Borders Books: A painful time to be a megabookstore

@Linkat,

Linkat wrote:

Guess people on the North Shore don't read as much as us on the South Shore.

We're just more efficient 'cause we can do it without moving our lips.
So there.

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It looks like the Borders closest to us will be closing. I can't say I'm surprised. It's a bit out of the way, especially compared to the centrally located B&N. B&N does well here - it's the local hangout for the high school kids as well as being the local recorded music and video store.

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@djjd62,

djjd62 wrote:

i've bought hundreds of books by simply seeing a title on the spine and pulling it off the shelf and reading the cover blurbs, way harder to do on amazon, you can read the blurbs, but the browsing is not the same, most book store websites are great if you know what you're looking for

That's how I feel. Browsing and hanging out in book stores is fun, but if I know exactly what I want then I love the convenience of finding it and ordering/downloading online without having to get in the car, drive both ways and, if it's a gift for someone, come home, wrap it and then drive to the post office to mail it. Right now we have the best of both worlds -- too bad it might not stay that way.

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@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

Browsing is an aimless wander through a section , thus enabling me to decide which of a title in a subject are the better. I dont see how AMAzon can do that without wasting my time. "Looking inside" is a limited p[eek, while one of the things I always review in a live book is the resources listed and theindex, as well as the chapters and some of the content.

There were lots of books that came out after a 2005 court case involving the 1st amendment in Dover Pa. There were at least 15 books that came out within several months of the trail decision. Most pf the crappy ones were those that gave a huge page count to the written decision. A complete waste of paper, but yet , it was featured AMAzon book that had that section
"People who bought book A were also interested in Books "B through X" I was being marketed as some schlemeiel who couldnt decide for himself? I compared the books and unfortunately got screwed with an AMazon "pick". I later found what I needed by browsing a University book store.

That's my exact definition for browsing and my love for book stores as well as the massive titanic bookstores of Barnes and Nobles and such.

And Amazon's AI related book suggestions are like Netflix's suggestions. Not very convincing and often completely wrong in their direction.

The same can be said of the online Amazon user reviews (every kind ~ books et al). I have to take them with a grain of salt. They tend to employ a tad too much hyperbole. Either a book is reviewed because the reviewer hates it or loves it.

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@PUNKEY,

I feel that way about the Sunday paper.

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@tsarstepan,

Quote:

And Amazon's AI related book suggestions are like Netflix's suggestions. Not very convincing and often completely wrong in their direction.

In my day job, we use the word "FABRIC" to describe the lineations and internal lines and layers in a rock. The word is standard useage to geologists and is covered within several standard classic texts. I once posted a "Browse" into Amazon wherein I put the name "ROCK FABRIC" to start a search fro structure and sedimentology books. Well, you can guess what I got back. I got everything from a few geology texts but mostly the word "FABRIC" was taken as the object. I got books and books of knitting, sewing, quilts etc.
Really pissed me off. THE only reason Id use AMAZON is if I know the exact book I want. I would probably save some money if I place a big enough order and get the free shipping.
Quilts, riiiight.

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@farmerman,

I think weve come up with a new business model for Borders.
A "Browsery" for those of us who like the sport, and then a real online service like an AMAZON wherein you can get the titles you already want.
Doesnt seem to outrageous, and its just a wee tweak of the existing model . I know theyve been trying "Catch up" and what they need there is to actually get some geeks on board who can listen to the model and convert it to reality.

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I dont see how the business model can work now..the CD market is not coming back, the newspaper market is not coming back, the magazine market might come back but not unless the economy gets a whole lot better, and there is a cheaper model for selling books. I can't document but I saw an assertion that the majority of major book buyers have sworn off buying books in brick and mortar stores, they are either on e readers or buy from Amazon because the prices are a whole lot better. Because of labor and rent stores will never be able to sell books for what Amazon can sell them for, and people who buy a lot suffer more when they spend for inflated price tags. We still see people in B&N and Borders but next time you are in take a look at how many are in line to buy, and how many registers are working. You will see the problem immediately.

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@hawkeye10,

I had to wait in line last week at Borders in Chadds Ford and the place was actually one of the bustling stores. I think the loss to box stores is a function of societal changes in the cities where the stores are being cut.
Companies like specialty magazine publishers (NorthLight, Scie AMerican, Journals by Elsevier etc are nopt hurting)

Quote:

the magazine market might come back but not unless the economy gets a whole lot better

You are comparing teh Magazine market based upon Time or SI. The woodworkers worlds and Health , Fishing, WOoden Boat, Watercolor, Pencil Sketching. "Hobby Farm" , In water Fishing, Civil War times, etc are doing great , both print and e.

Im curious. How do you choose a publication to buy? How are you gifted with powers beyond mortal men to see whats out there without a complete waste of time on an e-catalog.?
Im amazed at "Seers" whove neither a clue nor a plan. Meanwhile publishing will go on because we are more literate just by virtue of numbers.

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@farmerman,

Quote:

Magazines’ Newsstand Sales Fall 9.1 Percent
By STEPHANIE CLIFFORD
10:40 Updated with responses from magazines.

