Talented but not gifted child?

Hello, doctormom.

I have several friends named as retarded in the elementary years, who turned out to be brilliant people, and several with star circles around their heads, who had tough lives. You seem very preoccupied with all this. Better to grow a wise child, than a tracked unit.

'Gifted' isn't all that it's cracked up to be. I was labeled Gifted as a child and went to a special elementary and middle school; I was just as bored there as I was in the schools I was at before, and some of the kids who were also there wouldn't know **** if they had a mouthful.

The best I could say is that we had some pretty good math classes, otherwise, it was slow stuff. No real change from the structure of regular schooling, which is what a gifted child really needs.

Cycloptichorn

If your son did well in a Montessori school before, and you've found another one you like, which you feel will provide a stimulating atmosphere for him, what is your hesitancy about enrolling him there? Why did you take him out of the first Montessori school?

Will it be disruptive to him socially to move him to a new Montessori school? Does he have friends in his current public school he might not want to leave?

Have you taken your son to visit the new Montessori school? If so, did he seem to like it? If not, perhaps you should take him to visit the school, and include him in your decision.

AP classes in public schools have routines and structure, with limited freedom of choice. The academic work is presented on a higher level, and, in that sense, it is more challenging. But the format isn't significantly different than it is in the regular classes.

I don't think it might be good to keep moving your son around to different school environments over the long haul. If I understand you correctly, it sounds like he's been moved around quite a bit--public school, Montessori, home schooling. That might make it difficult for him because he's always adapting to different learning situations, different routines, and different social environments connected with school. Choose what you think is the best learning environment for him, and then try to keep him in it, at least for several years. Help him learn how to cope with boredom, it's something he'll need to know, no matter what kind of situation he's in, because one can't always have complete freedom of choice to alter the external situation.

Osso, Hello , how are you?
I am preoccupied yes. I work and stay away from them a considerable amount of time. If it wasnt for their upbringing I would not be away from my family and culture.
The best investment in my mind is in their education. I would give up a nicer car, house or other amenities to give them the best possible education.
I want to raise a wise child, not track oriented at all. At the same time I feel he should remember school as a fun, nurturing, motivating experience not a place where he was trying not to appear smart all the time. I am so happy you responded and I got to reflect on my thought process, thanks.

Thanks, your response helped more than you know. I was very saddened when he did not qualify for gifted. Since he was about two, friends , teachers etc. have mentioned that he should be in a gifted program. That's what put the whole idea in my mind.
He defies the structure of Public education. I did too. Being asked to sit in a seat and do what everyone else is doing is like death for me. Also public schools force conformity and I like to nurture independent thinking and individuality. He has been asked too many times not to question .
I am not making the Public system wrong. Public education has to help all children. It may not be optimal for the ones at the ends of spectrum.
So thanks for letting me know that gifted program wouldnt be the answer. That relieved me!

Thanks firefly, I am not hesitating. Just want to make sure I am making an informed decision. We have moved geographically so many times for career reasons and then because of the Economy. So he moved by default. The last time we moved it was because we were unable to sell our big house in South Florida. At that time I couldnt think of a montessori school in the area. Homeschooling was something I wanted to try because I had never spent time with my kids before and my daughter (4 at the time was asking for it.) I remeber it as a happy time, kids were calm, healthy and I wasnt as stressed. I might have continued but my husband didnt like the idea and I chose to give that up.
I also gave up my big house and leased it to create some extra income. Then we decided to experience the best public school in the area ( for the first time)by renting a house with intention of buying in that neighborhood if the system worked for us. My daughter did well. My son didnt. Also with the economy I cant afford to sit at home anymore as my husbands income declined and he stresses over me not working. So I think if I work and dont spend as much time with them, one of the ways to relieve my guilt is to give them the best possible education.
I visited the school , then he did. He was thrilled. In one day he learned Calligraphy, learned how to make paper from scrap. Did division which he did not do in the whole fourth grade of public school ( that one beats me) and loved the kids. He has friends in the neighborhood , he still want to go to the montessori school though.
So we are planning to move again. This time for the right reasons I hope! I will be driving him, making lunches and paying the tuition but if it is the right education for him , it will be worth it.
Thanks for your input on the AP classes.
Tell me what you think and did I answer all your questions because I tend to go off on a tangent a lot!

Hi DrMom-
You answered all of my questions, and I think you also answered your own. You know the Montessori school is a good choice for your son, and it's wonderful that he was thrilled with it too. It sounds as though you are making a very informed decision.

I agree with you about the importance of a good education, and I admire your willingness to make sacrifices in order to give your children the best opportunities to develop. You sound like a great mom.

When my nephew was young he attended a Montessori school for two years and he really flourished there. They do stimulate creativity and individuality at Montessori, and I think they provide a wonderful educational environment. I was quite upset when my brother took my nephew out of his Montessori school and put him in a rather second rate private religious school. My nephew never again was as socially outgoing, nor as genuinely excited about learning as he had been at Montessori, although he continued to do well academically throughout the rest of his school years. I do think that Montessori is able to ignite a certain spark in children, that even the best public schools cannot always do, even in their gifted classes.

