for us.)

*A roasted egg ~ to the left ~
in mourning for destroyed temple.
(Symbol of the free-will offering that was given with the lamb. This represents giving more to God than just what is demanded. This is a gift of love. Jesus is God's ultimate gift. God's law demanded justice, but with the gift of Jesus, God gives us more than justice; He gives us mercy, love and forgiveness.)

* Maror (bitter herbs) ~ placed in the middle
A reminder of the bitterness of slavery in Egypt.
(As Christians we remember that many suffered so that we may know the joy of the good news of Jesus.)

*Charoseth (chopped almonds, apple, wine, sugar and cinnamon)~
Symbolizes the mortar which the Jews had to mix in making bricks for the king of Egypt.

*Salt water ~
to signify the Red Sea which miraculously parted to let the Israelites across.
(Represents the tears of all of God's Saints)

* Karpar (celery, parsley, greens)-
The Hebrew word means 600,000 the recorded number who left Egypt.
(These plants stay green all year and represent the everlasting life because of Jesus Christ's Ressurection.)

*Wine or grape juice ~ Wine represents JOY.
As the service proceeds, as each plaque is mentioned, each person sips a little of the wine. This means that until we were totally free and out of bondange, joy was incomplete.
(At the Last Supper Jesus said that the wine represented His own life's blood, poured out for us. He had to die so that we could know the total joy of freedom and forgiveness.)

*Elijah's cup ~ usually a treasured one filled with wine ~
is placed on the table to await the arrival of the Messiah.
(Jesus said in Matthew 11:14 that John the Baptist was the promised Elijah who was to announce the Messiah's coming. For Christians this cup does not remain untouched. It is shared by everyone at the table in the joy that our hope had come true. The Messiah has come to us and is alive to give our lives eternal joy.


SEDER CEREMONY
The Father or Grandfather is seated at head of the table. The dishes to be served should be located where the father can pass to the family. The youngest son or male asks the same question 5 times, and the father answers explaining why. Here is the question, and the answers.

Why is this night different from all other nights?

On all other nights we eat either leavened bread or matzah.
On this night, only matzah.

On all other nights we eat all kinds of herbs.
On this night, only bitter herbs.

On all other nights we do not dip even once.
On this night, we dip twice.

On all other nights we eat either sitting up or reclining.
On this night we all recline.

On all other nights we eat in any ordinary way.
On this night we dine in special ceremony.

That's not how I heard it.

Passover is not a weeklong celebration. It lasts 8 days.

The "roast lamb" is just a shankbone and need not be from a lamb although that's traditional. The meal need not be lamb and I've never seen lamb served. This may be an issue of Ashkenazi (how I was brought up) vs. Sephardic tradition.

The roasted egg does not represent the destruction of the Temple. It represents rebirth and the beginning of Spring.

The charoseth is made several ways. Generally it's chopped fruit and nuts, with wine. The idea is for it to look like bricks and mortar. I've never seen it made with almonds.

The salt water is not representative of the Red Sea; it's for the tears our forefathers shed while enslaved.

It's Karpas, not Karpar. We dip it into the salt water. That's the first dipping. The second dipping is charoseth into maror.

The wine and the plagues - when the plagues are mentioned, we don't sip the wine, we put a drop on our plates for each plague. We drink 4 cups of wine but the mentioning of the plagues is not one of those times.

We set out a cup for Elijah and also open the door for him at a point in the celebration.

It's not necessarily the youngest son who asks the Four Questions; it's the youngest person present. I asked the Four Questions for many years, until my cousins could do it. And if I'm at a seder where I'm the youngest (hey, it could still happen :-D), I would still recite them.

And, there are four questions, plus the lead (why is this night different from all other nights?). They are asked once, not five times. And that last answer you listed, "On all other nights we eat in any ordinary way.
On this night we dine in special ceremony." - I have never heard of that. It's true, but it's never been a part of any of the many seders I've attended.

The entire ceremony revolves around the Four Questions. They are one of the first things done (after handwashing) and then the meal continues with the answers being presented. E. g. this is the bread of affliction, etc.

This might represent a confusion with the story of the four sons: the wise one, the wicked one, the simple one and the one who is not yet old enough to ask a question. The wise one asks for the laws to be explained. The wicked one demands to know what G-d did for you (by mentioning you, he excludes himself and indicated he would not have been led out of Egypt with everyone else). The simple one asks "What is this?" and the one who cannot ask has everything explained to him because he can't yet speak.

My favourite seders are the ones where it is not necessary to sing endless choruses of 'Daiyenu'.

Ditto jes.

I am christian I guess but it was the passover week and meal. The acting out the story of the Jews that I found so peaceful.

Being able to survive, taking the bitter and the sweet, surviving. That is what I mean.

In addition, I love the Jewish funeral traditions, the prayers and the gathering every year in rememberence. What is that called Jes?

Joanne, I believe that is Yartzeit, but Jes can correct me if I'm wrong.

Thanks cav, I find it to be a beautiful thing. And a realistic way of dealing with the death and loss of a love one.

jespah
Thanks for setting me straight on that info.