Newsstand sales for the 472 consumer titles in the United States measured by the Audit Bureau of Circulations declined 9.1 percent, to 39.3 million, in the last half of 2009 versus the same period a year earlier, the organization reported this morning. That follows an 11.12 percent decline from July through December 2007 compared to July through December 2008.

http://mediadecoder.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/02/08/magazines-newsstand-sales-fall-91-percent/

Unless you want a specialty product AND single copy only buying from Borders is stupid...far too many retailers will offer 10% off cover price for mags...Bottom line Borders is almost certainly selling less than half the dollar volume of mags that they once did, and this will not get better.

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@farmerman,

While I would never intentionally side with Hawkeye on anything, in this case he has a point.

Cutting down trees and turning them into books simply isn't a sustainable practice in the long run. There simply aren't enough trees in the world to satisfy total demand and paper recycling is more expensive than one would think.

What more, the energy required to chop down a tree - process it into paper - ship that paper to the printer - produce all that ink - print the books and bind them - ship them to the warehouse - ship it to the store - then for you to drive to the store to get it? I mean, c'mon. It's an amazing amount of waste. How much gasoline and coal are we talking about here? And every time you want a new book, you repeat it. Why continue such a wasteful and inefficient process?

Reading books on my Ipod or a similar device works great. I browse just fine online or on the device. It's cheap and fast and costs nothing to get me the data. As more and more people in the world become literate and demand for reading material rises, it's just not plausible to assume that we are going to stick with outdated models of content delivery.

I think it'll take longer to shift over than others seem to - a few decades yet - but it's only headed one direction.

Cycloptichorn

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@Cycloptichorn,

I think it's probably going to coexist for quite a while, with printed matter decreasing while electronic reading increases. But I don't think books will go completely by the wayside.

In the 50's and 60's, people imagined that by now we'd all be wearing silver lame bodysuits, for example... we still wear cotton and wool and silk with a lot of waste, but we like it.

I think book have a similar aesthetic appeal that means that people will just like them and want to have them around even if it's not the most efficient way to transmit information.

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@sozobe,

They've already become much more expensive. Paperbacks are 8-10 dollars now!

Cycloptichorn

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@Cycloptichorn,

Quote:

Thu 17 Feb 2011
Magazine industry records total sales increase of four per cent
Media / UK
The demand for magazines is increasing according to figures released today by the Audit Bureau of Circulations (ABC).

Circulation figures for ABC-audited titles between July and December 2010 increased by 4 per cent from the same period in 2009, and also rose by 3.3 per cent on the first half of 2010.

The woman’s magazine market grew by 9.2 per cent year-on-year, with cookery and kitchen seeing the most notable rise of 36 per cent, while lifestyle and fashion grew by 6.7 per cent.

Leisure magazines increased by 7.9 per cent, while the TV listings marketing grew by 0.4 per cent.

Current affairs titles also saw a 4.9 per cent improvement in sales.

Barry McIlheney, CEO of the PPA, commented: “These very positive ABC results are further evidence of the continued strength of the medium of magazines at a time when many brands are expanding their reach by engaging with audiences on various platforms, from websites and apps to live events.”

from the "Drum"

Specialty mags have been standing pretty stable for a while. The economy made everything sink.
Magazines , unlike newspapers, dont really have an alternative delivery system and ceratin ones are actually not compatible with sitting at a keyboard or into an I pad.

A lot of this is just preference and I prefer the feel of page turning and marking passages for easy ref.
I also like the ability to browse in other fields of lit ,which hasnt been shown to have an equivalent e-option IMHO.

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@farmerman,

Sure, I'm not against anyone's opinions about what is superior or not. I'm just looking at the reality of what goes into producing a magazine or book to hold in your hand, and projecting that:

1, the costs associated with doing this are going to continue to rise until they become prohibitively expensive, and

2, the technology to read this stuff electronically will become better and better, and less expensive.

That says to me that the market is headed one direction and one direction only. You'll probably still be able to GET things on paper for a long, long time; but the price will keep on rising.

Cycloptichorn

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@farmerman,

And where are you going to get all the pictures that you need to "cut from a magazine" for the little kiddies projects. We recently had to find pictures of different types of plants cut from a magazine.

1 Reply

@Linkat,

Linkat wrote:

And where are you going to get all the pictures that you need to "cut from a magazine" for the little kiddies projects. We recently had to find pictures of different types of plants cut from a magazine.

Print 'em out from Google Images. Easier even.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

I still havent been answered the simple question"How do I browse at Amazon unless I know beforehand what the title is that Im looking for?"

1 Reply

@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

I still havent been answered the simple question"How do I browse at Amazon unless I know beforehand what the title is that Im looking for?"

Whenever I want to know answers like this, I always just type the question into Google. I just cut and paste your question right into Google. And here's what I found -

http://zoomii.com/#

Ain't perfect but looks interesting. Taking a design like this to the next level could allow you to do exactly what you are talking about.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

But we are supposed to cut them out from a magazine. I want my daughter to an A don't I?

1 Reply

Borders Books: A painful time to be a megabookstore

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