7
   

There is no Wisdom in Crowds

 
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 24 Aug, 2008 06:27 pm
@Robert Gentel,
which begs the question, if the consensus is a poor product (ie the conventional wisdom is often wrong) then why own a site that artificially empowers the majority, enabling them to silence the minority to a greater degree than was possible at the old a2k, or than would be possible in a real life group?

CV wisdom is usually wrong, those who seek the truth understand this going in, thus they give very little standing to popularity. Logic, reason, and the ability of the argument to convince is what is paid attention to.

Robert Gentel
 
  2  
Reply Sun 24 Aug, 2008 06:29 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

which begs the question, if the consensus is a poor product (ie the conventional wisdom is often wrong) then why own a site that artificially empowers the majority, enabling them to silence the minority to a greater degree than was possible at the old a2k, or than would be possible in a real life group?


Ask someone who owns such a site. Or just go on repeating yourself, but either way I don't see any profit in repeating myself each time you choose to do so.

Incidentally, you are using "begs the question" incorrectly.
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 26 Aug, 2008 03:56 pm
@hawkeye10,
why own a site that artificially empowers the majority, enabling them to silence the minority to a greater degree than was possible at the old a2k, or than would be possible in a real life group?

I give a misty answer with the following quote which I presume is befitting.

IF I WERE to give a summary of the tendency of our times, I would say, Quantity. The multitude, the mass spirit, dominates everywhere, destroying quality. Our entire life--production, politics, and education--rests on quantity, on numbers. The worker who once took pride in the thoroughness and quality of his work, has been replaced by brainless, incompetent automatons, who turn out enormous quantities of things, valueless to themselves, and generally injurious to the rest of mankind. Thus quantity, instead of adding to life's comforts and peace, has merely increased man's burden.

In politics, naught but quantity counts. In proportion to its increase, however, principles, ideals, justice, and uprightness are completely swamped by the array of numbers. In the struggle for supremacy the various political parties outdo each other in trickery, deceit, cunning, and shady machinations, confident that the one who succeeds is sure to be hailed by the majority as the victor. That is the only god,--Success. As to what expense, what terrible cost to character, is of no moment. We have not far to go in search of proof to verify this sad fact.

Never before did the corruption, the complete rottenness of our government stand so thoroughly exposed; never before were the American people brought face to face with the Judas nature of that political body, which has claimed for years to be absolutely beyond reproach, as the mainstay of our institutions, the true protector of the rights and liberties of the people.

Yet when the crimes of that party became so brazen that even the blind could see them, it needed but to muster up its minions, and its supremacy was assured. Thus the very victims, duped, betrayed, outraged a hundred times, decided, not against, but in favor of the victor. Bewildered, the few asked how could the majority betray the traditions of American liberty? Where was its judgment, its reasoning capacity? That is just it, the majority cannot reason; it has no judgment. Lacking utterly in originality and moral courage, the majority has always placed its destiny in the hands of others. Incapable of standing responsibilities, it has followed its leaders even unto destruction. Dr. Stockman was right: "The most dangerous enemies of truth and justice in our midst are the compact majorities, the damned compact majority."
http://sunsite3.berkeley.edu/Goldman/Writings/Anarchism/minorities.html
The about quote is from MINORITIES VERSUS MAJORITIES
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Aug, 2008 04:40 pm
@Ramafuchs,
when trying to earn a living from web communities quantity counts, as in hits, unique users and so on. Unfortunately for the owner of a2k I think many users are at a2k for the quality of the discussions and of the quality and diversity of the people who populate the community that has grown up around a2k. His agenda and self interest is at odds with many of ours.

I would have rather a2k be allowed to be the smallish elite forum based community that it had become, that it would not have been revisioned as the vehicle for a grandiose internet space . I think that the old a2k was under appreciated by the one who mattered the most. But then I am the same person who boycotted walmart for a decade because i hate everything that they stand for, but I do spend money there now.....maybe in time I will find something to like about the new a2k.

Ramafuchs
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 26 Aug, 2008 04:46 pm
@hawkeye10,
I uphold both quantity and quality sir.
But there sould also be a funny poster like me to make this forum vivid and lively.
Nothing more
nothing less
and Nothing else.
My heart is with you all( though I sound too critical- sorry)
0 Replies
 
Nick Ashley
 
  3  
Reply Tue 26 Aug, 2008 05:09 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
I think that the old a2k was under appreciated by the one who mattered the most.


I don't believe I've ever heard a statement further from the truth.
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 26 Aug, 2008 06:12 pm
@hawkeye10,
Aside from the subject of this thread sir
I beg your pardon once again.
In the title there are two words.
One is crowd and the other is wisdom.
While I type my fauty English there are 349 people online.
Why the hell the crowd shout with silence while the regular wise people are shouting?
Ramafuchs
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 26 Aug, 2008 08:12 pm
@Ramafuchs,
Wisdom stands at the turn in the road
and calls upon us publicly,
but we consider it false and despise its adherents.
Kahlil Gibran
0 Replies
 
GeneralTsao
 
  1  
Reply Thu 16 Jul, 2009 08:54 am
@ebrown p,
(and it is a crowd mentality that still attacks Darwin).

I might add that it is also crowd mentality which still *supports* Darwin.
0 Replies
 
GeneralTsao
 
  1  
Reply Thu 16 Jul, 2009 09:05 am
@Razrez,
Razrez wrote:

I would think a crowd of people at say a concert is a completely different crowd than you would find on the internet.

I’m sure it didn’t take long even though it seemed like forever, but the people up front starting pushing back. You could literally see the collective wave of force from people vying for room to breathe. Next thing I know there were people pushing through the crowd and screaming that someone had been hurt. People were panicking all around me which definitely ruined the moment for good at that point.


Herein lies the greatest point--crowds are nothing more than individuals. Even though it *seemed* like the entire crowd was surging forward, there were you two, resisting it. I'd assume there were several other level-headed ones in the crowd, too. But the force of the idiots overwhelmed more logical minds.

The majority of people at the concert were being selfish--thinking only of how they wanted to be close to the band, not considering the wider scope, that people could be injured or killed.

This is the case with almost everything. People who think only of themselves don't see the big picture. They are reactionary people who only see their own goals without regard to impact on others.

Then, in your example, the people already up front began feeling the pressure from behind and had to take defensive measures to protect themselves. This is defense, not selfishness.

0 Replies
 
 

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