The Boy Scouts

Rex, the Boy Scouts is a fine organization...and offers young men an opportunity to learn and experience things they might not otherwise be able to obtain. I am proud that I was once a Boy Scout.

Right now, however, the organization is being f****d over by religious nuts who imagine a GOD who is a bigot...and I suspect that some people think the Boy Scouts to be a bigoted organization because of its association with these low lifes.

I was in the Scouts from 1986 to 1991, and came across very little bigotry, other than what is 'normal' for most teenage boys.

There were also very few religious aspects, at least in the 2 troops I was a member of in my time. We went to church on Rememberance Sunday (Armistice Day) and on St George's Day (Patron Saint of England) there was a parade through the town and a church service. At the end of the weekly meetings we said the Lord's Prayer. And that was it. Mostly it was about games, hiking, map-reading, first-aid, camping and fires.

I remember the reference to God in the Scout Promise "...do my duty to God and to the Queen...".

I am interested to hear how it is/was different in the US.

The boy scounts are a very homogonized organnization on the whole - when you look at the demographics of the boy scouts you will see a average houshold income of 75,000 dollars a year and is mostly white and male. This does not lead to the ost diversified opinions on gays or minorities. In fact - they - like the rest of the politically correct world have adopted the "accepting" mantra of 'it's okay and all - just not anywhere near me and my kids.'

This concept has lead this country to the concept that marriage is defined as being between a man and a woman (even though the divorce rate is nearly 1 of 2 first marriages) and two states to hold on to thier segregated schooling system.

Do I think that the Boy Scots are bigoted? No. Do I think thier current structure of people that think all alike with little diversity and a pay check too large to understand lower incomes leads to diverse thinking? No.

However, I think this is a problem with America as a whole (look at the homogonized cabinet of George Bush - they all think the same - like George).

TTF

Scouting in the US must be different from here. I would have guessed that in my troops, the average income would have been nearer $35-40k (after a rough conversion). A true mix from families on benefits (welfare) and some from upper/middle-class white collar families. It was 100% male however and 95% white.

There were no girls allowed when I was there, and I still think that it should be for boys only. Girls can go to Girl Guides if they want.

The area of the country I lived in had only a negligible black population, and a small Asian (Indian, Pakistani) population. The black communities in Britain tend to stick to the cities.

All of which, in a roundabout sort of way, is me saying that I don't think it was bigotted or unrepresentative of the wider community from which the Scouts were drawn.

The scoouts only require a belief in a greater intelligence. Doesn't even need to be a god. Scouts can come from any religion, but one of the Scout laws is that a scout is reverent.

That does not mean that a scout is catholic, protestant, muslim, buddhist, wiccan, whatever, merely reverent.

Homosexuals are even allowed to be scouts and girls can be involved as explorers and venture scouts.

Echoing Franks sentiments, it is a great organization.

McG - I can see that the multi-religion Scout movement has (quite rightly) evolved from its white Christian roots, as Lord Robert Baden-Powell would have disagreed with multi-faith unisex Scouting. I've got "Scouting For Boys" at home, and certain passages make me wonder just what sort of a man Baden-Powell was. I'll dig out and post a few lines tonight.

Times are a lot different now than they were in 1910. The purpose of scouting has also evolved since Powell left Brownsea Island.

I think the Scouting movement had to change with the times, or be left behind. The ideal behind the movement hasn't changed, just its attitudes to membership. I agree with yourself and Frank that it is a worthy organisation with many benefits to youngsters. The only reason I stopped going was because the meetings were on Friday nights and it interfered with my underage drinking, partying and failed attempts at womanising! Lord BP would be turning in his grave...

Although I was at Brownsea Island a couple of times, I've never been in the Boy Scouts .

I (too) think that boy scout organisations here (= in Europe) seem to differ a lot with the US-American organisation.
(I don't think, any military force in [continental] Europe would get the idea to sponsor the Boy Scouts - and Boy Scouts wouldn't like to be sponsored by the military.)

Btw, GD: In 1967 the word "Boy" was dropped from the name of the British organization, and in the 1980s girls were allowed to join at the Cub level and upward.