Actually Jespah, I catered a Sefardic seder once, and the menu was much closer to North African cuisine, and far removed from what Ashkenazis consider the traditional seder. They also served rice. As well, the youngest person, rather than the youngest son, is a modern adaptation. Back in the days, everything surrounding Jewish ceremony was patriarchal, except maybe the Mikvah. I've seen some haroset recipes with almonds, but I'm not even sure if ours had any nuts in it this year. I guess the preparations vary considerably. I am curious about the egg...it could very well be that in ancient times, the roasted egg did represent the mourning of the destruction of the temple, and also hope for it's rebuilding, which has always been a central tenet of Jewish faith, in terms of a spiritual "rebirth." Perhaps the meaning changed over the years to be more "user-friendly", but I grew up on the rebirth/spring story as well. Mind you, if the eggs are overdone and sulphurous, everyone around the table ends up being reminded of the gassings during the Holocaust, and believe me, we all weep and moan at that point, although the tears may not necessarily be a by-product of grief...just nature.

Actually, Cav and all. The only thing that I have to lend is my ears, but I thought this bit of info was appropo:




Moses' Red Sea Miracle Proven True?
This is what the book of Exodus says about the parting of the Red Sea:
"And Moses stretched out his hand over the sea; and the Lord caused the sea to go back by a strong east wind all that night, and made the sea dry land, and the waters were divided. And the children of Israel went into the midst of the sea upon dry ground: the waters were a wall unto them on their right hand, and on their left."
Two mathematicians--one from St. Petersburg, Russia and the other from Hamburg, Germany--have concluded that the biblical story of Moses parting the rushing waters of the Red Sea so 600,000 Jews could escape slavery by the Egyptians was possible scientifically and in concurrence with the laws of physics, reports Russia's St. Petersburg Times.

Another part of the Old Testament was recently proven true. Find out more!

Using a system of differential equations, Naum Volzinger, a senior researcher at St. Petersburg's Institute of Oceanology, and his Hamburg-based colleague Alexei Androsov established the conditions under which the waves might have parted. Here's the mathematics behind the miracle: There is a reef in the Red Sea exactly at the documented spot where the Jews escaped Egypt. In ancient times, the reef was unbroken and much closer to the surface of the sea than it is today. The Bible story cites the "strong east wind that blew all that night." So mathematically, the two scientists considered wind speed, the strength of the storm that would leave the reef high and dry at low tide, how long before the waters returned, and how quickly they returned. Volzinger, who specializes in ocean phenomena, flooding, and tidal waves, calculated that the wind had to have blown at a sustained speed of 67 miles per hour to make the reef. Once the reef formed, he told the St. Petersburg Times, "It would take the Jews--there were 600,000 of them--four hours to cross the 4.2-mile reef that runs from one coast to another. Then, in half an hour, the waters would come back."

This is very surprising! Guess who doesn't believe in God?

The story says that when the Egyptian army followed them into the Red Sea, they drowned. "I am convinced that God rules the Earth through the laws of physics," he said. The study, which took almost six months to complete is titled "Modeling of the Hydrodynamic Situation During the Exodus" and has been published in the Bulletin of the Russian Academy of Sciences. Mark Grubarg, the head of the Jewish community in St. Petersburg, said the spiritual value of this miracle is immense for Jews.

Was this a celestial vision and sign from God or just a rare astronomical event? Either way, find out the fascinating story of how a meteor forever changed the history of Christianity.

I'll need to find out more about the meteor that changed the history of Christianity.

Yep, it's Yartzeit (what Joanne is referring to).

I think what you were citing, husker, was probably Sephardic tradition in some areas - but the Four Questions are the Four Questions; that's in the Haggadah (the book we read) and isn't tradition-based. Yeah, the youngest person rather than youngest son thing is probably a more recent tradition. Certainly it's been going on at least since the '60s.

I still have the Four Qs in my head; I recited them well into my 20s as my closest younger cousin is 9 years younger than me and, of course, if we didn't have our seder with her, I'd end up doing the questions yet again. :-D

I recall one year my uncle brought raw horseradish root instead of prepared horseradish. Very, very strong! And we also used to drink Slivovitz - just a shot - at the end of the meal. Slivovitz is Polish plum wine and it is VERY strong. The first year I had some, I was 18, and I recall the fumes took the eye makeup right off me, I kid you not. I miss that uncle; he was usually the one who'd conduct the seder, as he was older than my Dad and he (my uncle) had been brought up in an Orthodox home. It was from him that I learned the song "Echad Meyodeyah" - cav, do you know that one? I don't recall all the verses but the meaning is: "do you know one? I know one. One is our G-d in heaven and on earth. Who knows two? I know two. Two are the tablets that Moses brought down. One is our G-d in heaven and on earth..." It goes on until you hit 13, which is of course the years of the Bar Mitzvah.

This should make you all laugh. At my first pass over Seder I asked for seconds on the first course, the soup, hmm. Every one said maybe I might want to re-think that decision but no I loved that soup had to have more. Innocence is so well, so innocent. I managed to eat everything, as it was a long evening. But learned to eat moderately until dessert.

The family that hosted had fun with me and I them. The best part was the learning experience and the learning of ancient traditions. Tovah's dad was a professor at U. Delaware, so he was a great teacher and so kind to me. They invited me every year from 1986-1995..

They also included me in the Yartzeit they loved that I loved it. Thank you for the name jes.

At one point I thought I would like to convert. But alas I do not have a Jewish mother. So I stayed and attendee.

Another great thing I did with the family is to attend a seminar at the Jewish Community Center in Rockville, MD, about Caesarea; it lasted for three days, and was the best. Geologists, archeologists, historians, art historians, and Josephus scholar's one of the more interesting events in my life.