You sound as though things have been somewhat stressful for your whole family the past few years. Moving around so much definitely isn't easy for anyone--all that packing and unpacking, ugh. I hope that when your son is settled in his new Montessori school it will be one less thing for you to be concerned about. I'm sure he'll be happy there, and will make very good academic progress, and I know that will mean a lot to you. I wish you both a lot of good luck.

I had a friend with similar interests for her children as you. Dr. mom - at least when you and I started to talk. I don't post to be mean to you, but I worry about the perfection pressure that goes to the children. As far as I know, the children of my friend may both have become concert pianists and violinists. Did they become satisfied well rounded women?


I like your last sentence.

You , mean .... never. When I joined A2k, it was a very difficult time in my life and you provided so much strength and reassurance to me. I will always be grateful. ( saying this I just started missing Noddy.. tears)
I insist they follow their passion, would I be happy if they became pianists or decided to not choose any specific profession? I am not sure. I have gotten to the point that when he asks me " Mom, what do you want me to be when I grow up?" I reply " Someone who knows what he wants to be?"

Thanks firefly. I am passionate about education in general and about my children in particular. I don't agree with religious based education. Maria Montessori said" Be Good ( for the sake of being good) not for heaven or Hell"
You validated me which is more than what I was looking for Thnks.

Hi Dr. Mom,

To answer more generally for others who might be reading, my daughter, who is in a public school, absolutely adores the gifted programs that she is in. There seem to be two components: one is the challenge of the programs themselves (one focuses on math and problem solving/ critical thinking, the other one focuses on reading); another is the social element of hanging out with kids who have similar interests but aren't in her classroom. She gets some blowback about being smart amongst her regular classroom peer group and enjoys being able to just relax and let her smartie flag fly in the gifted classes without worrying about being "braggy" or making anyone else feel bad.

So, all of that said, yes it sounds like the Montessori school would be a good fit for your son. I very much agree with Firefly that all of this moving around might have been tough on him so I hope that the Montessori school is indeed a good fit and that he can stay for a while. Will you be moving his sister there too, or would she stay in the public school where she has been doing well?

Thanks for giving us more input into Gifted programs. I am really happy that both of you are happy with the gifted program. I would be too if my child was happy.Many of my friends who have kids in these programs like them. When we lived in NE Florida , where he was tested, the criteria wa 120 which he missed by a couple of points, so they wanted to retest him in 6 months. Here in South Florida the cutoff is 130. So I didnt retest him because IQ does not change that much after 7.If it depends on the number of children and the number of spots and the budget allocated towards it makes me uncomfortable that a child attending a gifted program in one place wont be eligible in another place and then how about the one with 128? Again I am not making it wrong. I understand they have to cut it off somewhere.
My daughter... I am still thinking. I plan on testing her privately. The psychologist who tested my son suggested that I test her before she is six. If she qualifies It will be a tough choice then. Gifted may solve the academic challenge issue but what about other concerns like the conformity, Standardized testing, having to be in a seat all day long, and not having any say in what work you do? I looked up the school where we are moving , it has a great rating of 10/10 on great schools website. Most parent concerns are based on a strong emphasis on standardized testing, teaching to the test and kids not being allowed to speak all day.
Her teacher is amazing. She started teaching the year I was born. She put one of her kids through public system and the other she moved in highschool to a very expensive private school. She says the only regret she has, is not moving him earlier. She says if nothing else student teacher ratio alone is a big convincing reason. In my daughters class of 23 students there is no assistant. Luckily, this is a very affluent area and most moms dont work. There is a mom in the class each day. But some classes dont have that. A lot of moms who are on PTA told me their kids sometimes for two consecutive years didnt have good teachers.
I would say you are a very involved, intelligent and proactive parent as much as I know, but also you have been lucky. So I am really happy for you. I told my husband that I would stay in Public schools if I could stay home, but if I work, I choose , where they go to school. So we both got something out of it. Lets see what the future holds for us, will keep you posted.

I'm not sure the IQ thing is that immutable, any sort of test is going to be suspect I think. I have no idea what my daughter's IQ is, the "gifted" classification is based on how she did on standardized tests. And I know that she has her bad days and good days in terms of taking tests.

The Montessori school sounds really good! I definitely don't make the argument that all public schools are great and that everyone should be in a public school no matter what. I do know that we're lucky, and she's only in third grade so things could still go south (knock on wood).

From what I know , it also depends on the number of spots. Lets say a school district decides to implement a gifted cutoff of an IQ of 120. If there arent that many to fill that class they will take kids will 119 then 118 until they have enough. On standardized testing he was above 90th percentile, but then again most public schools start testing in third grade don't they. Did she just get in?

You would think all the moving might have had an undesirable effect. May be but one good thing is , he got really good at adapting to different set of people and making friends.
One thing is certain, whenever I need help A2K really helps. It's addicting though!

And she will do very well because she has you to make the best of everything. Even if she gets a bad teacher one year there is something to be learned there. How to deal with difficult people, right?
As long as you have the luxury of staying home with her, its all good. When I used to practice, I was envious of all those patients who would trickle in with their kids after school time and talk about what they are going to do next.... not a good feeling.
All the best.