I was a Boy Scout (of America) in Transatlantic council in Germany for sometime. I attended many world Jamborees and interacted with the local German Boy Scouts on many occasions to do patch trading, competitions etc...

Most troops were sponsored by the local American military. It will be a shame if Transatlantic coucil goes by the wayside because of the latest Pentagon proposal brought on by the ACLU.

I was just thinking about the Scouts this morning - especially their stance on homosexuality and God.

A local man, a Scout leader through the Mormon church, was just sentenced to 22 years in prison for abusing children.

No, not his Scouts - his three foster daughters aged 1 to 9 years old.

Maybe sexuality and Godliness should not be as big a factor as pedophilia in the scout leader checklist....

I didn't realise that Scouting in the US had ties to the military.

What is the general jist of these proposals, McG?

And: do you perhaps remember, which of the four German Boy Scout associations joined? (In the 60's/70's, any of them was generally a "germ cell" of Anti-Vietnam protest, conscientious objectors etc
[Being a boy scout, btw, was later accepted by the courts as reason for being against military duty/conscription.].)

Most were military kids who were stationed overseas with their parents. It doesn't have ties with the military other than that.

And what's this legal battle about re. military bases and units to withhold official support from the Boy Scouts?

Apparently the ACLU has sued the Fed. Govt because some military bases charter BSA troops which is an organization that believes in God. The ACLU believes that crosses the church/state boundary.

The result will be to hurt many young men because they will no longer be able to belong to the Boy Scouts.

Once again the ACLU screws up peoples lives to get to their own ends.

This commentary of yours, McG, is so absurd, I really have trouble accepting that you really mean it.

The purpose of the ACLU is to defend the constitution of the United States.

If they see something they think infringes upon the rights and freedoms of Americans...they take the matter to the courts to let them decide if they are correct or not.

What do you see wrong with that?

And considering the fact that you conservatives have had more than ample opportunity to put judges in place who will give your perspective the best possible consideration...you really don't have a bitch coming.

Get off it.

If the boy scouts have policies to not allow homosexuals to be admitted then it stands to reason that they are a bigoted organization.

The first day I joined the scouts and I was set to meet with the other scouts, the scout leader was "conveniently" out of the room... I was told to go up and meet the other scouts. They were all waiting for me with hands full of crayons... They pelted me with them in my face... they stung, I can still recall how embarrassed I was, I cried. Then the scout leader came in to settle things down... I still think to this day that the scout leader put them up to it. Was this a sort of initiation, a warning or just a bigoted statement to all gay people? I could not imagine that the scouts had concocted this idea themselves.

I was personally persecuted in the boy Scouts when I was a youngster. I was not only persecuted by my fellow scouts but I was ridiculed in front of my troops by the scout master.

One day while on a camping trip my scout master came out in front of the troops in his underwear... he singled me out and told me to leave the formation because I might enjoy seeing him in his underwear too much. It was the other older scouts that were trying to reach their hands down my sleeping bag while I was sleeping not the other way around... It was the scoutmaster's bigotry that brought the rest of the troops to "experiment".

This was at a time in my sexuality when I was not even sure what my own preference was but the assumptions were made and I was singled out.

I never made any sexual advances toward any fellow scout but once the open ridicule was out concerning me this gave the other scouts the open licence to attempt to covertly molest me and do as they pleased. This was not my intention when I joined the scouts.

I was younger than the allowed admittance into the scouts. My mother pulled some string to get me in a year early because my birthday was in February. This experience was one of the most traumatic experiences that I ever endured as a young man.

I was an eager committed scout when I was not being persecuted. I earned many badges (one of my honors was citizenship) and endured the rigors of camping also wilderness survival with the best of my troops.

I think back on the event and I have only negative things to say about the scouts and the leaders. I consider them a completely bigoted and intolerant organization and I would suggest that anyone considering putting their sons in this organization think twice. There are other private camps that you can enroll your children in. Places where their fear of others who do not fit the square peg mold are not persecuted. This forces children to take sides even when they are undecided.

Thank you for sharing your experience RexReed.

Those guys were complete a**hole jerks.

I hope those boys grew up to be much more tolerant than they were "led" to be by the scout master.