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Which One's hotter in bright sunlight-Dark Granite or light-coloured limestone

 
 
Reply Fri 25 Nov, 2016 01:16 pm
I've come across a statement in a textbook stating "Light coloured rock, like limestone, is a poor conductor, so heating is confined to the surface, giving very high rock surface temperatures in hot deserts in daytime." It then goes on to say that darker granite, absorbs the radiation, conducts it downwards into the soil and thus results in lower surface temperatures. This statement seems odd to me as i know that darker objects both absorb and emit more radiation, and thus i would expect the darker granite to emit more heat and therefore have a higher surface temperature. In contrast, the lighter limestone would reflect the radiation keeping the rock cooler. Similar to how a matte black car in sunlight will be hotter to the touch than a white car. Also, granite has a lower specific heat capacity and thus would take less energy to heat it up would it not? So my question is which is right: Is the granite cooler because it conducts the absorbed heat quickly into the soil below, or is it hotter due to its black colour absorbing and emitting more of the radiation, rather then reflecting it?
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Type: Question • Score: 3 • Views: 1,321 • Replies: 10
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layman
 
  0  
Reply Fri 25 Nov, 2016 01:25 pm
@Callum8907,
Someone here might have a considered, informed opinion about this. I don't. But the textbook explanation at least "sounds" legit. Chances are the claim wouldn't have gotten past the editors if there wasn't a solid basis for it.

But, if you really want to know, why not get a thermometer and test it?
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cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 25 Nov, 2016 06:21 pm
@Callum8907,
Just guessing, but I believe granite gets hotter than limestone, because limestone is more porous.

You need to ask farmerman. He's an expert geologist.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Nov, 2016 05:07 am
@cicerone imposter,
Its sorta a trick question
1Theres no such thing as a DARK granite. Granite is a rock that has, as its chemical comp , light colored (leukocratic) rocks like quartz and sodium potassium feldspars. The biotite component is actually only about 15% or so.

2 BUT, lets take a dark igneous rock like gabbro or diabase and compare it to a sparry limestone. The limestone would , by its insulation properties and density and porosity, be able to store and release heat in a measurably higher amount than the gabbro. However, the rocks are so variable in density and make up that Id recommend not taking this as any kind of fact and Id ask for some experimental data on different kinds of rocks.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Nov, 2016 05:15 am
@farmerman,
Now wait. I've worked in a number of machine shops that used black granite surface tables as a basis for some measurements. I think they even said black granite on the certification plate.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sat 26 Nov, 2016 05:33 am
@roger,
thats probably just a trade name. They call most all kitchen counter tops "granite" when they really are a dogs breakfast of all kinds of slab rocks.

Im just being fussy . There are about 4 or 5 different main kinds of granites (Alaskites Aplites etc) and all of them are pretty much light colored.The main differences are pink or white feldspars and the sizes of the grains.


farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sat 26 Nov, 2016 05:37 am
@farmerman,
BTW Rog, granite would make a shitty work surface. Its very brittle and not resistant to chemical wrosion. Dark "granite" work tables (they still call em granite) are usually gabbro or diabase or even soapstone which, although slightly softer, are more stable, can take whacking better.

They use em a lot for tombstones since they can take weathering really well.
roger
 
  2  
Reply Sat 26 Nov, 2016 05:55 am
@farmerman,
This is what I meant. http://www.msi-viking.com/Starrett-85028-Superior-Black-18-x-24-x-4-Granite-Surface-Plate-No-Ledge-Grade-AA-_p_23088.html

It's not used as an anvil. It's used with stuff like vernier height gauges for indirect measurements. The value is in their stability and flatness. If you want to whack on one, it's best to have the old resume up to date before you do.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sat 26 Nov, 2016 06:04 am
@roger,
I can state with 40 years of mining behind me. THAT IS DEFINATELY NOT A GRANITE TOP. Its a diabase or even a basalt. Theyre making table tops, not teaching geology fa Chrise sakes. I dont think injecting some mineralogical confusion to the label would help sell the products.

I have no idea what you do on top of that table top(do they use heat?) You usually wont see a pizza stone made out of granite, nor will you see a curling stone.

We call lots of things by names that have nothing to do with what they really are. I give you an example, THE EGG CREAM. There is no egg, nor cream in an egg cream.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Nov, 2016 02:44 pm
@farmerman,
I wasn't questioning your petrology. It's an industry wide term, whatever it is. No, you don't use heat on them anymore than you would use them for anvils. In most shops that use them, they are the most precise things in the shop. Right up there with jo blocks.
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TomTomBinks
 
  1  
Reply Sat 26 Nov, 2016 10:48 pm
@Callum8907,
So there are three factors to consider.
The color, or reflectivity of the surface. (Determines how much light is absorbed and converted to heat)
The thermal conductivity of the material. (How quickly the heat moves through the material)
The density of the material. (How much energy it takes to heat up a given volume of material a given number of degrees)
So, the dark, not very dense rock that had poor conductivity would have the hottest surface temperature.
The light-colored, very dense and good conducting rock would have the coolest surface temperature.
Beyond these extremes, or with specific rock types, I don't know how to proceed.
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